Strong man
whats the best for gain weight "weight gainer or whey protein" i just wanna
have as big as muscular ass like Arnold
(212 replies)
Created 2012-04-17 12:50 by: Buyanbold
by: Yea !
#1
Forum > Counter-Strike > Counter-Strike 1.6 tx :)
2012-04-17 12:52:41
it depends on what you want to work out..you can develop muscular growth or you can become more rip. protein don't make you bigger..they just give you energy to work harder.
2012-04-17 12:54:17
whats your advice i started go to gym 4times in a week
2012-04-17 12:57:41
eggs eggs eggs
2012-04-17 13:00:50
yeah uncooked eggs !
2012-04-17 13:58:40
Cooked eggs are more healthy and more nutrition.

Unboiled eggs can give you an illnes called salmonela, the risk is small, but it can happend
2012-04-17 15:46:19
No they cant if you have a person called grandma and you eat them fresh :D
2012-04-17 16:02:38
:D:D
2012-04-17 17:25:00
i can understand your point about foodborne illnesses, but to say that a cooked egg is 'more nutrition' is completely false
2012-04-19 15:34:42
Sorry I mean proteins
2012-04-19 16:44:10
well what do you want to do ? to work out like a bodybuilder or work out like a powerlifter? do you want strenght and muscle growth or do you want to look good and a bit muscle growth..not that much?
2012-04-17 13:01:37
how about both?
2012-04-17 14:21:05
Proteins build the muscels, so u can train more often without gettin tired, but Kholidrates ( dont know how to spell it ) it ''quicks'' the Muscles, makes u bigger. ( Proteins are harder to gain and harder to loose and Kholidrates quicker to Gain and easier to loose :)
2012-04-18 02:46:06
No.
2012-04-18 11:03:24
3-4 times a week is great
2012-04-17 13:06:21
i am working like a powerlifter..i am going twice a week,working once upper body,once lower body..i am 1.77m , 80 kg of muscle and dunking the ball like crazy..i am a basketball player. but i work out like a lunatic because i need alot of strenght..if u don't do any kind of sports..you could go 4 times a week and develop a 4 days program.. chest , back, legs,shoulders ,biceps ,triceps, abs

Post edited 2012-04-17 13:14:56
2012-04-17 13:13:02
4 years ago I lost 35 kilograms in a very short time with a crazy diet and a shitload of workout and jogging.

my shake was the following:
- 100gram crushed glucose
- 1 uncooked egg
- 100gram curd cheese
- magnesium pill
- vitamin C pill
- 2dl low fat fresh milk

all mixed together. after 5 months I was in a very good shape, could run a lot like in high speed a monster. overall it's a very good starter I think. :)
2012-04-17 14:54:39
oh man good for you. unfortunately i just need gain my weight and i realize that without supplement it will take long time
2012-04-17 15:01:27
you lost 35 kg in 5 months?
2012-04-18 00:12:40
I lost the count after a few months because I felt really good, but I continued to loose weight even after. :) I was over 110kg when I started decided it must change. My lowest weight was around 77kg.

Loosing weight is easy, it just depends on your determination, nothing else.
2012-04-18 00:32:58
by: dn1
#157
loosing weight is indeed easy, I went from 105kg to 87 in about 2 months, all I did is drink lots of water (I didnt drink juices or sodas, just water) and eat a bit more healthier... with just a little exercise... but loosing kilos are the least important thing, eventho I lost so much, my body was still "fat", now Im working out more intense and Im at 83 kg and my body is alot more defined.
2012-04-18 13:41:12
Oke
Here are some facts that helps you understand what you should do:

Protein:protein is building muscles and it is the only thing that does that. No matter how big or what you wanna look like. Protein is the first and the most important thing in ANY kind of sport.
Carbohydrate: energy source. If you do ANY sport or any movement your body will use carbohydrate to get energy.
Fat:fat is necessary for vitamins and hormones but you have to eat really less of it. Your body cannot use it as energy it will put it away immediately as extra weight.

So my advice is to eat 5 or even 6 times a day little doeses! Really important to eat little doeses and never eat too much at the same time. Always drink water little doeses (2-3dl) for every meal.
Breaking down to the whole daily meals you should eat 60% carbohydrate 30% protein and 10% fat. If you do it like this you will be able to gain clear muscle without fat! If you want to gain more weight you should eat more carbohydrate for breakfast and for the second meal but of course in the same way 60%carbs 30% protein 10% fat.. and if you want to gain more muscle you have to keep eating like this with a lot of protein. Keep doing this for minimum 6-8 months and if you want to gain more muscle then you will surely have to take some steroids because you will never grow 45 cm or 46 cm diameter arms without these unhealty things you can believe me thats for sure. Your bdy wont let it happen nobody's body would let it.. Only with steroids and those kind of things.
So if you are lucky you can grow arms from 40 cm to 44 cm (WITHOUT FAT ON YOUR BODY or at least with a really few quantity because if you increase your body weight you will have fat on your arm aswell and you can grow little bigger ones but then you will never have nice abs) but for that you gotta have really good genetics and do the exercises perfectly well. With steroids and those kind of things you can look like arnold or at least similar to him becasue his genetics was awesome! Hope i could help u a bit!
2012-04-17 15:58:58
oh you mean i have to use supplement after 6-8months later why?
i think that weight gainer or whey protein give me carbs and proteins so i`ll be more bigger more fast ofc i`ll as much as can and everything you guys said such as egg, rice ..etc
2012-04-17 16:17:18
You have to use steroids and those kind of things after 6-8 months IF you STILL want to grow more muscle because after that time you will really slowly develope or you won't at all.(it depends on your genetics).
OF COURSE weight gainer and whey protein will give you everything u need and you HAVE to take those things but that is the healty way that you should follow in the rest of your life but after 8 months or a year you will reach your limits and you wont be able to grow muscle or at least very very slowly.
One more piece of advice: you should take weight gainer right after training and whey protein before you go to sleep!
2012-04-17 16:48:24
Steroids?

No.
2012-04-17 17:28:21
Regular guy in the gym will reach his natural maximum really later than in 6-8 months (lack of knowledge) ... I guess you are measuring by your professional experience

I want to ask you about your training approach ... Fullbody, 2+1 splits, lowfrequency split?

I read lot about this and I am on the side of fullbody or 2+1(bot/top of body). I am still curious about your opinion.

Post edited 2012-04-17 18:26:29
2012-04-17 18:25:10
Of course I am thinking the way he trains with a personal trainer, or he does the exercises perfectly well as I mentioned before. Then he can reach his limits in 8 months or a year it really depends on genetics.
Well it really depends on what you wanna do or what you wanna look like. Fullbody training on day 1 u train the top of your body and day 2 you train the bottom of your body and then you take 1 rest day if i understand it right. If you want to build muscle and develope this is the last thing you wanna do. This kind of train is used for instance if you wanna keep your body fit or maybe if you have reached a given point at your body and you would like to keep it up but this 2+1 training is not for developing fast. If you could write me down how many times you can go to gym i could give some advice if you want to.
2012-04-18 10:45:32
I am looking for fast development and soon(in 2-3weeks) I will be able to train everyday as I am finishing my study.

I tried few things(Top/Bot, Fullbody) in the past and I got used to workouts like:
Day 1 - legs, chest, biceps
Day 2 - back, shoulders, triceps
Day 3 - rest

Anyway I am looking for the best possible way, so I am looking forward to your advice. Thanks

Post edited 2012-04-18 13:27:08
2012-04-18 13:26:34
Oke if you have more time you can develope faster and more effectively of course. So If you could go to gym 5 times a week that would be awesome and believe one day's training will be easier and more effective than you have done it before.
So here it is the brainchild:
Every single exercise has to have 4 series and warming up weights not included!

Monday: Leg (1 exercise on each muscle: front thighs, rear thighs, inner thighs, hip abductors and calves.); Abdominal (abs 1 exercise).
Tuesday: Biceps (3 or 4 exercises); trapezius (traps 2 exercises).
Wednesday: Chest (3 or 4 exercises), obliques and lower abs (1 exercise on each)
Thursday: tricpes (3 or 4 exercises), shoulder (1 exercise on each muscle: rear delts, side delts, front delts)
Friday: Back (4 exercises), abdominal (abs 1 different exercise than monday's one) and lower abs (1 different exercise than wednesday's one)

I did not write a single exercise because it would be pointless. You can go to the gym and ask a personal trainer or an experienced bodybuilder and they can tell you as many exercises as many you need but what they won't be able to tell you or at least just very few of them is how to do the exercises PROPERLY and that is really important. Minimum 50% of personal trainers cannot show the exercises properly. Anyway alwasy be aware of which muscle you are training and try to do it properly if you cant do it properly do it with less weight. I cant help you more through the internet but if you want to ask something you can and if I have time I'll answer you. I am sure I have missed out some things that you are interested in or you won't understand something of what I have written down so just ask if you want to.
2012-04-18 15:56:46
Just a question. I train 3 days per week. Day1 : Shoulders, Chest and Tricebs. First I train Shoulders, to get them rly warmed up and ready for the Chest, couse if u train the Chest wrong, it's easy to injury your Shoulders, and when they are warmed up, I can bench a bit more. And I train Tricebs that they to, couse when you train your Chest, you train the Tricebs as well. Day2 : Back, Bicebsmand lower arm. Day3 I take only legs. What is your opinion about this :)?
2012-04-19 01:01:37
traning 3 days per week is the most common traning form and also one of the best for most of the people. (of course not for contesters).

As far as your daily muscle groups are concerned they are not common although many people use this form. Why most people do not use this form is because when you train your chest your triceps is a serious helper to your chest and it gets tired while you train your chest and when you finish you will start training an already distressed muscle thus you cannot give it as much strain as much you could if it were not tired and as we know more weight make muscle fibers more thick and stronger so you can grow bigger muscle but if you want to increase your muscle's stamina and endurance then it is a perfect way as you do it. Of course you are able to make your muscle bigger this way but not as much as you can do it with the classical way which is chest biceps, back triceps.
And tehre is one more thing, I would recommend that you train your shoulders with your leg because shoulders are little muscles that wont make you so tired while training them and it would be more effective and easier for you to train them on the leg's day so you can have all your days divided up by big-small muscle group like day1 chest(big) biceps(small), day2 back(big) triceps(small), day3 leg(big) shoulders(small).
2012-04-19 13:28:53
HAHAHA dude you gotta stop feeding these guys who actually wants to learn about weighttraining/bodybuilding bullshit..

as long as OP begins with a good nutrition setup and his calories are about 500cal+- over his daily caloric need he will GAIN and aprox the first year he will have "newb" gains (taken he follows up on his training), and after that he will still have good gains as he's bulking up! He will gain approx 1lbs per week (depends on his TDEE and added calories). He will probably need to have periods with cutting, but normally a person can do lean gains for about 1-2 years, esp at young age, before doing a cut down to 8-10%fat, after that he can do lean gains up to 15-16% and cut down again. After a good 5-8 years when he've reached or is close to his "genetic peak", THEN he should think of steroids if he wants to take it to the next level. This all depends on the age as well and his testosterone production, maybe he needs steroids earlier if he got bad testosterone production because of age or other problems. BUT going from natty to steroids is a big leap and shouldn't be considered only after 6-8 months of training. I dont know where you are from because I haven't learned 3rd world country's national flags yet, but if you REALLY are a personal trainer I would rip your license in thousand pieces as you clearly don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Post edited 2012-04-19 17:02:33
2012-04-19 16:56:04
So you are saying that it would take 5-8 years for one to get to his limits. Firstly this is telling me only one thing, that you have no clue about training and eating properly you do not have a clue about technics in training. Secondly I was talking about him (not everybody in a common sens AND DO NOT FUCKIN FORGET HE SAID AT THE VERY TOP OF THE THRED HE WANTS TO BE AS BIG AS ARNOLD). He is 22 years old and has previous years in gym and plus either 8 months or 1 year or more one and a half years later (with professional training AS I MENTIONED) he would reach his limits after that he would grow muscle really slowly (which could hardly be measured), AFTER THAT it would take 1 year for him to get E.G. HALF CM plus on his arm.. Why I said a fairly wide range between 8 months and 1.5 years becase all depends on GENETICS (he may have good testosteron production or not.. it all DEPENDS ON GENETICS) now that is what I call reaching the limits he may gather E.G. 1 cm plus on his arm in 2 or even 3 years.. YES he can struggle for another 3 or 4 years he wont be able to get more than 1 or 1.5 cm on his arm either you believe it or not.. I have experinced it on so many people unlike you and also learned it...
Thirdly gaining up weight and then "cut it down" will do you NO good at all. The clear and best way is to keep your body always fit and gain only clear muscle of course you have no clue neither how to do that I am telling you it is not easy and eating is a vital role in it just like training technics..

Post edited 2012-04-19 18:44:58
2012-04-19 18:39:44
i dont know anything about this kid dude, but after that post he made i just took it as he's some 16 year old who just found out who arnold was and found out he wanted to become him.. that was why i posted what i did. you're taking this way out of proportion and blowing it up without any meaning at all. stop trying to give it, it's just embarrassing for you to try to give it when you have no clue what you're talking about in the first place! i cba to post anymore now as there is no point trying to talk to nolifers on this forum about an IRL activity like working out or nutrition which also is a soar subject for people on here.
2012-04-19 20:27:53
I am absolutely sure about what I am talking BECAUSE I have learned it and mainly I have seen it working. And I have to disagree with you about writing here to people means nothing. It does help them alot. I just helped two guys here how to train because their traning methods was not exactly the best for what they wanna achieve. That is all.
2012-04-20 12:57:25
If you still want to grow after 6-8 month's you need steroids? haha, what a joke.. stop telling him all this bullshit.
2012-04-17 22:25:01
Now listen..
If he trains perfectly well (this means training with a good personal trainer of course) then he can reach his limits in 8 months OR a year maybe a little little more just like I said and if he still wants to grow some muscle, there is no way he can do it without steroids or else unhealty things.. I did not recommend him to take these kind of things and I never will.. I just told him the truth..
2012-04-18 10:59:12
knew you would post :D
2012-04-18 00:29:23
of course i would mate :)
2012-04-18 10:46:57
I read that 20% of your income has to be fat. And no Salt couse it holds on the fat so it wont burn.
2012-04-18 03:42:18
There is nothing set in stone. Salt does not hold onto fat, no idea where you got that from.
2012-04-18 11:05:58
but salt does hold onto water thus your blood perssure is gonna get high..
2012-04-18 11:14:20
True, only if you eat too much. However salt in small doses is good.
2012-04-18 11:17:26
You know jack shit my friend. You dont have to eat 5 or 6 times a day. Breaking down meals to 60/30/10 DOESNT STOP YOU GAINING FAT. Gaining fat is when you eat more calories than you burn. Stop spreading shit. You can gain muscle faster for the first 2 years, it takes ALOT to reach your genetic potential
2012-04-18 10:56:55
hahaha :)
Have you ever heard about metabolism if you have tell me what it is and what it does if you can pass this first quiestion I will ask you an atoher one but if you can pass that one aswell it will be very interesting because you will be in conflict of what you said before.
As far as the genetic potential is concernd you do not know anything about training you do not know anything how you can develope urself in the fastest way.
2012-04-18 11:09:47
Why do i have to answer to you? Go to post #101 and you will see how meal frequency doesnt affect your metabolism, hes layed it out plain and simple.
2012-04-18 11:42:13
So u do not have a clue that's what I expected..
2012-04-18 13:19:55
I have explained it in the other post. Since you cant seem to get your head around basic concepts.
2012-04-18 13:22:37
of course basic concepts :) ofc :D:D:D
2012-04-18 16:10:01
Your body can't use fat as energy? You're joking, right?
2012-04-18 13:18:56
of course it can use fat as energy but when it does it is a very dangerous process and you have to be in a very extreme condition which you will never reach in a gym and you do not even want to.. It is like walking around in a desert without any kind of nutriment for more hours.
2012-04-18 13:26:42
I don't think beta-oxidation is a dangerous process. In fact, it's a totally physiological metabolic pathway and one of the most common ways how your body produces energy. Can you be more specific about why is it dangerous?
2012-04-18 13:41:03
I am not talkin about beta-oxidation. I am talking about energy source that your body uses while doing something (sit, run, lifting weights etc..). Beta-oxidation happens while you are SLPEEING. And yes your body uses fat as energy to regenerate your muscles and build them up only WHILE YOU ARE SLEEPING. All I am saying is that classical myth about fat burning that you use fat as energy while running or doing cardio training is bullshit. If you think you use fat as energy while running or walking etc.. you are very wrong but if you mean beta-oxidation as I mentioned then you are right.
2012-04-18 16:08:57
I don't think I'm wrong. Free fatty acids released from fat are utilised during low-intensity exercises (such as long-distance running). You certainly know that the fat:carbs ratio shifts in favour of fats as the run continues. Look, I don't wanna argue with you because obviously you possess some knowledge on this topic, but in 2 weeks I have an exam from biochemistry (I study general medicine) and I think that I understand a good deal of it. I highly doubt that as a personal trainer you've learned about biochemical pathways that take place during exercise in such detailed as I did.
2012-04-18 16:49:43
Oke I'll list you what I have learned in the school all of them from medical books:

-bones and its structure
-muscle and its structure
-cell and its structure
-joint, heart, lungs
-atp synthesis
-protein synthesis
-energy protocol
-Citric acid cycle
-beta-oxidation
-digestion, enzymes
-protein, carbohydrate, fat
And all of them were presented by video and explaind very deeply. I know this doesen't sound like a personal trainer education but IFBB gives a very thorough and detailed education for its personal trainers.
2012-04-18 17:15:03
great, sounds like something we had to know in order to be admitted to our school. but seriously, I hope you don't want to compare amount of information you gained from your lectures with 2-semester subjects such as biochemistry on our university. I'm sure that it's enough to keep your clients happy, but you would need a lot more than some afternoon powerpoint/video presentations to know what "very deeply" means.
2012-04-18 17:55:48
Look as I mentioned we were taught from medical books that doctors use to pass their exam in university. So what we have learned was very deep and thorough, obviously we did not to learn everything from the book as you do.. but we DID study from medical books of university..
2012-04-18 18:12:49
well you probably did not study hard enough if you claim that your body doesn't burn fat during exercise ;) but I agree on your other thoughts in this thread and I don't want to argue I just have different opinion on this matter
2012-04-18 18:16:36
allright, but i have seen my opinion (which was in medical book) working in real life. I have also mentioned that when your body uses fat as energy is very dangerous and it happens in extreme condition. Here is link to check it for yourself and understand what I was talkin about. It results in ketoacidosis so please do not miss that part that is why it is so dangerous!
Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketone_bodies
2012-04-18 18:31:34
What a bunch of crap...

First of, you can't "grow" without getting fat in the side. If you grow, you get fat. Then you diet it out. That's why there are bulk seasons and diet seasons...

Secondly, 10% of fat is too low. You should get at least 1g/kg of bodyweight not to mess up with the testo rates and shizzle.

And buying supplements is not necessary. It's the same protein as in food and food tastes alot better. Only thing I can recommend is post workout drink with carbs and proteins, for recovery.

2012-04-19 23:10:50
Oke I'll tell you what the truth is because you have no clue about that. (You made me laugh really hard by the way! :))

So first of all we need to clear that there is a HUGE differenc between competitors and avarage people. Why? Because competitros take steroid hormones and protein hormones while avarage people (who we are talkin about) do not. Now then as educated people know steroid hormones eduction from cholesterol thus they need more fat. That is why there is bulk season and diet season because when they go to competition they have to be fat-free water-free and slim as much as they can be and they squeeze out mainly the water and some fat before they go to compete.
As far as avarage people are concerned (who we are talking about in this whole thread..) there is no such thing like that. If there is then that is a totally unnecessary and meningless activity and of course really UNHEALTY. (As we know competing in bodybuilding is one of the unhealtiest thing you can do)
Also as educated people know fat is MAINLY for the usage of vitamins and hormones and avarage people need only between 10% or 15% fat of 100% nutrition of a whole day. You WILL NOT GROW ANY OUNCE muscle with fat but of course you need fat for your hormones and vitamins but getting more fat and then losing it WILL NOT DO YOU ANY GOOD only distress your body which is really unhealty.
Proteins are the main BUILDING BLOCKS OF YOUR MUSCLE and if you want to build muscle protein is what counts the best. Not taking supplements is a really bad advice of yours again...
As educated people know any kind of meat you eat gives you protein BUT protein is built of amino acids. there are 20 amino acids and your body is able to produce only 10 amino acids of any kind of meat. So for better developing you surely have to take supplements and of course their absortion is much much faster than regular food's thus they can get much faster into your muscle.. Builiding muscle has to be step by step and you only have to build muscle nothing else.. that is the healtiest and the most effective way.
Reading some fitness articles won't give you any knowledge about this. They only can drive you in a wrong way..
The things I have written down are not my ideas nor I figured them out.. They are all serious valid and established medical study.
I do not blame you for not knowing these things but I really blame you for trying to tell your bullshit and driving everybody in the wrong way. Please keep your argument for yourself and everybody will be happy.

Post edited 2012-04-20 14:14:22
2012-04-20 14:10:20
this is only partially true, protein is building muscles along with some other things ... weight gainer is mainly carbs, so without working out it will make him fat

For big muscles you need a lot of protein and carbs.

Protein - eggs, cottage cheese, fish, chicken, and all meat, but low-fat meat is better.

Carbs - potatoes(cooked), rice, oatmeal - no musli shit in shop, just pure oatmeal

Add some vegetable and fruit, little bit of olive oil(small spoon daily) and you have perfect nutrition.

If you wanna buy supplements focus on protein, because it is cheaper than natural protein(meat, eggs, etc.)

Another part is training, try to look at fullbody workouts - try this one: http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports..
2012-04-17 13:00:21
Protein is necessary for the building and repair of body tissues.
It produces enzymes, hormones, and other substances the body uses.
It regulates body processes, such as water balancing, transporting nutrients, and making muscles contract.
Protein keeps the body healthy by resisting diseases that are common to malnourished people.
Prevents one from becoming easily fatigued by producing stamina and energy...so they don't build muscle my friend

Post edited 2012-04-17 13:06:41
2012-04-17 13:06:07
read your first sentence mate ...
2012-04-17 13:07:20
i already read that and you clearly wrote is building muscle
2012-04-17 13:10:13
protein is playing amazing role in building muscles ... so i dont get it
2012-04-17 13:11:24
yea, mainly because they give you energy and the "goodies" that your body needs to build muscle..but that's not the PROTEIN that does that.

Post edited 2012-04-17 13:17:45
2012-04-17 13:14:09
no ... protein is playing support role in energy ... carbohydrates and ATP - creatine are responsible for energy

Protein is changed to energy only if carbs are lacking in the body
2012-04-17 13:18:00
+1
2012-04-17 13:21:14
Musle fibers consist of actine and myosine which are proteins as far as I know. You claim that proteins are a source of energy. That's another bullshit. They can be an emergency energy source after your body has depleted carbs and fat. You can say though, that enzymes that play an essential role in ATP synthesis are protein complexes, but then again they are NOT primary and not even secondary substrate for energy metabolism.
2012-04-18 13:35:33
ok just so you know protein is the only thing on this earth that builds muscle nothing else. that romanian guy has absolutely no clue about this. I am an ifbb personal trainer i know what im talkin about so protein is the only thing that build muscle. :)
2012-04-17 15:29:44
Really? I call bullshit. You seem to know jack shit.
2012-04-18 11:06:42
The only thing I noticed in your comments is that you tell everybody that they bullshit this is not how they wrote this is bullshit blabla and bla... I do not see you giving anything but bullshit.. I know this kind of type mate.. You have got some knowledge of these things reading idiotic articles on the internet and thinking you know something. Let me tell u smthing mr. you are the one who knows jack shit about this. Half knowledge is worse than zero if u know what i mean..
2012-04-18 11:30:10
Well i have posted about macros, which is pretty much the base for it. Knugz has also kindly posted peer reviewed scientific journals to disprove what your saying and your arguament is that your going to listen to the big guys. And you say to me that i read 'idiotic articles'? I, like him, read those journals and educate myself on this topic scientifically. So far youve pretty much implied you have to split your protein carbs and fats a certain way otherwise you will get fat. So are you ACTUALLY a IFBB personal trainer?
2012-04-18 11:39:02
First of all you have just prooved what i said (you read idiotic articles) with the "I, like him, read those journals and educate myself on this topic scientifically" sentence. I was absolutely sure about that anyways.
Secondly OF COURSE you have to split protein carbs and fat in a way, imagine you take 60% fat 30% carbs and 10% protein.. what would u look like and how long would u live???? If you disagree with this you are more dumb than i tought.. BUT THIS WAS JUST ONE PART of my sentence the other part was you have to eat 5 or 6 times a day little doses and with these two things you will lose weight. If you also disagree with this you have no clue about this whole thing (which I already noticed long ago)
Thirdly I finished a personal trainer school where they taught me everything very detalied. Of course this would not mean what they taught me was right at all. BUT WHAT they taught me was from medical books and was confirmed by doctors..
Fourthly I have trained many persons already and for many of them I was the only one who could help them lose weight AND keep their body fit (because it is one thing to lose weight and it is an other to keep it)So all in all what I have taught and what I have done are working in practice just as it says in medical books and yes I am an IFBB personal trainer.

Post edited 2012-04-18 12:52:07
2012-04-18 12:50:38
Ok first of all there is a difference between articles in fitness magazines and published medical journals. Also, you seem to be going for weight loss. If my TDEE is at 2500 calories, and i eat a total of 5000 calories split in the way you say i will lose weight. I WILL GAIN WEIGHT NO MATTER HOW ITS SPLIT. When you eat a meal your metabolism rises for a few hours due to the THERMAL EFFECT OF FEEDING. This is not increased by splitting your meals but the TOTAL OF WHAT YOU EAT AND ITS MACROS eg.fat has a larger TEF as there are more calories assosiated with it.
Like i have said before, there is no % split for macros SET IN STONE.
Im sorry but being a PERSONAL TRAINER, does not qualify you on the NUTRITIONAL side of things. Im pretty sure personal trainers arent even allowed to give NUTRITIONAL information to their clients without having a qualification.
Confirmed by doctors? Id rather have it confirmed through clinical trials and then have it replicated by others thanks.
Ive capitalized key words for you.
2012-04-18 13:21:16
DID I MENTIONED CALORIES YOU IDIOT???? OKE I WILL MAKE IT SIMPLIER TO YOU. ALL I WAS SAYING WAS THE FOOD YOU HAVE GOT PER DAY (THE WHOLE FOOD U EAT PER DAY) HAS TO BE SPLIT AROUND 60% CARBS 30% PROTEIN 10% FAT. IT DOESENT MATTER IF YOU TAKE 5000 CALORIES OR 2500 CALORIES YOU MORON IT HAS TO BE SPLIT LIKE THAT. OBVIOUSLY IF YOU TAKE 3000 CALORIES A DAY DOING NOTHING YOU WILL GAIN EXTRA WEIGHT AND IF YOU ARE A TOP WEIGHT-LIFTER IT WILL BE ENOUGH FOR YOU. I WAS NOT TALKIN ABOUT CALORIES BECAUSE IT IS DIFFERENT FOR ANY PEOPLE BUT WHAT IS NOT DIFFERENT IS HOW TO SPLIT YOUR ONE DAY FOOD BECASUE THAT'S THE HEALTY WAY IF YOU TAKE 2500 CALORIES LIKE 60% FAT 30% CARBS AND 10% PROTEIN THEN YOU WOULD DIE IN A REALLY SHORT TIME BECAUSE YOU CANNOT GET THE ESSENTIAL NUTRITON THAT YOUR SYSTEM NEEDS YOU MORON...

Post edited 2012-04-18 16:31:52
2012-04-18 16:28:36
You said if you split it in such a way, you will lose weight no matter what. Also 10% protein in a 2500kcal diet equates to around 62g protein, which is what the government reccomends. It doesnt matter if you have carbs in your diet, your body can synthesis it from other things and theres nothing wrong with 60% fat if theyre not all saturated. So you can get all the essential nutrition.
2012-04-18 19:22:29
I am shocked... you really believe all this bullshit you keep saying? If you took that many fat you would gain so much fatness that the fatty acids would block the cells to pick up insulin which rises your blood-sugar but it is going on and it is getting more exciting because with insulin is blocked fat cell and muscle cell cannot pick up glucose which causes more rise in your blood-sugar that itself is lifethreatening and IF you did not fall into coma or your heart did not stop at this point (one of them would happen for sure) then do not worry becasue there would be a loads of fatty acids releasing from the fat tissue rising fatty acid level in your blood.. now that will surely finsih the job and it would take a lot of doctors to fight for your life where I hope they would fail. That was my last comment to you you scapegrace smartass nobody..

Post edited 2012-04-18 20:26:01
2012-04-18 20:24:39
My bullshit is based on scientific published articles. Take a fucking biology class you ignorant fuck, i can admit when im wrong. You tried to explain it, you do realise that insulin doesnt BLOCK fat cells as you describe. Fat and fatty acids are not the same thing. Im currently studying a biology degree which has several nutritional modules, you however seem to have got your qualification out of a cereal box.
2012-04-19 00:31:19
rofl pipe down indian boy and take a biology class.
2012-04-19 14:09:13
surely you know nothing about this you dumb but what can one expect from a retarded who cannot tell the differnce between hungarian and indian flags..
2012-04-19 18:00:23
bahh i'm not arguing with you anymore as you don't have any/very poor knowledge on this subject, and therefore it's useless for you to come with false accusations/views about training which i then need to correct and counter. its just too much work for me although it is fun to piss on foreigners :)
2012-04-19 20:42:46
water balance = carbohydrates ...
energy = carbs ... even if protein can be changed to energy if needed ... carbs are the main one in this game

Post edited 2012-04-17 13:10:40
2012-04-17 13:09:55
+1323
2012-04-17 13:08:06
tnx for your advice
2012-04-17 14:22:40
a(homeopath)doctor told me that proteins once a week is enough (to live well, not to do musculation). I guess he would say that if you spend a lot of energy you would need more.
And what about vegetal protein?
2012-04-18 13:01:06
protein is not energy(can be, when body is lacking carbohydrates) ... it is all about building and repairing muscle tissue (connected to bodybuilding), but to the point. Protein once a week is crazy, mainly for young growing person, but it is true that if you are not working out you do not need that much protein. Also the older you are the less you need.

Few numbers:
Protein intake requirement for non-sporting person is around 40-60grams daily ...
For a young bodybuilder it is 2-3times more.

Vegetal protein is bad, because its aminoacid spectrum does not include the most necessary parts to build muscles. Only good one is soy.

And to your doctor, I understand his point, because unused protein in the body is quite a dangerous thing, as it goes to liver to be destroyed. (pls anyone correct me if I am wrong)
2012-04-18 13:14:59
not true. Protein, especially whey protein heals up your muscles. When you work out, your muscles get torn. They start growing and becoming bigger when they start healing up. Whey protein help muscles to heal up faster. Without protein, your muscles will take about 3-4 days to heal up, where with protein they heal up in about 1-2 days. Steroids make your muscles heal up in 5-6 hours. That's why people who use steroids are so huge. Of course, protein also gives you energy, but the main purpose of it is to heal your body after working out.
2012-04-17 13:21:47
I agree with you and I want to add few things.

Egg protein is the best and most effective one ... even better than Whey.

"Without protein, your muscles will take about 3-4 days to heal up" and what is more your body will fall into deep catabolism ... which will cost you some muscle too, so this is very stupid approach(not to eat protein).

And to steroids - they suck ... without being heavily educated about them, dont use them, they will hurt you.
2012-04-17 13:29:55
your statement above is not accurate. Protein itself doesn't make you bigger but it helps you (a lot) to develop muscles.

How do you get bigger? : when you flex them, when you "make a muscle" with your biceps, for example?

Muscle cells contain long strands of protein lying next to each other. When you want your muscles to move, your brain signals your nerves to stimulate them. A chemical reaction in your muscles follows, causing the long strands of protein to slide toward and over each other, shortening the length of your muscle cells. When you "make a muscle" and you see your muscle bunch up and bulge, you are actually watching it shorten as the protein strands slide over each other.

When you do challenging muscle-building exercises on a regular basis, the bundles of protein strands inside your muscle cells grow bigger. And that's how your muscles get bigger. It's just that simple.

that being said, you need a lot of protein to recover (at least one gram per pound)

you muscles don't get bigger at the gym, they get bigger when you rest.

Exercise: 25%
Rest: 25%
Nutrition: 25%
Cardio: 25%

I hope this helps you.

Regards from Panama.
2012-04-17 17:03:16
protein doesnt give energy dumbass, carbo hydrates do. Protein is the "1st rule" to build muscle, for example, if you dont consume your weight x 1.2 grams of protein per day you wont get any muscle, or atleast u wont be able to see progress.
2012-04-17 17:08:47
You need:
- horizontal bar
- parallel bars

forget about that chemistry sh*t!
2012-04-17 12:58:36
bebelac ftw
2012-04-17 13:00:11
All is in rest,and food.Go to gym 3-4 times per week.Work about 1hour and 15min.Fast after that drink whey protein,creatin.When you came home eat eggs,meal,potato,protein food not junk.Drink milk,wather (if you use creatin drink about 3-3.5L daily).And sleep 8-10hours (but at night not at day)
This is me after 7 months workout,nothing used just good food.
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/803/cavai.jpg..
Arm is about 40-41cm (182cm 82kg 17years)

Post edited 2012-04-17 13:15:38
2012-04-17 13:13:17
You need to train your shoulders, seems like they aren't there :) - otherwise it's just the bad picture that does it ;)
2012-04-17 13:17:53
i wanna see your bro =)
2012-04-17 13:19:56
his shoulders are fine ... you cannot judge from one pose :)
2012-04-17 13:35:34
Im just post picture becouse lot of people talking about mouscles with no idea some of it never been in jym.So that guy cant joudge about his whey of looking.
2012-04-17 13:54:38
Weight gainer ofc.. but start to eat alot of food instead.. maybe you will struggle at first, but it will begin to work out at some point, no pain no gain.. and then take a protein shake after you have worked out.. i guess you will be working out? :P
2012-04-17 13:15:31
After training your body is lacking glycogen. If you start with protein shake a lot of protein's aminoacids will be wasted on changing to glycogen. That's why it is much better to take some gainer after training and 20-30later add protein shake.
2012-04-17 13:34:24
oh i can`t understand you well can you explain me again. i see that i need to workout every muscle in each day and weight gainer is best to gain my weights and being muscular is that right?
2012-04-17 14:57:41
1. it is good to work out every muscle group in one day ... but you can split it in 2 days like - Day1 - Legs, Chest, Biceps Day2 - Back, Shoulders, Triceps ...

2. from supplements Protein Powder is number 1 ... than you can add weight gainer

Post edited 2012-04-17 15:20:12
2012-04-17 15:18:32
what? u mad? "it is good to work out every muscle group in one day" are you fuking serious? the "perfect", and i say perfect because it suits almost everyone that wants gains all natural, is to do a 3 day split with A-chest;tricep B-Back;bicep;legs C-shoulders;core (abdominal and the other muscle group behind the abs that i dont know how they call it in english.
So this is like the normal workout schedule i and most people use. And please Buyanbold, DONT USE MASS GAINER, you don't need it right now, thats just bullshit the magazines want u guys to buy.
Only buy whey protein (or any other good protein products) when you complete 1 year more or less of workout.
And to finalize, rest rest rest. its the only thing that grows your muscle, is SLEEP, 8 hours MINIMUM and just continue to workout, results dont happen overnight.
2012-04-17 17:17:44
low-frequency split is keeping you away from faster gains ... fullbody workouts are much more effective, because you will train your whole body more often

fullbody workouts are the way used by oldschool bodybuilders and strongmans years before steroids appeared

and about gainer ... you are right partially, but you definitely need some fast carbs after training, like maltodextrin of glucose ... but gainer is really expensive

Post edited 2012-04-17 17:39:04
2012-04-17 17:37:35
low frequency? bodybuilders? strongmans? man i want a good body and low percent of body fat, not to turn to hulk
2012-04-17 17:40:06
you will definitely not turn to Hulk, but you will reach your goals faster with funnier trainings ...

and im quite sure that you dont even know what the lowfrequency stands for

Post edited 2012-04-17 17:47:33
2012-04-17 17:45:59
i dont know everything, or else i wouldnt even coment on this matter. just to say that most "well fit" guys i know use a 3 day split and works wonders, cuz they dont need to hit two times the same muscle in the same week.
2012-04-17 21:14:03
ya ofcourse i`m just get back to my home and so is there anything can i use with weight gainer?
2012-04-17 14:55:18
play dm whole day
2012-04-17 13:38:41
i`ll try eat that dm
2012-04-17 15:03:26
First of all, all depends of your genetic, weight, the speed at which you want to improve your muscles, and review your diet, cause just with one or two products don't do it anything, the diet, and a good rest is paramount.(besides execution of the exercises)
all products bsn (whey protein) Are the best, if you have a money to pay it.
but all whey protein like, "ANIMAL" are so good, but bsn is the best choice.
later you have options like "ANIMAL PAK" that's a mix of differents products (protein, amino acids, antioxidants, creatine, vessel dilator and others that i don't know).
These products are considered the naturals products.
but if you want to improve your muscles so fast and very well like arnold , you must prove "stanozolol" This is a anabolic product (most mild of all) but is a good option because don't generates gynecomastia (http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/core_june_5.htm).
Stanozolol is a good choice in every stages of training (gain muscle volume and define muscles) if you want to be sure of his uses, you must use a hepatic protect.
if you want more info about this subject, just send me a MP.
i hope that serves.
Bye bye, GL and HF.
2012-04-17 15:07:09
bullshit, never recommend it to anyone else who has no background in bodybuilding. I don't say roids are not effective but you MUST have at least 7-8 years of heavy training and be old enough.
Eat healthy alot, train hard and READ, READ and READ.
2012-04-17 15:41:12
that's i explained , the diet and rest is the most sustentabble, but if he want to be like arnold, with just diet and whey protein is totally impossible.
2012-04-17 16:17:59
You're right but most people have no knowledge of how to take roids and they end up screwed. Yeah, the fact is the shortcut to get big and ripped is taking roids but you still can have a good looking body just by training hard and eating healthy.

If you are old enough and aware of all side effects that roids can cause to you then no argue.
2012-04-17 17:36:03
Well,I was doing gym for 4-5 years without any gainers it worked fine,but at some point I realised that I wanna do it much bigger than it was(I mean gain muscle weight) I started with monohydrad of creatine,gainers with protein,moreover I eat also curd after gym.

Monohydrid of creatine gives you tones of energy to spend at gym,so you will take bigger weights and do it more times => Muscules gonna work harder and here you are, pontential grow of muscles will speed up like 2 or 3 times

Protein with gainers - Protein is a thing you need to build muscles and gainers add some random minerals to your body,which are also very important.

BUT: if you will try my way,you have to spend much more time at gym,not like usual 1hour,better 2 hours 4-5 days a week or 3-4 hours 3-4 days a week incase of giving muscles work. If u wont do in that way,you could get_fat :)


UPDATE: if u wanna be like pro body builder u have to use chemical things, with natural protein from cheese,crug,egs etc u wont achieve such a pure effect :) Creatine and protein are effective and they doesn't badly affect your body :)

Post edited 2012-04-17 15:27:14
2012-04-17 15:25:03
oh man i just wanna make some fun as i said i`m skinny 185 -70kg and new to bodybuilding my goal isn`t being bodybuilder all i need is gain weight about 30lb in 6 months
2012-04-17 15:37:59
just tell me what supplement i should take. in some case i am really confusing
2012-04-17 15:39:12
Eat 6 times a day, dont walk much, best way stay at computer for all day dont put your self moving too much and a lot of food... u will see weight gaining maybe even more then 30lbs in half year
2012-04-17 16:54:14
and yes if u do any sport stop doing it for half year
2012-04-17 16:55:52
last most important thing, drink beer about 3 liters a day
2012-04-17 16:58:43
trololololol :D:D
2012-04-18 13:32:22
1 hours is perfect for 4-5 days a week. 2 hours are "good" if you talk with all in the gym, or rest more than 1 minutes or two minutes.
Rest is one minute maximum.
2012-04-17 16:09:53
2 hours or more at the gym? and u say u workout for 5 years?
Have you ever heard of... catabolic state? damn...

Post edited 2012-04-17 17:21:01
2012-04-17 17:20:40
I'v started using chemical things less than a month ago :)
2012-04-17 18:20:24
what are you talking about?!
2012-04-17 21:12:07
misunderstaning
2012-04-17 21:54:02
im just trying to get you to see that 1 hour MAX is what you need to build muscle (hipertrophy)
2012-04-17 23:00:32
1 hour of intensive work probably yeah :) But it's really hard
2012-04-17 23:35:08
imo firstly you have to read alot instead of just asking a simple question. The answer is neither just a few sentences nor a few paragraphs. The best place you can find thousands of thousands of articles is bodybuilding.com. I'm afraid to say this website is not a right place for asking bodybuilding questions. To be honest after 6 years of weight training there are still so many details to learn. Anyway wish you best of luck.
2012-04-17 15:27:53
well I think weight gainer is usually just whey protein + carbohydrate or am i wrong?

so if you wanna gain weight you need to eat plenty of healthy food (remember to variate) and work out. You can use weightgainer to replace one of your daily lighter meals and preferably just after you have worked out for the best results.
2012-04-17 15:32:32
u need metanabol ! or testosteron + supplies !

meybe vinstrol too


or hormons

and train 5 day in week

Post edited 2012-04-17 15:35:54
2012-04-17 15:35:13
Bro he just starting,maybe is the best for him to use Sterodis?
That your is not good choise for start.Buy whey and creatine you will be 4nimaL
2012-04-18 00:45:52
a big strong ass?

now that's a nice dream
2012-04-17 15:36:16
goal
2012-04-17 15:42:05
Hey Buyanbold.

Most of the comments in here are very good advice. Your diet and rest are just as important as your workout. If you want to build a big muscle mass it really goes down to explosive traning, a whole lot of food and a lot of resting.

I would recommend you to workout 4 or 5 times a week. No more and no less. A program could be chest, triceps and shoulder on day 1. Biceps, back and legs on day 2. Rest on day 3. Then repeat day 1 and 2 the following days, but try to vary your workout as much as possible. Do different exercises for the different muscle groups. As a start, you should workout lightly the first week or two to get your muscles warmed up. Then begin your explosive workout. This means that you exercise 4-5 sets of 6-8 repetitions - you really need to push yourself and lift as much as you can. Pressure and pain are the key to success.

It's OK to train cardio, but do NOT overdo it - otherwise you will end up with a decreasing progress. If you like cardio I suggest you to use it as a light warm up before your workout - tests have actually shown it increases your performance.

Regarding your diet the most important advice when it comes to building muscle is to eat enough calories. And of course, proteins are a very important factor too. If the calorie requirement are not covered, then proteins are just used as fuel to meet the calorie requirement, rather than to engage in building muscle mass. So eat A LOT! This could be all from eggs, chicken, rice, potatoes and so on.

It is important to consume fast carbohydrates within the first half hour after training. It covers the body's acute energy needs, so the protein degradation after exercise is reduced. But just as it is important to get fast calories, it is important to get fast proteins, so your body can build up the muscles again as soon as possible.

Other than working out and eating it is important to rest. Do not get guilty conscience about lying on the couch, because that is exactly what your body needs. A good night sleep is very important aswell.

Post edited 2012-04-17 15:41:56
2012-04-17 15:40:21
oh bro there are many useful information. i`ll do whatever need from my side and what about supplement place where i live is has one supplement store www.gnc.com products if you don`t mind look it up and tell me what i need? in addition i have a capable of buying 1 or 2 supplement around 150$ hehe
2012-04-17 16:06:57
Remember that supplements are not a substitute for your diet. But anyway, i'd suggest you to buy Whey Protein (to help rebuilding your muscles) and Weight Gainer (carbohydrates - helps gaining your weight. Other than that it will rapidly rebuild and repair damaged muscle tissue, which helps in muscle building and recovery). Make sure to be careful using the products - read all the instructions on the internet and on the back of the products.

I'm sure whey protein and weight gainer will have a good effect on your training, and some would probably recommend you to buy pre-workout products as NO Xplode or Jack3d. They are highly acclaimed products because they give you a boost to your workout. You will be more focused on your training - it acts as a powerful energy drink. However, it must be said that it works differently from person to person. I've never had success with these products, no matter how many scoops I have taken. So it's kinda up to yourself if you'd like to try it out or not.

But I'd say that if you focus on your diet all these supplements wont be necessary. As I said earlier supplements cannot be used as a substitute. So if you decide to use supplements remember still to eat next to it.

Links for supplements:

NO Xplode 2.0: http://www.gnc.com/product/index.jsp?productId=325..

Whey Protein: http://www.gnc.com/family/index.jsp?categoryId=210.. - There are a lot to pick from. I'm not familiar with those brands really since I buy my supplements from a Danish webshop. But I'd suggest you to read about the brands and products to find out which one has the best effect and best taste.

Weight Gainers: http://www.gnc.com/family/index.jsp?categoryId=210.. - I would recommend you to look into BSN's True-Mass product.

Post edited 2012-04-18 12:20:04
2012-04-18 12:08:52
This is the best dieting speech for beginners, pros and everyone else. Watch this first:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2st3r_milos-sarc..
2012-04-17 15:46:56
okey dokey i`m watching
2012-04-17 16:08:58
Eat 6 - 7 times a day.

Starting the day with lot of carbs and proteins, and finishing it with no carbs at all.

Don't train a muscle more than 2 times per week.

After a hard gym session, you have 45 minutes to drink your shake.

My drink right after i finish training consists of:

2 Uncooked Eggs
30g Whey Protein (Optimum Nutrition Gold Standard)
15g Creatine (Optimum Nutrtion Creatine Powder)
1 Banana
30g Rice powder (i don't know how to call this one, but it's a product we have here that is just rice grinded to a very fine powder)

Also, i take Glutamine which helps to keep muscles bigger.

Your body is 70% made of water. DRINK WATER, IT MAKES WONDERS!
2012-04-17 15:58:28
that thing about 45 minutes to drink your shake is bullshit mate.
2012-04-17 17:23:11
"In the 15-60 minutes immediately following a workout, your muscles are primed to receive fuel to start the repair process. Eat (or drink) your recovery meal right away, within the first half hour after the workout is complete."

http://www.nomeatathlete.com/post-workout-recovery..

"For best results, eat within 30 to 60 minutes after exercise, when muscles are most receptive. During this window, an increase in enzyme activity makes the body more efficient at storing glucose for energy and building protein in fatigued muscles."


http://www.cookinglight.com/healthy-living/fitness..

"Ideally, you should try to eat within 60 minutes of the end of your workout and make sure you include some high-quality protein and complex carbohydrate. "

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/sampleworkouts/..

Bullshit? I'm pretty sure it isn't... mate.
2012-04-18 07:36:33
pasha biceps
2012-04-17 16:13:27
seeing some strong broscience i thought i could give you some standard beginners advice although you'll probably just give up after top 1 month of training with the attitude your showing in this thread OP.

first off you need to find out how many calories you need per day, now there are numereous methods of calculating this out and you need to find the best way for you, google it ;)

lets say in average per day you burn a total of 3000calories. as you say you wanna be a big ass f***er like arnold? then you ADD 10-20% calories to the total above, and then you will gain size/weight, and you'll probably need to adjust the percentage in the beginning to get the right amount so you dont lose mass or gain too much weight in terms of fat.

over to the nutrition part. you dont need gainers! gainers are processed food and mostly simple carbs. you will feel much better by filling your daily caloric need with eatable "clean" food.

last thing i want to mention for now is PROTEIN. as you are putting on mass, you wont have the need for that much protein. you will need about 1g/1lbs, so if you're 180lbs you eat 180g protein. thats about 740 calories, so now you can fill the rest of the days caloric need with fats and carbs. the balance between fats and carbs is just something you'll need to figure out yourself, because everyone have different experiences on this mather! GL to ya ;)

Post edited 2012-04-17 16:16:02
2012-04-17 16:14:25
ok i won`t give up
2012-04-17 16:24:05
so don`t need neither gainer , protein ????????????
2012-04-17 16:28:10
you wont need gainer as long as you fill ur daily caloric need with clean eatable food... and i don't think you will be needing protein supplements either because you wont need that much protein.. just do the calculations man! find out ur daily caloric need, find out how much u weigh to find your protein needs, and go from there ;)

if youre really into this stuff i recommend you to read articles from Lyle McDonald, Alan Aragon, Layne Norton to mention some. some of the articles are maybe a bit too advanced and you'll need some basic-intermediate muscle biology/biology knowledge, but theyre really good ;)

Post edited 2012-04-17 16:53:50
2012-04-17 16:46:28
Listen my advice and you will see progress.

Nutrition

You must eat every 3 hours. So you must have 6 meals a day. Try to have in every meal protein. Eat chicken brests or Turkey,fish (tuna,salmon etc),red meat not over 4 times per month,except you can find buffalo meat that is much more healthy than beef. For carbs eat brown rice,potato, spaghetti and "brown" bread. In every meal try to have also fiber from green salads. For breakfast you must eat high absorbing protein and carbs. So eggs omelet and quaker oats with 2% fat milk is must. Every egg white has almost 7 grams protein and yellow 1-2 grams,but also choresterol and fat. I suggest to scramble 1-2 hole eggs and 4 whites. Generaly if you wanna gain weight you must eat 2-3 grams of protein per body kilo everyday and 5-6 grams of carbs. So if you weight 60kg you must eat 180gr protein and 360 grams of carbs. Numbers arent standar and differ from every body metabolism.


Workout


Because you are new at workout, its better to learn executing exersices properly,without cheating or wrong technique cause you may suffer injuries. I suggest you to train three times per week,because every "big" muscle group of human body needs at least 24 hours rest. So a typical program for rookies is Monday:Chest-triceps, Wednesday: Back-biceps, Friday: Legs-shoulders. For big muscle groups(chest,back,legs) use 5 different exersices and for small groups (bicep,tricep,shoulders,lats) no more than 3. Four sets of 10 reps for big muscle groups,and three sets of 12 reps for small. You must dare to change your exercises every one month,to plus more weights and change reps and sets in order to "surprise" muscles and unstuck them. There are many many different programms to use, like pyramide,cyclic train etc. Finaly I suggest you to prefer free weights than machines when you learn how to execute each technique properly.

Supplements

For the first 6 months I suggest you not to take supplements at all. If you eat well you dont really need them. Supplements wont make you Arnold in a night. In order to become Arnold you must take serious stuff with stricktly timeline. Bodybuilding is 70% nutrition 30% workout. When you will decide to take supplements I suggest you to take a whey protein. There are 3 kinds of protein. Isolate,Concentrate and Casein. Casein comes from milk and its the slowest absorbing protein. It takes 7-8 hours to be absorbed and its much expensive,so the only way to use it,is before night sleep... Isolate is 90%-95% pure whey protein and Concentrate is around 85-87% pure,and Iso is around 30% more expensive.Not big deal. There are also blends of these types of protein. AVOID gainers because are full of sugars and the only thing you will get from them is FAT. These are marketing tricks from supplement companies to sell. You can make a simple whey protein,gainer, adding a banana,that has high quality carbs. The properly way to use protein is to take three shakes. One 20 minutes before breakfast, second just before you start workout and third just after workout in double dose,because that time human body can absorbe the highest amount of protein. The days off you can take 1 or 2 shakes per day. Thats the proper way of taking protein but most guys take two shakes per day,one with breakfast in water or before sleep with 2% milk,cause milks casein makes protein slow absorbing and one after workout. Of course there are more advanced supplements like BCAA,monohydrate creatine,arginine,glutamine and more serious like steroids, that need serious timeline of taking,when to take,and how much to take and are for advanced bodybuilders.

If you want to involve with Bodybuilding you must read,read and read because BB is a fuckin science!!

i hope i helped.
2012-04-17 16:41:39
by: dn1
#97
this guy has it. its all true :)

btw. If you are a skinny little bitch, dont do alot of cardio, just focus on eating alot, weightlifting, resting. If you want to buy protein, buy whey protein... You dont have to buy ISOLATE, you can buy normal Concentrate cause you have high metabolism so your body doesnt care about those little fats & carbs in it (I use Optimum Nutrition whey protein - rocky road flavour, tasty stuff xD)
2012-04-17 23:29:56
and more broscience keeps coming! gg.

if i got time i will crush ur "science" with ACTUAL science.

Post edited 2012-04-17 23:49:41
2012-04-17 23:43:27
Aight so here it goes! You're going down :D

First off the most confusing broscience out there: MEAL FREQUENCY! And I'm about to drop the truth so watch out dude!

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8...ubmed_RVDoc..

This study compared 5 meals a day to 2 meals a day, both with the same total caloric intake. The conclusion of this study came to be: "With the method used for determination of DIT no significant effect of meal frequency on the contribution of DIT to ADMR could be demonstrated."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9155494

This is some-what of an analysis of ALL studies done regarding meal frequency and energy expenditure (calories burnt). It essentially states that most studies are neutral on the matter, that is meal frequency has no effect on metabolism. The VERY few studies saying otherwise were likely flawed.

http://www.slideshare.net/biolayne/o...nd-muscle-m..

That is a slideshow done by Dr. Layne Norton. It essentially shows that protein synthesis is not related to an absolute increase in plasma amino levels, which would be sustained by frequent meals. It's hypothesized that plasma amino spikes are able to stimulate protein synthesis at a much greater rate. This would actually support eating LESS frequently rather than more frequently.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17413096

Here's another study that may be taking this myth and completely reversing it. It showed that although eating one meal/day as opposed to three caused an increase in hunger, it actually caused a DECREASE in fat mass, it also showed decrease in the catabolic hormone cortisol.

So you're saying he needs to eat every 3 hours? NOT TRUE!

Post edited 2012-04-18 00:01:22
2012-04-18 00:00:33
by: dn1
#105
kNUGzi,


if you ask any natural/unnatural bodybuilder, they will all say the same: eat more than 3-4 times a day!

I doubt that these "nutrition science freaks" have good physiques :D

if you had to pick between 2 "personal" trainers, which one would you pick ?

a trainer with good physique and knowledge on his own experience or some fat science prick with his "studies"



2012-04-18 00:17:34
Yea, but in essence it doesn't matter how many times you eat per day as long as you meet your needs! that's my point as this greek dude says you NEED to eat every 3 hours.

These "nutrition" freaks which I look up to and have been following for quite some time now and learning from are not "fat science pricks", and yes I would love to have them as personal trainers! that would be a dream... After you calling them "fat pricks" n whatnot, I take it as you haven't heard of any of the people I'm referring to, so here are some links ;)

Here is the one i sitated in one of the posts, Layne Norton:
http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/laynenorton/Layne%2..

2012-04-18 00:25:23
by: dn1
#108
Didnt look up to nothing, just saw the "studies" part :)

I am still gonna stick with most used methods in BB.

2012-04-18 00:31:44
Thats because broscience has been spread. Big guy=/=Wise guy. Bodybuilders may eat smaller portions for other reasons.

a trainer with good physique and knowledge on his own experience or some fat science prick with his "studies"

GTFO, ill train scientifically and you can eat your 4 meals a day, post workout protein shake, not eat carbs after 4pm and do your million crunches for abs.
2012-04-18 11:01:16
by: dn1
#132
Am gonna back out of this conversation, cause Im not a pro-bodybuilder, doubt you 2 guys are either,. Just thought Id give this guy some advice but there will always be some idiots trying to prove something wrong. Keep on reading on newest scientific studies how eating chocolate can actually REDUCE YOUR BF%... xD
2012-04-18 11:12:42
Please do not give a damn about these guys... I am a qualified personal trainer and I was taught in school from a lot of medical books and Of course you have to eat 5 or 6 times a day. Every single overweighted person who I have trained ate mostly 2 or sometimes 3 times a day. And with just changing their meal frequency to 5 or 6 times per day they started losing weight few days later..
2012-04-18 13:18:17
Meal frequency is irrelevant, how hard is it to get? It's still all about calories in vs calories out.
2012-04-19 14:36:14
"before sleep with 2% milk,cause milks casein makes protein slow absorbing and one after workout."

Any sources for this? I have NEVER heard that milk's protein makes other protein sources slow absorbing? Only thing that can cause protein to have a slower absorbing are dietary fats. You just keep throwing out these retarded statements which is far from the truth! I don't know why you even bothered writing :\

And you're saying he needs a slow absorbing shake after workout?
I think otherwise my friend!

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21045172

This study showed that immediate responses to whey and casein (slow absorbing) ingestion were different... But the end result was the same. They both stimulated protein synthesis equally.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15570142

This study shows almost exactly the same thing. Both proteins caused equal protein synthesis.

These findings are only compounded by having solid pre workout nutrition. A quote by Alan Aragon states: "Properly done preworkout nutrition EASILY elevates insulin above and beyond the maximal threshold seen to inhibit muscle protein breakdown. This insulin elevation resulting from the preworkout meal can persist long after your resistance training bout is done. Therefore, thinking you need to spike anything is only the result of neglecting your preW nutrition"

Denied, again! You do not need a fast-digesting protein immediately postworkout. Nor do you need ANY protein post workout provided you are not lifting in a fasted state.
2012-04-18 00:10:03
where I said "you need slow absorbing protein after workout?". Sorry I wasnt clear and you are messed. Here is what I mean.

i wanna say that most ppl in days off and on workout take 2 shakes ,one with breakfast OR before sleep with 2% milk AND ONE after workout.

I didnt say that casein is worse than iso or something. They are just used in different phases of day according to other facts like workout routine,eating time or sleep time. Casein is KATABOLIC and whey is ANABOLIC,but both have the SAME PROTEINOSYNTHESIS in the end as you said. The point is that if you take casein after workout,you must eat the natural meal at least 5 hours later. I dont know any serious bodybuilder that eats 5-6 hours later after post workout shake. So the most proper phase of the day to take casein is before sleep,cause your body will not get any nutrition for at least 8 hours continusly.

and here is a research

Protein Ingestion Prior To Sleep Improves Post-Exercise Overnight Recovery
Res, Peter T.; Groen, Bart; Pennings, Bart; Beelen, Milou; Wallis, Gareth A.; Gijsen, Annemie P.; Senden, Joan M.G.; van Loon, Luc J.C.

Introduction: The role of nutrition in modulating post-exercise overnight recovery remains to be elucidated. We assessed the impact of protein ingestion immediately prior to sleep on digestion and absorption kinetics and protein metabolism during overnight recovery from a single bout of resistance type exercise.

Methods: 16 healthy young males performed a single bout of resistance type exercise in the evening (20:00) after a full day of dietary standardization. All subjects were provided with appropriate recovery nutrition (20 g protein, 60 g carbohydrate) immediately after exercise (21:00). Thereafter, 30 min prior to sleep (23:30 h) subjects ingested a beverage with (PRO) or without (PLA) 40 g specifically produced intrinsically [1-13C]phenylalanine labeled casein protein. Continuous intravenous infusions with [ring-2H5]phenylalanine and [ring-2H2]tyrosine were applied with blood and muscle samples collected to assess protein digestion and absorption kinetics, whole-body protein balance and mixed muscle protein synthesis rates throughout the night (7.5 h).

Results: During sleep casein protein was effectively digested and absorbed resulting in a rapid rise in circulating amino acid levels which were sustained throughout the remainder of the night. Protein ingestion prior to sleep increased whole-body protein synthesis rates (311+/-8 vs 246+/-9 ~mol[middle ***]kg-1[middle ***]7.5 h -1) and improved net protein balance (61+/-5 vs -11+/-6 [mu]mol[middle ***]kg-1[middle ***]7.5 h -1) in the PRO vs PLA experiment, respectively; P<0.01). Mixed muscle protein synthesis rates were ~22% higher in the PRO vs PLA experiment, which reached borderline significance (0.059+/-0.005 vs 0.048+/-0.004 %[middle ***]h-1; P=0.05).

Conclusion: This is the first study to show that protein ingested immediately prior to sleep is effectively digested and absorbed, thereby stimulating muscle protein synthesis and improving whole-body protein balance during post-exercise, overnight recovery.

Post edited 2012-04-18 16:45:54
2012-04-18 16:45:15
Sorry if I misunderstood you, it's just hard to understand a person who can't even write ONE coherent sentence. BUT if both protein have the same impact on proteinsynthesis then it doesn't matter does it?

You didn't understand my last post as you are clearly lacking some English skills. BUT I'll try my best.. again.. to make you understand this stuff, ok? The first point was that it doesn't matter if the protein is slow absorbing or "fast", because both have the same impact on proteinsynthesis in the end of the day, and here we were talking about POST WORKOUT not in before bed.

Next point was that you won't need ANY protein IMMEDIATELY post workout provided you're not lifting in a fasted state, this does not mean that it should conflict with your regular diet! If you take 50g carbs and no protein post workout, that doesn't mean that you shouldn't have your regular meal for instance at 19.00 just because you had your post-workout meal 1 hour ago.

That study doesn't have anything to do with what I posted in the last post.

(I tried to simplify the English a bit so you would perhaps understand it a tad better)
2012-04-18 20:12:14
its true that have passed over 12 years by the time i gained my English Certificate,but tbh im bored to death to read such big scripts.

First of all,I wanna ask you if you have involved with bodybuilding and since when you work out.

Now lets go to main menu.. During workout our body is burning glycogen. Taking only simple carbs after workout,you will only refill muscles with glycogen, and will reduce the levels of Cortisol which is the most katabolic hormone.

For about 40 minutes after workout the body has a "metabolic window" opened and levels of insuline are high. That time we must send to our muscles through insuline precious aminoacids in order to reconstruct and build the muscle tissue. So we must take a shake that consists 5gr of glutamine,5gr of BCAA,50gr whey protein,60-100gr carbs,3-5gr creatine, and 500mg Alpha lipoid acid.

Glutamine: helps muscle recover

BCAA: helps muscle growth process

Carbs: helps body secrete insuline

Alpha lipoid acid: in combination with carbs produce more insuline and has antioxide effect

Creatine: helps muscular cell protein synthesis

Protein: its the cornerstone muscle amino acid.

Thats the right way to take supplements if you are serious involved with bodybuilding,and thats the basic way that all bodybuilding legends followed and follow.
2012-04-18 21:13:35
Yes I am "involved" with bodybuilding, and I'm currently prepping for my first natty show this summer.

This "metabolic window" you are talking about is broscience again. I'm going to try to explain this very simple: the meal you consume before training is more important than the meal you consume after training and here's why. The metabolic "window" is taken out of context since proteins entering the mouth are not instantized to potential nutrients at the level of liver deanimation and transanimation, or into the flux of muscle fiber cellular metabolism. In other words, the nutrients you consume a couple hours before your workout are actually the ones that are falling into this "window" during and after training. It takes significant time in order for protein and complex carbohydrates to go through the whole digestive process that is necessary to replenish usable amino acids and glycogen to your muscles. BUT as you're correct that taking BCAA and or creatine is good pre- and or post workout because they undergo a much more simple route of absorption so they can effectively be utilized by your muscles within minutes versus the hours it would take to digest a whole food meal.

If your referring to the metabolic window as a result to recovery and muscle growth in terms of post workout, then you are mistaking, a long with many other broscientists. Recovery and muscle growth is a 24-7 matter. The body will slowly break down proteins you consume into the essential amino acids that it needs to facilitate growth and repair, little by little, over a long duration of time. There is no such thing as instant muscle recovery or instant muscle growth no matter how many nutrients you take in before or after a workout. Although BCAA and Creatine helps speed the process along, but all in all, building muscle naturally takes time, and cannot be dealt with in this metabolic window that you're referring to over a short time and right after your workout. The metabolic window is 24/7 in terms of recovery and muscle growth.


Post edited 2012-04-18 21:52:50
2012-04-18 21:48:30
no no i dont consider metabolic window as the main muscle growth fact. :)
2012-04-18 23:29:38
Suggest some workout music PLEASE.


Thanks ^_^
2012-04-17 17:27:33
yes you did. thanks for your effort but could you tell me why i shouldn`t use supplement first 6 months ?

Post edited 2012-04-17 18:23:25
2012-04-17 18:22:45
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV5WB2l5x-k

Tell me what you think about it.
2012-04-18 07:42:13
Thanks
2012-04-18 09:39:27
Eminem - Not afraid
Dr Dre ft Eminem - I need a doctor
Eminem ft Nate Dogg - Till i collapse
Lil Wayne gt Bruno Mars - Mirror
Nathaniel Dawkins - Bring it on
Fort Minor - Remember the name
Fireproof
Kanye West - Stronger
Blur - Song 2
Lil Wayne - Lollipop
Trapt - Headstrong
Madona - Hung up (Don't know why but i like to listen this while i workout)
Kanye West - Jesus Walks
Red Hot Chili Peppers - Can't Stop
That's my playlist while i work out.Hope you will like it.
2012-04-18 11:26:11
Thank You
2012-04-18 12:32:00
You welcome.
2012-04-18 21:48:04
We welcome
2012-04-19 14:46:01
Dont take proteins, bcs when u stop taking them, u will blow out like a balloon, and have a heart problems, eat natural protein food, like chicken, fish, almonds, white part of egg, beef, veal, milk products, beans and work out hard everyday, thats it xD

Post edited 2012-04-17 21:35:49
2012-04-17 21:34:50
HAHAHAHHHAHA i can't stop laughing from this.. too funny. I sincerely hope you are trolling.
2012-04-19 16:43:07
ok kiddo
2012-04-19 20:39:56
wow.. ur actually serious.. and yea be careful eating too much protein, it makes small cysts which takes up bacterias and form an evil brain that leads to eating yourself and then suddenly the bacterial cysts have taken over your body and it controls your arms to hit yourself and then it says: "WHY DO YOU KEEP HITTING YOURSELF?!?! OMGG
2012-04-19 22:56:03
srsly u r a kid :S
go take proteins, nothing else is for u.
and too much proteins are bad for kidneys too, so when u get tired of wokring out, enjoy in ur life =)
2012-04-20 12:12:40
mutant mas is the shit for gaining weight
2012-04-17 22:48:34
Steroids + 300grams of protein daily + 3 workout per week for atleast 3 years
2012-04-17 23:02:35
workout + whey protein + rest + white meat = MONSTER
2012-04-17 23:04:42
for starters id do flys,bench press,curls and other machines at your gym. Use #60's diet thing then train once your core muscles get bigger and stronger then you can work on the extras but thats how everyone started out in the back garden ghetto gym doing curls and bench press haha XD
2012-04-17 23:18:46
Most importantly - consistency and perseverance :)
2012-04-17 23:40:17
loving all the broscience coming

Post edited 2012-04-18 00:09:54
2012-04-18 00:09:18
In
2012-04-18 10:57:39
No northamericans at this thread? I'm surprised.
2012-04-18 02:47:21
No Steroids allowed in here, so yeah.
2012-04-18 07:40:38
II am sorry to say you will NOT look like Arnold unless you take steroids and work out 6 days a week for 4+ hrs each day. If your looking to get big and strong work out 4-6 days a week 2+ hrs a day. Abs every day and make sure you work out legs just as much as each other muscle group. Suplements are good but not necessary. Working out is easy, anyone can become a gym rat, the dieting is the hardest part and dieting gets you results. U can work out everyday but if you constantly eat unhealthy foods you will not achieve your goals.
2012-04-18 03:34:41
Why the hell are people who have no idea what theyre taking about commenting. If you want to make some stuff up and spread it, go do it to your friends, its just painfull to read.
2012-04-18 10:58:25
Haven't you heard about hltv.org?
2012-04-18 17:19:50
Yup. Didnt think certain people would go to such extremes however.
2012-04-18 19:23:54
Oh yeah forgot to say, FOOD is what your looking for.
2012-04-18 11:02:38
I would rather suggest you to work calesthenics...FInd few friends and go work pushups, pullups, dips with them somewhere in the park, it's much more fun and healthier.I personaly don't like gym i think that this is more natural.Watch some clips about bar brothers, bar starzz etc. you will see that you can be in a very good shape after those exercises.It's your choice but remember hard work pays off! Good luck.
2012-04-18 11:20:12
Raw eggs,protein shakes and gym.
2012-04-18 11:32:30
if you eat raw egg,you will probably spend a month in hospital cause of salmonella and if you are unlucky 6ft under. ;P
2012-04-18 16:57:08
pasha biceps
2012-04-18 11:42:16
If you wanna look like Arnold then you'll have to do roids.
2012-04-18 18:28:43
arnold only cycled roids when he was on diet prepping for contests to get a good finishing touch as well as a sollid diet with minimal muscle loss... get ur facts straight boooyy
2012-04-19 13:43:52
Well, that's what he said..
2012-04-19 16:04:25
that was what he did as well, and inspired many more bodybuilders to do so in the same fashion.
2012-04-19 16:36:43
Ask Neo he's verry stronk
2012-04-18 18:30:35
i think bruce lee is very strong
2012-04-18 21:15:54
Pasha Biceps..
2012-04-19 01:08:52
you're all retarded
2012-04-19 15:16:54
Ask zarko!
2012-04-20 13:52:15
by: J R
#213
workout, eggs, protein shakes, sleep.
2012-04-24 00:42:07

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