Map developers face $50,000 fine
Time: 2013-02-19 13:53
Game: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive

Canadian map developers Diego Liatis and Frédéric Denis could be fined $50,000 CAD (approximately €37,000) for reproducing a Montréal subway station in CS:GO, Le Journal de Montréal reports.

Liatis and Denis had asked for permission from Montréal's City Council to recreate the subway station of Berri-UQAM in Valve's FPS game, but their request was met with a firm rejection.

They still decided to carry on with the project, and could now face legal trouble if the map is released as STM, Montréal's public transit commission, is looking to begin legal action against them.

The map was designed to be used in a local CS:GO tournament that will be held in early March in Montréal. Denis described the situation as "ridiculous".

"We did not create something that is behind STM's closed walls," he told Le Journal de Montréal.

"If terrorists want to know what an STM subway station looks like, all they have to do is take the subway."

2013-02-19 13:54:28
2013-02-19 13:55:20
Haha, this is so funny.
2013-02-19 13:55:34
what the actual fuck LOL
2013-02-19 13:55:42
by: xb0y
Awkward moment when government authorities act like kids.
2013-02-19 13:56:06
i mean... what... the... FUCK?!
2013-02-19 14:06:52
Wow! Yeah! What an "awkward moment"!
2013-02-19 14:42:46
Wow..... but Battlefield 3 can have a subway station that is in Paris?
2013-02-19 13:57:44
I don't even know if they asked them the permission to make a map of it, and imo they wouldn't have rejected BF3 developpers.
2013-02-19 14:06:05
You never know bro, it's like those planes the GTA4 developers couldn't implement in their game because people would use it to crash into US famous buildings ...

What a shame:x
2013-02-19 14:35:24
by: Schypher -
As believable that can be, that was not the case. The reasons why they didn't added planes it was because it was just one city, one airport. They tried to recreate New York as realistic as possible. Why put planes when the city was small was hell and you could only land in one place?
2013-02-19 16:11:16
really weird that is what saw on different gaming sites ? :x

Back in the days i was checking gamespot, etajv, ign,...
2013-02-19 17:49:43
My friend works at rockstar and what schypher says is true
2013-02-19 21:05:25
oho it was a myth !
2013-02-19 22:14:38
The law is different in France. Here public places are public property so you are allowed to copy them in video games, animation movies etc

Post edited 2013-02-19 14:35:41
2013-02-19 14:35:08
by: VxO4
So what you are telling me any public building in france is owned by the people. Thats bs. Espeically subway stations are could be owned by private/business who runs the subway.

Post edited 2013-02-19 15:38:39
2013-02-19 15:37:21
If subway station is owned by a company it is no longer a public building though, is it?

I think he was referring to property actually owned by the municipality or the state.

I've got no idea whether its true what he says although I'd argue that even if it was true, its most likely just a formality. Since the French constitution is written with the idea that the sovereignty of the state belongs only to the people of France compared to England for example, where the parliament is considered sovereign, however what is the difference in practice - probably nothing.

Post edited 2013-02-19 16:20:31
2013-02-19 16:20:08
not sure if stupid or trolling. SO you are not allowed to enter any store anymore to your logic without asking the seller to step in?

You are allowed to step on any of those. And you are allowed to take pictures/videos if no one said something else or if there is a sign which states what is forbidden to do on the property. But taking the rights and making a map out of it into a game and most likely earn cash for it could violate copyrights in the video game industry. Especially if you asked them and they said no. And even were so stupid to use the exact name of the subway.

Post edited 2013-02-19 16:29:38
2013-02-19 16:23:53
You have no idea what I am saying, thats obvious. I'll try to be simple and explain:

What I meant is that a privately own building is not a public place (not public in lay man terms but public in legal sense), its a privately own building in which the owner is within his rights to deny access to it whenever he pleases to do so and for almost any reason.

Public property doesn't work in a same, way although it may often look exactly the same from the outside or at the very least confusingly similar.

Do you understand the distinction that I am making? I wont bother to go further with my point if you dont get this..
2013-02-20 11:09:27
yes but i exactly explained that. I agree with you since i pretty much said the same
2013-02-21 16:53:56
"So what you are telling me any public building in france is owned by the people"
Yes, kind of (that's more complicated than that tho)

And you're wrong, the company that runs the subway in Paris is public. Stop talking about things you don't know...
2013-02-19 17:24:25
we were talking about the one and canada smarty
And thats not the point idiot. Fucking read
2013-02-19 18:24:55
"Wow..... but Battlefield 3 can have a subway station that is in Paris?"

That's the first sentence, the one I was answering to. Learn to read you mong
2013-02-19 18:38:23
Obviously EA were actually granted permission to do it, unlike these Canadians.
2013-02-19 14:42:25
Yeah obviously they asked for the permission, yes. What I meant is that they had the right to copy it even without asking
2013-02-19 17:19:46
BF3's subway isn't a specific play based on a real subway, this is, thus they can be fined.
2013-02-19 18:15:36
gg Canada
2013-02-19 13:57:49
by: JgS^G
notbad :D
2013-02-19 13:58:22
This kind of people are so f**ing boring

Post edited 2013-02-19 14:00:05
2013-02-19 13:59:40
its probably best we don't make bomb simulators of 1:1 real life places.
2013-02-19 13:59:59
by: Jeza
People wonder why there is bad press about games. This is just retarded.
2013-02-19 14:32:02
lol wtf
2013-02-19 14:00:57

Post edited
1970-01-01 01:00:00
has nothing to do with Valve, lol
2013-02-19 14:01:20
Oh sorry I'm too lazy to read
2013-02-19 14:03:02
Be lazy to make a comment next time, pls.
2013-02-19 15:08:34
Just blame valve for everything, I guess you are also too lazy to think.
2013-02-19 16:21:41
by: tfg
"If terrorists want to know what an STM subway station looks like, all they have to do is take the subway"
love u man :D
2013-02-19 14:03:11
2013-02-19 14:05:46
They asked for permission, were told no, then did it anyway. Serves them right.
2013-02-19 14:07:33
2013-02-19 14:12:57
2013-02-19 14:43:11
2013-02-19 15:34:40
2013-02-19 16:31:24
2013-02-19 14:07:42
canadian troublemakers? i thought they would only apologize each other for half an hour
2013-02-19 14:08:50
don't forget hockey
2013-02-19 14:16:03
...and beavers
2013-02-19 17:47:10
nha we are not brazilllllllllllllllian
2013-02-19 19:28:31
sorry eh
2013-02-19 19:33:52
by: DUZ
2013-02-19 14:09:20
There are more many possibilities to get killed by a policeman that by a terrorist!
2013-02-19 14:09:37

Post edited 2013-02-19 14:27:07
2013-02-19 14:16:11
Pretty much their fault and retarded of them
"Liatis and Denis had asked for permission from Montréal's City Council to recreate the subway station of Berri-UQAM in Valve's FPS game, but their request was met with a firm rejection."
2013-02-19 14:19:32
Canada has it's right to take actions against this.

The producers asked for permission, but got rejected BUT THEY STILL PRODUCED THE MAP.
Eventhough it's only a computer game map, the idea of creating it was rejected.

2013-02-19 14:21:13
if im not mistaken STM is a public company, which means they receive funding from the city which is taken from municipal taxes.

so technically the people own the metro, and they didnt need to ask anyone for permission
2013-02-19 15:03:13
if im not mistaken Saint1 doesnt know what he is talking about

so technically your argument would not hold up in court

Post edited 2013-02-19 16:24:38
2013-02-19 16:24:21
so by your logic eu rail can sue valve because de_train encourages bombing of trains?
2013-02-19 17:08:53
eu rail? What are you talking about? How could you possibly get that idea from what I posted.

My point was that your "reasoning" to how the law and citizen ownership works was bollocks, which is true.

Now explain what the fuck are you dribbling about de_train, valve and eu rail(wtf is that?)?
2013-02-20 11:02:54
since you dont seem to be getting the point

"Works in the Public Domain

Public domain refers to works that belong to the public. Works in the public domain can be used free of charge and do not require written permission from the author/creator.

Works can be in the public domain for a variety of reasons. Examples: the term of the copyright has expired, the work was not eligible for copyright protection in the first place, or the copyright owner has authorized the public to use the work without permission or payment.

Some examples of works in the public domain are explained below."

"The organization of the public sector (public ownership) can take several forms, including:

Direct administration funded through taxation; the delivering organization generally has no specific requirement to meet commercial success criteria, and production decisions are determined by government."

STM is funded by the municipal taxes collected from the people of montreal. it is therefore a public company. it is impossible to copyright a location in canada, therefore as a public space the map developers dont need permission to recreate it in csgo.

which part of that was unclear the first time?
2013-02-20 14:12:44
Your point was this: "so technically the people own the metro, and they didnt need to ask anyone for permission"

My point was this: "..your "reasoning" to how the law and citizen ownership works was bollocks, which is true."

I'll just ignore bombing of trains, EU and other weird stuff you said in between that.

Why are you copy pasting me some elementary website about Canada's copyright laws?

I said nothing about copy rights in the first place, I hardly even commented on the whole ordeal but as you have probably read STM is only "considering" to sue these guys - main reason that they stated being that they (STM) are afraid that the cs map will create unease in the passengers of the metro.

Go away troll

Post edited 2013-02-20 20:39:21
2013-02-20 20:39:02
map makers have no reason to ask for permission. the only issue is ability to reproduce the station, they cant sue because theyre afraid it might cause panic with their passengers. get it right
2013-02-21 00:24:11
this is law by logic, not law by reality.
2013-02-19 18:20:26

Post edited
1970-01-01 01:00:00
2013-02-19 14:22:21
Alaska - head
Canada - chest and belly
America - ass and dick
Mexico - legs
2013-02-19 17:08:14

Post edited
1970-01-01 01:00:00
Swedish? Are you freakin kidding me, Mario Lemieux, Wayne Gretzky, Bobby Orr. End of discussion.
2013-02-19 14:24:43
chill down fakeflag, Peter Forsberg prime years most talented ever ive seen b4 heavy multiple injuries > now take icecreambanana with chokolate sauce.

and im not even swedish..

Post edited 2013-02-19 14:38:40
2013-02-19 14:36:03
Peter Forsberg was a beast and in his prime he was the best in the NHL, but you can't honestly say that he were better than Wayne och Mario. Och jo jag är svensk.
2013-02-19 14:40:13
He was according to the circumstances a couple of few years were he had everythjing none else had ive seen - clutch and grab era etc, but you prolly dont know what it is.

Wayne gretz ? lol yeah ok , great player in hockeys middle age stacking up those numbers, but barbie girl and not independant.

He even said Henrik Zetterberg is the best swedish ever. just makes himself a total retard and unknowledged bout hockey.

Just read

so... what i mean potentially he could be the greatest ever, since several top contenders claims him as the very best they ever meet or played with in his prime years.

Post edited 2013-02-19 14:53:22
2013-02-19 14:49:29
Yeah that's your opinion, but I don't agree, he was a beast in his era and it ended pretty fast, many players have great seasons.
And picking Zetterberg as the best swede ever was a bit retarded, but that doesn't make him a worse hockey player.
Imo the best Swedish player ever was Lidström.
2013-02-19 14:59:55
Its not an opionion, most of the Elite athletes in NHL told he was the best player they ever met.

His 4th in history assists per game and 9 in PPG when goalies also had the biggest pads and when it was ok to slash, hook and grab.

Man, talent in Forsberg prime extend anyones ive seen. I was actually born back then and watched every game.

Post edited 2013-02-19 15:09:42
2013-02-19 15:08:51
So it's not an opinion, it's a fact? Where can I see a legit top list where Forsberg is #1?
2013-02-19 15:24:50
I believe these guys knows knows less than a couchwanker-0? :

He was the most talented guy I ever played with, for just pure raw talent. But more than that, he was a winner and a total gamer, he just wanted to win. He didn't care who scored all the goals or who got all the credit. He just wanted to win, and that's why his teams won as much as they did. We were all very lucky to play with him."

"He was such an unselfish player, he loved to setup teammates, he's passing ability was second to none. He created alot of empty nets for alot of players and im one of the big benefactors from him, I got alot of easy goals thanks to Peter. There was nobody in my era there that was as skilled as him and that could play that tough style of hockey and i know when see other friends, he's the one player they mentioned they hated to play against." -- Joe Sakic

"Peter Forsberg is one of the best hockey players that ever played the game, and I actually don't think that anyone has been so good as Peter was during his peak, I've played against him alot, so I should know." -- Vjatjeslav Fetisov

At the HHOF induction, was asked the question on which player he thinks it's the best he ever played against. -- I would probably say that Forsberg is the best player I ever played against" -- Scott Stevens

"Some of the stuff he does is just ridiculous. Jaromir Jagr is big and strong like Forsberg, but Jagr doesn't fight back if you play him tough like Forsberg does. "I think he's the toughest player in the game to play against." -- Derian Hatcher

"For me, an agitator is somebody who controls the emotion of the game," "And Peter definitely controls the emotion of the game for them." "The only thing that stopped Forsberg is that he ran out of gas when they double- and tripleshifted him, and he wasn't able to use his speed, plus his strength," Hitchcock says. "I remember one time he kept the puck in our end for 40, maybe 50 seconds, and we couldn't get the thing away from him. His ability to knock Derian Hatcher on his butt while giving up 40 pounds shows how he can completely control and dominate a game. He's a player with skill and talent who occasionally goes maniacal. Boy, he gets a really strange look in his eyes. It's like the same steely glare that Mark Messier always gets, and you don't want to be anywhere near him." -- Ken Hitchcock

"Obviously one of the best players in the league the last 15 years, a guy who really controlled the play when he was on the ice, and there's only a handful of guy's in the league at any given era that really, actually controlled the play when the're where on the ice, just his combination of skill, strenght, determinition, and a bit of meanness or alot of meanness actually made him one of the best players to play." -- Steve Yzerman

"Peter is the best all-around player in the NHL, bar none. He's a competitor. He's the ultimate warrior. His hands are electric. He's one of the smartest players on the ice, and he knows where everybody is. He always makes the right play, and he even makes the plays you don't think he can make. He's so fast on his feet and so powerful. And he's mean. The guy is so talented, he's disgusting to watch." -- Jeremy Roenick

"If you could be anyone else in hockey, who would it be?" -- "That's easy. Peter Forsberg," (Claude) Lemieux says. "I could still be mean and nasty, but if I had all of the skills that he has, I might have won five or six Stanley Cups by now. "I can only dream of skating like Peter. Either that or buy some rocket-powered skates." "(After seeing) a Michael Jordan or a Wayne Gretzky, you think you've seen it all," Lemieux says, "and then Peter shows you something entirely new. "It's the way he creates space, uses space. It's the way he sees the ice. It's the way he picks up speed even after he picks up the puck. And it's the meanness, the nastiness." -- Claude Lemieux

"He's a coach's dream. The more crucial the time in a game or a series, the tougher he gets. I think sometimes he's able to flip on a switch in his mind and be at a different level than everyone else. " -- Ray Bourque

"Peter's ability to change the game was bar none, he could bring so many elements to a game to change it... My best advice when you're playing against Peter is to go change and let someone else play against him." -- Adam Deadmarsh

"The toughest NHL player you ever played against?" -- Quite easily Peter Forsberg. We have had our battles (he said laughing)... Forsberg was a one-man wrecking crew. He was so skilled and yet so powerful.. the man could simply do it all and at the same time he was hard as nails. He was extremely tough to play against. He was down right nasty." -- Chris Chelios
2013-02-19 15:32:02
Do you know how many pages I can link players saying amazing stuff about Lemieux or Gretzky? I'm not even going to continue this, you just can't face the fact that it's just an opinion and there are no facts. You may think that Forsberg were the best player ever, but I don't.
2013-02-19 15:41:52
Best player in absolute prime in terms of most independant? Peter Forsberg got the whole package like none else and played hockey to its fully extension like none else, even these alltimers claimed it, so yes. The multiple critical injuries stopped him being the Greatest ever. Career and talent is not the same thing you should know before speaking here.

You were 3 years old (or not even born) at that time when Gretzky scored open nets vs "goalies" without any size.

Ive seen their both primes. So i know.

Just calm down to whoever tells you stories, boy.
2013-02-19 15:56:14
The best player was Teemu Selanne.
2013-02-19 16:17:57
Ofc, according to crying finns.
2013-02-19 16:29:28
I actually really liked him, he also seemed like a cool chap
2013-02-19 16:56:48
He shouldn't be compared to Mario or Wayne in terms of who was the greastest career player, but in terms of pure skill and talent, Forsberg is unquestionably one of the most gifted players of all-time.
2013-02-19 16:59:18

Based on pure talent alone this Swedish phenom would be much higher on an alltime list. However, chronic injuries plagued Forsberg throughout his career, and he was unable to put up the kind of numbers that you’ll see from many others on an so called alltimers list. However, at the peak of his game between 1994 and 2003 Forsberg was arguably as good as any player in the game, averaging well over a point per game, and helping his Colorado Avalanche to 2 Stanley Cups. He was nearly unstoppable down low, and in my opinion his on-ice vision and his ability to pass through sticks is only second to Wayne Gretzky in the last thirty years.
2013-02-19 19:02:45
Was? He is still playing, and no.
2013-02-19 16:31:12
Whatever you say.
2013-02-19 16:30:28
Your stupidity level is over 9000...enough said
2013-02-19 19:45:08
ok what about sidney crosby? hes so young and has already won a stanley cup, olympic gold, and has now rebounded from a possible careering ending injury
2013-02-19 19:20:59
haha funny boy :D bobby orr best of all time
2013-02-19 15:10:42
USSR-Russia. End of discussion.
2013-02-19 17:18:33
What do you even mean by that?
2013-02-19 17:28:38
He mean that there is only one Red Machine :)
2013-02-19 18:11:51
about best players in hockey
2013-02-19 19:24:39
Ovechkin, Malkin. Enough said.
2013-02-19 15:09:04
Ovechkin over Forsberg? Nope. Malkin may become greater then the Great #21. Forsberg > both those 2

Post edited 2013-02-19 15:26:39
2013-02-19 15:25:53
who cares about your shit story, shut up and leave this forum
2013-02-19 18:02:19
sick people, ridiculous brain there lol rly fucktards
2013-02-19 14:27:43
by: Dok1
name it different, change some mapdesign elements and there you go...
2013-02-19 14:29:47
hehe indeed xD
2013-02-19 14:37:46
by: VxO4
exactly just call it de_subway and here we go.
2013-02-19 15:35:25
This is just so stupid that its actually funny haha

Post edited 2013-02-19 14:37:25
2013-02-19 14:36:31
I wonder how many real terrorist wanna use this to plan their attacks.
2013-02-19 14:45:45
Who would even play this map?
2013-02-19 14:53:23
yep, they should make de_pentagon instead
2013-02-19 17:51:32
They should have been fined for making terrible maps
2013-02-19 14:47:35

Post edited
1970-01-01 01:00:00
Omfg, both made me smile.
2013-02-19 14:51:09
that's antarctic but ok brazil
2013-02-19 14:56:07
gibe moni pls, i report u
2013-02-19 16:03:18

world's nothing
2013-02-19 16:22:15

Thank you come again.

Edit: And it's missing this

Post edited 2013-02-19 17:22:53
2013-02-19 17:20:49
Doesnt change the fact that nobody cares about portugal.
2013-02-19 17:26:35
So now you changed from world's nothing to noone caring, hmkay.

Not that I wanna keep feeding the troll, but I'd say the thousands of brazilians that constantly come here disagree with you.
2013-02-19 17:31:28
Worlds nothing = nobody cares.

Wanna discuss about turism with a brazillian, seriously?
2013-02-19 17:32:40
2013-02-19 16:50:46
2013-02-19 16:27:53
2013-02-19 16:33:22
yea whole taliban is playing cs:go in some cave
2013-02-19 14:52:58
2013-02-19 14:57:08
I read somewhere that taliban enjoyed playing COD :D
2013-02-19 15:06:16
lol? their 8 to 20 years old children learn to behead Pakistani and other locals, why would they wanna play cod?
This month due to f*cking taliban, over 700 people killed in bombing attacks in Peshawar and Quetta.

Post edited 2013-02-21 15:42:36
2013-02-21 15:40:24
by: Alth
The government believes anybody who plays that map in counterstrike will want to replicate what they did in the real life version. Cos games make you shoot people right.
2013-02-19 14:57:07
seems like montreal city council is full of 1.6 fanboys who dont want cs:go to succeed :(
2013-02-19 14:57:18
no but they do hand over construction contracts to mobsters in exchange for money.
2013-02-20 03:19:03
link for the map?:P
2013-02-19 15:02:12
at first i thought valve was gonna sue them xD
2013-02-19 15:03:42
2013-02-19 15:04:29
Retarded people are retarded.
2013-02-19 15:06:02
i live 10 min away from that metro lmao fkn french government is really fucked here in quebec, you need fluint french to get a job here its annoying
2013-02-19 15:12:04
Nah, it's all fine
2013-02-19 16:06:59
hilarious XD
2013-02-20 04:13:36
And the map is not even good, omg. They are serious retards.
2013-02-19 15:12:40

Post edited
1970-01-01 01:00:00
2013-02-19 15:12:59
by: EgeS
LMAO I take that metro station everyday. Going to be fun playing this map tonight.
2013-02-19 15:13:40
by: rbx
2013-02-19 18:26:22
2013-02-19 20:08:20
cool story bro
2013-02-19 15:14:46
crazy haha
2013-02-19 15:15:06
i shit myself laughing.
2013-02-19 15:26:32
2013-02-19 15:29:05

Post edited 2013-02-19 15:34:55
2013-02-19 15:34:10
Good, I'm glad this happend.
2013-02-19 15:34:28
lol why they asked for permission in the first place? is not like they are making a movie :D
2013-02-19 15:44:49
2013-02-19 15:47:36
2013-02-19 15:47:42
It's probably a baseless claim.
2013-02-19 15:53:42
STM must have touched the bottom to sue Average People for 50k(i doubt they have the money to pay that), and how the fk can they think you can 'practice' a terrorist attack on Counter strike...
I dont really think pre fire corner while 'strafing' would be a good idea against real cops
2013-02-19 16:03:50
just make some small adjustments that don't affect the playing experience of the map and change the color of the train and you're done.
2013-02-19 16:03:54
I create the map of my school two years ago, now i'm afraid D:

Post edited 2013-02-19 16:06:28
2013-02-19 16:06:09
Reported to the police. Gl in prison.
2013-02-19 16:12:31
2013-02-19 16:17:34
HAHA I saw this coming
2013-02-19 18:30:27
Yep, that is valuable info for real terrorists to know beforehand where CT spawn is thus from where CT is going to enter the station.
2013-02-19 16:13:00
2013-02-19 16:26:18
Well, this map cant be 100% identical?
2013-02-19 16:14:29
not if they used hammer.exe to make it. that thing is older than time.
2013-02-20 03:25:42
Some details are 100% different and they can use it in court if they must.
2013-02-20 18:32:54
looks really poorly made anyway and probably not a good competitive map soo...
2013-02-19 16:15:48
Lol i was about to create a map based on my school :D

Post edited 2013-02-19 16:52:48
2013-02-19 16:52:32
good story bro LOL xD
2013-02-19 16:56:33
i dont understand... you can see the whole metrostation in pictures at google anyway
2013-02-19 17:31:23
I feel sick.
2013-02-21 15:41:49

Post edited
1970-01-01 01:00:00
Finland will never have a superstar goalie like this:

Post edited 2013-02-19 18:11:12
2013-02-19 18:09:49
rofl except we already have.

you should go cry somewhere else you ignorant piece of shit
2013-02-19 19:17:46
I am a Finn,and we do not give swedes credit too easily.He is one of the greatest players all time.
But I realise this is the list of the semi professional? or waht?
the most entertaining player i saw play was Forsberg, hands down.

but,Fetisov,Kasatonov,Krutov,Larionov And Makarov.
There will NEVER be a hockey team like that,ever!
2013-02-19 19:46:30

Post edited
1970-01-01 01:00:00
enlighten me with your knowledge of public intellectual property laws please
2013-02-19 18:20:08
Why the fuck would they need permission anyway? Stupidest thing I ever heard.
2013-02-19 18:44:46
Ridiculous.. lmao
2013-02-19 19:29:13
Funny stuff, and the STM are dbags anyway stick it to their face!

Post edited 2013-02-19 20:20:02
2013-02-19 20:09:43
Ultra mega shhit map for idiots. Ridicule for counter strike. Who created this map is heavily restricted individual who has never played this game
2013-02-19 20:13:53
they just have to apologise...
2013-02-19 20:28:48
has any1 played vcop 2? looks like
2013-02-21 15:27:17
great, sue them because real terrorists play cs:go. they have just bought new computers so they can play it.
2013-02-21 16:00:18
Anders Breivik got MVP award from Zion activist for insane 1v78 clutch in Norway (2011).
2013-02-21 16:07:38
laws exist for a reason. in this (trivial) case they knowingly broke the law, and planned to do so. the fact they were aware of the law, attempted to negate the law (with permission) says they don't give a shit what the law dictates, or respect the owners decision to decline their request.

e.g. walking out of a store and forgetting to pay for something vs stealing

they are stealing.
2013-02-22 07:54:06
its a PUBLIC place
2013-02-23 10:12:57

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