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am i the only one who get really annoyed by redeye as cameraman. he 80% of times miss all good kills and action. he also shows overview a lot but does he even realize that picture is off from actual map positions?
please stick to talking nonsens and let someone who knows what they doing be in charge of camera!
yes, you're the only one
hltv.org/forum/115522-dear-shoutcasters
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you mean not the only one? :D
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yeah, but not a mistake, i was sarcastic :P
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ahh :D okey then :D
The best way to do it would be with lurppis controlling the cam, but I can understand how they're doing it since Redeye is the host (alongside with Joe).
He's off a lot of times, but luckly for us Joe is the one in control for the Grand Final.
#getlurppistocontrolthecampls
no you are not the only one sir , he stays on overview way to long , even seeing that zneel is pushing mid he changed to kyrstal on PINK ..
Who cares, he is entertaining us by farting anyways.
redeye is doing great, even if it's not perfect ! he's doing a great job.
great guy
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no, he's straight up stupid
in the last map he put the POV on face, who was planting, and got killed before it was done. AFTER he was killed, he asks, "Will face finish planting?!?!"
Then just one round later bomb is planted and it's a 1v1 robban vs. niko. He puts POV on Robban, who peaks the bomb and gets killed by Niko, who had moved to the boxes next to hut to trick robban. While the perspective is zooming out of Robban's dead body, you can see Niko isn't moving from his spot. Redeye switches POV to niko, who still is not moving because it's way to late to even escape with his gun, nevermind defuse, yet he waits a second or two and goes, "Will he finish the defuse?!?!?!" Then, the whole time niko not moving, he waits until the bomb explodes and says, "No!!"
I only caught that map and part of the first half ESC vs. SK on train. On that he was abysmal also. I remember one round where he scrolled through the players and saw 3 SK players hitting outside and 2 waiting in white halls inner. He stays with an inner CT while neo kills the 3 t's outside (so we miss the action). Then he scrolls through the players again and sees the remaining SK players rushing into inner, so what's he do? He changes POV to neo, who is still outside up the tower, so we miss kuben getting the remaining two kills.
Pretty much every round is like that. He picks a player for the POV with absolutely no thought on where the action is going to be, except in the case where he switches to the player where the action ALREADY happened, which often misses the next action, since it isn't often you see all five players rushing one by one from the same place with enough delay in between them to give redeye time to switch to it.
In summary, he casts like (1) he doesn't know the maps, (2) he isn't even watching the game, (3) he doesn't understand cs in general. On the latter, so many times he'll make some stupid generalization that lurppis has to correct.
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Dude the term abysmal is way to much for the rest of your vocabulary and seems a bit forced especially regarding the average english knowledge of the HLTV users
the only thing that confuses me about redeye is that they give him the title "cs-expert"(which i have no idea how exactly you gain that title anyways, pretty sure im a cs-expert also..) yet, he seems to have no idea whats going on in some situations. like for example markeloff will be watching his spot and neo will flank around somehow and kill him(this actually happened) and he will be like "WHAT WAS MARKELOFF DOING??!?!" dude, he didnt know he was getting flanked, he was in position. its more like "GREAT FLANK BY NEO!" i saw all kinds of that stuff where its obvious to me and everyone else whats going on but redeye seems to be out of the loop quite a bit.. like with strats and stuff he always like "where are they going?" "what are they doing?" i think lurppis did a better job he just wasnt as confortable and charismatic as an experienced commentator would be.. and as for the whole camera thing thats hit or miss.. whether joe, lurppis, redeye, me, you, or anyone else controls the camera there is gonna be times where you will be on the wrong person, or switch people at the wrong time, or not switch to the right person in time.. what they should do is have a split screen so we can see what both sides are doing and for like awp wars and stuff.. i mean sometimes its obvious who the camera should be on and they still dont put it on the person for whatever reason, but it is what it is. there is definately better cameramen than redeye and joe.. so overall i agree with everything you said. /end rant
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You're saying that joe knows much about cs? LOL
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joe is no expert, but some of the stuff redeye does is stupid for any human being to say, even one who has never seen cs before. for example see my post #33 where he questions whether face will get the bomb down after he is killed. anyone who knows you have to be alive to plant will not ask that question
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I'm not saying that redye is a "cs expert" and that he's better than joe. They both are bad
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yeah and hes funny.. but WAY over the top. He got annoying as hell to me after like 2 matches. like gtr would get a headshot then: ZOMG!! ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!!!!!!!!! ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!!!!!!! HOW DID HE MAKE THAT SHOT!!!!!!............... bro chill out.
I'm really dissapointed about SK, but Lions deserve the 3rd place :)
i really like redeye.
and i actually think the opposite.
he catches many things.
and i am wonderin which criteria should be used to judge this aspect.
from my point of view redeye does a GREAT job.
but giving lurppis the camera, would be no bad idea though.
i extra swiched from the german to english stream :P
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no, it's not hard
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i agree he is good as entertainer for thoes who dunno cs that well BUT his lack of cs insight and poor work as cameraman does more harm to stream than good imo.
i start to feel like nesl dont give a shit about cs anymore and goes like "Whatever....". Normally no decent organization would put someone new to task for such a big event.
A few things for you haters to consider today.
1. I casted for nearly 10 hours straight without a break or any food, fatigue did set in a little towards the end of the day and I missed a few rounds of action which I shouldn't have, sorry.
2. I dont control the sounds, the event, the timing, the music or the stream, so all of you complaining at me about those things aren't really going to get anything back from me on those things.
3. I had no idea I would need to control the camera of the game at this event before I got here, otherwise I would have spent time getting used to it again. You have to understand that whilst I have commentated on CS for a long time (close to 10 years now) I havent controlled the camera for many years because the TV shows I have commentated on do not give that ability to us. ESL is different (and better in many ways) but that did mean that you got a very rusty camera man. I make no claim to being an expert on what to follow, I tried my best to see what was going on and in all honesty it was better than the game I did yesterday. However, I agree it would have been better to let Lurppis handle this in hindsight although you also have to understand it isnt as simple as just handing him the mouse, the setups are all differnet, the wiring would have needed changing and there are a ton of other production issues it would have raised. Never the less, I apologise for the poor camera stuff at times.
4. I am NOT a CS expert and I specifically asked ESL production to NOT use that under my name and instead just use my twitter handle or "commentator" because that IS what I am. I am there to make it interesting and entertaining and call the shots as they happen. I realise that won't please all of you, but that was why we had Lurppis to explain the finer detail for you, the hardcore fan. I'm not an expert and never claimed to be one, however I have spent the last ten years following, playing and commentating on CS.
5. You also need to think about things a little clearer. This event has a production crew of almost 200 people, it isn't just me and Lurppis sitting there doing it all, in fact we do very little and as such most of the things are out of our control. Just think about the amount of hours that go in to this to get it out to you.
6. Lurppis and Joe: Neither of them "wanted to punch" me at all. In fact, we all get on very well and respect what each other brings to the cast. I've been great friends with Joe for over 7 years now too.
7. Finally, in no way is this an excuse, but to let you know some of the demands on commentators at large events. It isn't them just sitting there spectacting. There is so much more going on, the producer in the ear with countdowns and commercials, listening to your co-commentator properly, watching two different screens at the same time, engaging the crowd in the audience and not just those watching from home, taking commands from the stage manager, updating the scores as we go along on the GUI, following the game at the same time and generally trying to make sure it is enjoyable to as wide an audience as possible. All of this obviouosly takes a hell of a lot of concentration and we won't always get it 100% right the way you want it.
I think there are a lot of harsh words in this thread too, you don't know me (obviously) and some of you have no idea how much preparation, effort and time goes in to this. On Monday I will head back to my normal day job having had to take off an entire week of holiday to do this. Sure, I love doing it so it's not a problem and whilst some of the posts in this thread are fair, most of the critique is just ridiculously over the top and very insulting. The last thing, after 10 hours straight casting 9 consecutive maps I need is flamers spouting shit without much reason. If you don't want coverage of CS, cool I guess, because if you abuse people who offer their time to give you the coverage in a game which is almost dead, they might just decide not to bother any more.
Luckily, I've seen this kind of response before and it's water off a ducks arse to me, but I did feel you should have some form of response, especially to those who have been constructive in this thread. To the flamers: Carry on, you won't be heard and one day you will learn you can't treat people like shit all the time.
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You're doing a great job. You're cameraman skills are a bit off, but that's not gonna spoil the party for us, obviously. And about the 'harsh words', you can't forget the age span of the people posting here. And most likely they're just trolling or purelly hatting to get some type of reaction.
Activate you anti-flame shield, good sir.
well for the least i respect you for replaying. hope you will do better job next time if they make you the camera man again.
You and Joe did i great job, tnx and gl in future ;)
"If you don't want coverage of CS, cool I guess, because if you abuse people who offer their time to give you the coverage in a game which is almost dead, they might just decide not to bother any more."
this line killed all my respect to you. you know nothing about cs, what should be sad after 10 years in business.
you offer your time to coverage game which is almost dead? if you think so, why you're doing this? the answer is MONEY you earn. So dont talk bullshit about your time cuz your time was bought by ESL. and every public job, like commentator, or pro-player can be criticised by fans, because we are main target for sponsors who give you money to entertain us. if we are not satisfied, they are not too. and then it goes to you and your work. you got it?
if youre doing something wrong, what fans say to you, just try to work harder on your workshop, try fix mistakes or maybe just say sorry. i thought that ten years of experience in this commits to something - in your case i was horribly wrong.
i hope you 'just decide not to bother any more' - it will be better for us and for you.
have a nice day
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Boy, I got the same impression. That specific part of the post you quoted sounded to me as a threat, like he is doing us a favor and if we don't stop complaining he will not do it anymore.
On the other hand, I agree with him, there is no need for such harsh words. Just say what you gotta say without being offensive.
See, this is the kind of ill-informed rubbish I was talking about. But as you posted rubbish, I am keen to answer if only to make sure you are made aware of a few facts that you seem to be totally unaware of.
First up: Money. If money was my only reason for doing this event, then I didn't work it out very well. I had to take 3.5 days extra holiday totally unpaid from my normal job and trust me on this, I earned much less this week casting than i would from my normal day to day job. So ask yourself if money really was a motivating factor? I did it because I wanted to do the event, work with the ESL guys, cast alongside Joe again and bring great coverage to CS 1.6
I was pretty clear that I don't mind critique or even flaming, but personal abuse is beyond the limit of what I will tolerate. My remarks were aimed at the tiny minority who crossed that line, so if you have no respect for me for failing to put up with personal abuse, I would put you in the same category.
Yes fans have a voice and they have a right to criticize when things dont go well, but they dont have the right to abuse people.
/trolledlololololol
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you totally misunderstood almost all of my post. mainly point of it concerned at one of your lines about 'dying game'.
you propably know about 70k people watching stream during final match right?
and propably, you can see that a lot of players, commentators, organisator and lots, LOTS of people trying so hard to keep cs1.6 alive...
so, its very sad to hear this kind of words from final match commentator. and thats propably explain why you were so weak doing this. the main point is simple - main commentator of the biggest event of the year cant be a person who thinks that the game is dying - and this way of thinking is visible in your work.
i can of course agree with you about personal abuse hitting you now, but your words hit whole community.
and its very unpleasant calling at least 70.000 people gaming community 'dying'...
if main commentator of cs says that cs is 'almost dead', i can only be happy now, that ESL - main organisator - doesnt say so.
"/trolledlololololol" ?
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No, your post was a flame fest and insulting, you accused me of doing it for money alone, THAT was your post.
Then you try and change it back on me about the game dying? I did NOT say it was dying, I said "for a game that is almost dead". that doesnt mean I want it to die or that it is dead.
It is you who is misunderstanding.
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+- can agree with you.. Actualy i was on redeyes side, till i read that line.. now im not in any side, it wasnt nice @ all, hare poeple love cs, and you write as professional 1.6 commentator that 1.6 is almoust dead, M8 30K people was watching you and know you as a cs lover or a guy who last thing to say would be cs is almoust dead.. its realy realy not nice and i even would say an imature comment...
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I think you read what the troll said. I said "the game is almost dead". Thats just how it is, whether you like it or not, thats the reality.
It doesnt mean I want it to die or even that I hope it dies, I dont, but being honest about it.
Hopefully ESL and WCG and others will give it one more season before it gets replaced, that would be my hope.
Just because you read what the troll wrote doesnt make it what I wrote...
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Well it should hurt more guys like you who are on pro scene :), semi level probably won't die junk lan's / cup's can always be made and played by numberous of teams.
Still its not an excuse what redeye told, from pro player telling me that cs is almoust dead i would't mind, but from commentator who is commentating thousand's of people, as i mentioned its not nice to hear..
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Haters gonna hate. Every community has its retards, Nevermind them. You did well (and i think you know that yourself). At least i thoroughly enjoyed the coverage that i was able to watch.
you doing great job but you really need somebody to watch players, show map etc
i`ve used mute function because of the quality of the commentary. no option for me to solve the camera issue. 6/10 cast, 2/10 commentary by you and joe. and if you are not fit to do it for 10 str8 hours, say pass next time. thx in advance.
Oh and one of the reasons the camera is better when its me and Joe is because I have the overlay up 100% of the time on my screen, which enables Joe and I to see the action and move to it as it happens. Lurppis prefers to use his to find things going on for analysis during and after the round. That makes it a lot different to when Joe and I do it.
The complaints in this thread also amount to 0.03% of the viewers, which in the grand scheme of things is not much, especially when I more than you know understand you can't please ALL of the people ALL of the time.
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you are a great caster,don't get bothered by trollers.
Don't worry about it, I am sure most people here appreciate the hard work you and other commentators do, a lot of the stuff on this site just comes from idiots with nothing better to do.
People will always whine and ceh9 has been called everything you can imagine for the last couple of years because people either don't like his behaviour during matches or the way he plays, every single week there is a new thread with "minus X from team Y", mostly kids who don't really love the game as much as they love getting attention.
Commentating will never be perfect in a fast paced game like CS and neither is watching HLTV. It is impossible to catch all the action and people always exaggerate whenever somebody is streaming. I have enjoyed the streaming very much this event, especially when lurppis has been with one of you guys and I know a lot of people feel the same way.
well i along many others think you're doing a very good job, and you are quite good entertainer.
as far as criticism goes, i don't think lurppis instead of joe was a good idea, for the reason you just said. when we watch on a stream all we want is to see as much actions(so we can see for ourselves the technicals behind. people who actually know something about the game are not stupid after all and don't need to be explained such details) and i guess one of the roles of a good shoutcaster is to transmit to the audience the emotions around the game(which part you are doing very well).
also people claiming you got no technical knowledge on the game, or that you suck or whatever...don't worry neither have them but it looks cool to throw shit on others work.
sorry for my primitive english, and keep up, you are great!
You're one of my favourite commentators. So, just keep your work! :)
P.S. pretty good nickname btw :P Redeye
what a wonderful way to deal with critics, "they're only 0.03% so who cares" :D very professional and productive indeed!
I'm forced to watch German stream instead of this because this redeye guy
-can't control the camera (he has a gift to always look on the opposite site of map than where is the action; and no, it's not a "commentator's curse" as he likes to label it, it's just lacking sense for the game)
-shows POV of team on full eco
-follows a player for 2 minutes JUST because he scored 3 or more frags in the previous round, regardless of what he does in current round (there's no adrenaline mode in CS, you know)
-sometimes I prefer the commentator to shut up, especially in 1on1 situations so I can hear the game sounds
-I don't know how you guys but I really don't need to hear who fragged who. I CAN SEE THAT. speaking of which so many times he mistakes the players who fragged / was fragged.
-he's trying to do game/player analysis but doesn't possess required game knowledge to do so (2 rounds for T on train is "just enough, never expects forced buy after lost first round etc)
-gets overexcited very easily, even after boring frags (OK I agree this is completely subjective)
-shows overview WAY too much , it's really sufficient to show it for 2 seconds and anyone who plays CS for longer than 1 year will understand what's going on); I remember he showed overview several times during attack on a plant
Mr. Redeye call me a "hater" , I don't care, but maybe the reason this thread exists is that you considered people like me or other critics "haters" and failed to progress in your commentating skill by simply being defensive and sensitive to all negative feedback.
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please, reply to me when you'll be able to translate at least 20% of what I wrote. besides, you seem to care when you took your time and replied to me. last, I wasn't talking to you , I was directing my post to Redeye, so to use your logic, "if you don't like my post don't read / reply to it" . I understand that this kind of commentary may be interesting for beginner players like you, but most of people who watch it actually know what's going on on the map and are interested in more detailed description.
the issue with HLTV in general is that you have to scroll through players you cannot just press 0-9 and get all ten players that way, you have to quickly click through and proably miss the action either way if its a fast round, and auto director is proably the worst thing ever following nades/bomb to the ground xD
Lurppis and ReDeYe was the best combination imo.
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redeye is EXPERT... he knows what he's doing, you iritated children get annoyed almost at every thing... I would see you doing his job...
redeye just doesn't understand shit.
seriously why ppl is calling him expert? for what reason?
I like RedEye commentating :) i like he`s voice , his very proffesional , and about missing the action , its impossible to switch camera between players in action , and guessing which of them will kill enemy or do awesome action , sometimes when i watch a demo i need to repeat some rounds because i miss some good kills or moves , i think he switch camera to overview very often because he wants to show peoples what strategies teams are doing in each round , so i think its very proffesional :)i think RedEye and Joe are the best commentators right now , i think lurrpis is great too but i think hes not talking as much as them , and their voices are dA_b357!!
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he is a commentator, he was picked because of his voice. but this dosent mean he was decent for this job. having a voice simply aint good enough!
Controlling a camera is not as easy as it might seem lolz
usually casters like to have an overview of the map + the fp they're spectating, so that way it's easier to guess where the action will happen...if you have only view, it's virtually impossible to find all the actions, since switching to overview in the middle of the action is not pleasant for the viewers and that way probably all the action will be missed anyways!
But anyways hatersg0nnahate
I do really pity this thread. Like what the hell? Aren't you happy, that people try to make an event better for you? Don't you see they're doing this to support our beloved game? You ought to thank this man. I really think he has done all that he could and even MUCH MUCH more than you have yet done in your life.
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