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2015 Fnatic vs Current Astralis
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Belgium 69Savage 
Who would win if they played a BO5 today?
2018-07-13 00:35
fnatic
2018-07-13 00:36
#5
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Belgium 69Savage 
Why?
2018-07-13 00:37
#53
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Croatia mds818 
because old fnatic dominated literally everyone, they had the same chances of winning force buy rounds against full buys as if it was full buy vs full buy, olof was a god that noone could touch, krimz and olof= best hold ever, flusha killed everyone through the smoke, jw pushed like an idiot and rekt everyone, you couldn't escape their timeout comebacks etc etc tldr point being: they were so dominant that w/e if u were up 15 0 or down 15 0 it still felt like they already won the map
2018-07-13 01:05
+1 And pronax did legendary mid round calls in every round. Fnatic of 2015 was insane.
2018-07-13 01:48
#107
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Croatia mds818 
tbh its impossible to explain something what people never saw....
2018-07-13 01:49
Check out POV videos from Fnatic from 2015. You'll find videos with english subs and you can hear the calls which he does. This clip is one of the POVs from inferno in the major final. Check it out. youtube.com/watch?v=qN5JZ25dxcA
2018-07-13 10:00
#200
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Croatia mds818 
Obviously there were calls but im talking about the some older fnatic because they got to the point when those comms were not really needed(both players and casters confirmed it..) but that could be with dennis
2018-07-13 10:15
#225
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Portugal macpjoao 
Yeah I don't think there's yet been a team as dominant as that fnatic team. SK came close, but they didn't win as many back to back tournaments. btw good luck for Croatia in the WC!
2018-07-13 11:33
#234
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Croatia mds818 
+1 and ty
2018-07-13 13:42
Why weren't the dennis lineup as successful then?
2018-07-13 17:07
#245
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Lithuania DieNastyA 
compared to 2015 they were not successful
2018-07-13 18:16
That's what i'm saying....
2018-07-13 21:31
#251
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Croatia mds818 
mainly because there was no in game leader and the strong voice within team, you didn't have anyone to calm them down.. having 6 tournament wins in a row, losing one and gg we have to split up...
2018-07-13 21:33
#110
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North America KiNGa_da_ACE 
I think it would be a great bo5 but I think Astralis wins the majority of the time. Fnatic was rolling over teams but those teams weren’t as strong as faze Navi SK etc. glaive isn’t as good a igl as pronax but he’s a better fragging igl. Olof is the X factor. Besides him astralis matches up pretty well.
2018-07-13 01:52
#112
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Belgium 69Savage 
I’d argue that gla1ve is one of the best IGL’s ever
2018-07-13 01:53
#115
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North America KiNGa_da_ACE 
He will be top 3 by the end of his career. Started watching pro cs in 2016, but weren’t Fnatic pretty good before or after pronax?
2018-07-13 01:54
Both before and after, 6 consecutive tournament wins after dennis joined.
2018-07-13 11:17
#118
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Croatia mds818 
this is a yes and no... this is the(imo) retarded new meta where its all about getting 4 aiming bots and 1 igl=gg u have a team.. but what you are forgetting is that everyone was a x factor back there yes olof was the star player but there was noone falling behind(excluding pronax obviously but..) also, what you're doing wrong is comparing the current form of fnatic players(in a way) with the current form of astralis players... but if you compared 2015 form it would be other story..
2018-07-13 01:57
#178
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North America KiNGa_da_ACE 
Idk Fnatics 2015 roster seems to be the only players that still play at a high level in 2018. Olof krimz and flusha are all still star players. Jw not as much. But gtr, f0rest, vp, the whole French scene don’t look that good since competition started to rise. They are the only team, pre LG/SK, that would still be competitive today. EDIT: the Swedish shuffle really hurt them two. Sweden became almost irrelevant for awhile.
2018-07-13 06:38
#181
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Croatia mds818 
well true but fnatic destroyed themselves by not being able to suck up their ego and hold the #2 spot for more than one tournament..
2018-07-13 06:49
#193
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Germany LE_N3RD 
You know that fnatic crushed SK in finals and beat them in another finals or semi. They also beat SK/LG 16-0. fnatic lost only once to SK on inferno but the match was meaningless. NaVi couldn‘t get over 6 rounds vs fnatic in 95% of all their matches. Nt
2018-07-13 09:18
#253
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North America KiNGa_da_ACE 
While they were young and still establishing themselves. It woulda been great if it were prime SK. I still think Fnatic woulda beat them. And Fnatic is the only team pre-SK era that would still be competitive and winning titles
2018-07-13 23:54
no they were literally better
2018-07-13 11:44
#254
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North America KiNGa_da_ACE 
Thank you for supporting your opinion with facts.
2018-07-13 23:55
acting like you gave facts when its all opinion and asssumption, teams back then where training as much if not even more than now and everyone knew how to perfectly play the game unlike during the nip era
2018-07-14 13:36
#124
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Lithuania AndriusCrazy 
+1
2018-07-13 02:02
#123
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Lithuania Sedge 
they had the best players , its like a team now having s1mple, guardian, niko and the other top players... but they all speak the same language and have good chemistry.
2018-07-13 02:01
#2
GuardiaN | 
North America Gc_29 
fnatic
2018-07-13 00:36
#6
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Belgium 69Savage 
Why?
2018-07-13 00:37
#16
GuardiaN | 
North America Gc_29 
fnatic beat whoever, whenever, they didn't need tactics to win, they crushed teams with pure skill, something that astralis struggles against
2018-07-13 00:38
#23
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Belgium 69Savage 
Back then, TSM usually gave Fnatic a run for their money. I think this Astralis is the highest level of CS we’ve ever seen
2018-07-13 00:41
#27
GuardiaN | 
North America Gc_29 
thats irrelevant because of the different igl, karrigan and gla1ve are the complete opposite of one another, the teams are very different, plus that was back then we're talking abt the current astralis
2018-07-13 00:44
#31
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Belgium 69Savage 
Just stating that TSM was able to challenge Fnatic. Current Astralis is leagues above TSM, so yeah
2018-07-13 00:45
#35
GuardiaN | 
North America Gc_29 
duh but again, the styles are completely different, just because astralis is "leagues above" TSM doesn't mean that they could do the same things that TSM did to "challenge" Fnatic
2018-07-13 00:47
#50
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Croatia mds818 
envyus used to win majors so yeah....
2018-07-13 01:03
#51
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Belgium 69Savage 
Yes you are correct
2018-07-13 01:04
#113
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North America KiNGa_da_ACE 
110
2018-07-13 01:53
Virtus pro
2018-07-13 00:36
#7
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Belgium 69Savage 
Ahh yes
2018-07-13 00:37
Yes
2018-07-13 00:37
#4
Xyp9x | 
Brazil Jeanzera 
Bo5 Astralis Bo3 fnatic
2018-07-13 00:37
#79
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Europe p1peb0mb 
on those times there was no nuke and cobble was in mappool. fnatic was like current astralis. they could play in all map and choose maps based on opponents mappool. thats same with current astralis. so you cannot give such advantage on bo3 or bo5 to either teams.
2018-07-13 01:26
#82
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Belgium 69Savage 
Shorter game = more chance of an upset
2018-07-13 01:27
#87
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Europe p1peb0mb 
its not upset if they play on those times because of 2015 mappool and weapon meta. fnatic will have advantage.
2018-07-13 01:30
#8
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Sweden hltvking 
being a fan of the swedish teams it's pretty obvious that Astralis would stomp the fuck out of 2015 fnatic although their era is much more impressive than what Astralis has accomplished
2018-07-13 00:37
#14
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Belgium 69Savage 
Yeah I agree completely
2018-07-13 00:38
#83
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Europe p1peb0mb 
not if astralis play on mappool of 2015, and weapon meta on 2015.in that case fnatic have advantage. if we play on current mappool and current meta,astralis have advantage.
2018-07-13 01:28
#88
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Sweden hltvking 
astralis today would just need 1 bootcamp to play around fnatic with ease, wouldn't even be funny. -
2018-07-13 01:30
#90
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Europe p1peb0mb 
fnatic don't even bootcamped in those days. thats how they played. they don't need tactic's. they had peak olof,flusha,krimz and jw. is the roster with dennis,they will have peak dennis too. current astralis is their peak. all or most of the team is in their peak.
2018-07-13 01:32
#91
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Sweden hltvking 
they didn't need tactics because of the state of the scene , they would get demolished by so many top teams today. theres a reason they are barely top 10 these days
2018-07-13 01:34
#101
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Europe p1peb0mb 
they are not barely top 10 these days. they are in current position because of lost points in shuffle. they were one of the consistent teams of the year. they did't won just by tactics. they won by skill and teamplay just like astralis's team play. even when they split for the first time,they were reaching semis and finals. after that they didn't regained that teamplay and again changed a fuck tun of times. also state of the scene was really competitive at that time. just like current top scene. now we have astralis,navi and faze solid top teams with teams like liquid,mouz,fnatic,mibr etc following them.in 2015, we had fnatic,NV,vp and tsm as top teams with navi,nip,titan,c9 etc following them. if you get current astralis in 2015, that fnatic will beat them just like current astralis beat that fnatic in 2018. in 2018 we have peak astralis and in 2015 we had peak fnatic.
2018-07-13 01:45
#111
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Croatia mds818 
tbh its impossible to explain... i tried
2018-07-13 01:52
#168
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Sweden hltvking 
csgo is out for longer teams get better to counter other teams, fnatics style is old af and outdated. would never work today because teams are simply too good, it's not harder than this. this is why astralis would penetrate fnatic today but why fnatics run still is the most impressive one. if u think that fnatic could play like they did in 2015 vs any top team your in delusion, the counters and setups are simply too good and well-oiled for such a style to work.
2018-07-13 02:55
#171
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Europe p1peb0mb 
do you think current setup will work in 2015? it won't. there were many changes from 2015 to 2018. in that time that syyle workrd. today current style works. in future this style may not work. last year sk was in astralis's position. everyone was saying they are the best team ever and no one caan match them with their style, now look at them. meta changes everytime. if 2015 fnatic fight against astalis in current meta,astralis may win and if they fight in 2015 meta,fnatic will win
2018-07-13 03:00
#172
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Belgium 69Savage 
Obviously. I’m asking about 2015 Fnatic vs 2018 Astralis. Therefore, they will each play their own game, based on a different meta.
2018-07-13 03:03
#173
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Europe p1peb0mb 
based on what meta? what versions of maps? what versions of weapons? what versions of mappool. you can't find a middleground. everything changed vastly
2018-07-13 03:05
#190
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Macedonia AstralisGoat 
It wouldn't work? Tell that to FaZe who are basically a budget Fnatic 2015.
2018-07-13 07:56
#195
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Sweden hltvking 
.... faze are the biggest underachivers in the scene xD
2018-07-13 10:02
#202
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Macedonia AstralisGoat 
Still won lots of titles and consistently get top 4 finishes in most LANs even playing with stand ins.
2018-07-13 10:27
#205
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Sweden hltvking 
fnatic also won things during their post 2015 era time, doesn't prove anything. this style doesn't work and thats why teams like faze get read around
2018-07-13 10:46
#206
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Macedonia AstralisGoat 
No the games I see FaZe lose is not because they got read it's because they have an IGL who isn't a strategist, they play way to predictable which would be fine if they could ALWAYS hit their shots but they can't so other team will easily out aim them when they are playing bad. Karrigan is really known for his fundamentals, he likes to play loose style, mid round calls etc he's a budget Pronax and FaZe playing a single pug style with set pieces and light tactics that Fnatic was playing in 2015. Difference is they haven't had a stable lineup in months going with stand ins etc and still getting results which shows Karrigan can really utilize anyone even if their as shit as Xizt & Cromen.
2018-07-13 10:51
#208
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Sweden hltvking 
look at faze overtimes and u will see what karrigan lacks. actual leaderships and actual tactics. he let's people do what they want for 1:20 minutes and obv in ot ur not getting anything for free so they end up doing a average shit execute and gets stomped everytime. this is why faze never was a great team and never will be until they get a igl that makes these players play the meta
2018-07-13 10:55
#210
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Macedonia AstralisGoat 
Look I hate Karrigan as much as the next guy since his Fnatic days I've hated him but he can take any shit player and incorporate him into the lineup in such a short amount of time whilst giving good results with an unstable roster I think that is merit enough. Sure he lacks in tactics but he also doesn't have a team with players who are good in that style either his players are pug stars like NiKo and Rain obviously we know Guardian plays well in heavy executions and crazy ct holds from 2015 Na'vi when Starix was making them insane strats but rest of the team isn't at their best in that play style so he is doing the right thing there. The meta right now is pug it's obvious that's why what Astralis does is blowing us away because theyre the only team that doesn't run around like retards and try to chase frags, they are very structured and tactics based relying on team play not individual performance no one else in the top 10 right now is playing like that the meta is pure FPL pug CS and I'm grateful for Astralis.
2018-07-13 11:01
astralis 3 - 1 Fnatic 2 ot games
2018-07-13 00:37
vp flair in 2018 btw
2018-07-13 00:40
astralis
2018-07-13 00:37
But it depends on whether fnatic would have the same form and skill as in 2015 or just the 5 players with their 2018 self? If its earlier i can definetly see fnatic winning it because Astralis still loves to lose close games and fnatic was always a clutch team,so they would most likely get on top if they make it close. But if its the latter,flusha has to have another katowice like performance if they want to have a chance
2018-07-13 01:24
#92
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Belgium 69Savage 
2015 version of the team
2018-07-13 01:35
fnatic and it would not be even funny how is it would be
2018-07-13 00:37
#13
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United States jcv999 
Astralis if given time to prepare Fnatic if they played tomorrow
2018-07-13 00:37
#18
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Belgium 69Savage 
A reasonable point, given the fact that Astralis rely on their strategy and knowledge on the other team
2018-07-13 00:39
#20
NiKo | 
Montenegro G1EX 
+1 Best answer so far, fnatic destroyed teams with their skill, while current Astralis (not saying they are not skilled, on the contrary, they are monsters) rely more on tactics and preparation.
2018-07-13 00:40
#22
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United States jcv999 
TY Mr.Montenegro
2018-07-13 00:41
Fnatic
2018-07-13 00:38
#17
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Ukraine ksay 
danish would choke 2015 fnatic never choke ez fnatic
2018-07-13 00:39
#26
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Belgium 69Savage 
2015 danes choke, not this Astralis
2018-07-13 00:43
kappa
2018-07-13 00:44
#19
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United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
The comparison is inept, as fnatic won everything down to aim-duels, whereas Astralis are just tactically outclassing everyone. It would definitely be a tussle, but I think fnatic would come out on top.
2018-07-13 00:40
#24
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Belgium 69Savage 
I wouldn’t call it inept, as the contrast in style is something you can easily theorize on.
2018-07-13 00:43
#37
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United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
The meta is also completely different... I think NiP of 2013 is the strongest team to have ever existed in CS:GO, but that was a very dated and long time ago. 2015 fnatic proved you can win every aim-duel with precise timing and good calls (pronax-style) and LG/SK proved you don't have to be the worlds best players to beat another team. Astralis currently have the perfect counter to everything and are tactically masterful in every situation. That and everyone on the team is on form; both strategically and aim-wise. Magisk and Dupreeh are the stars of the team for me.
2018-07-13 00:49
#43
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Belgium 69Savage 
NiP was the most dominant in a time where competition was low. 2015 Fnatic had several contenders, just the same as Astralis has now.
2018-07-13 00:59
#158
NiKo | 
Montenegro G1EX 
+1 to this and to your post above Also, thank you for your contribution to hltv forums, I always enjoy your posts my friend.
2018-07-13 02:43
#191
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Macedonia AstralisGoat 
"Astralis currently have the perfect counter to everything" They don't have the counter to electronic not at the last tournament at least basically beat them on his own.
2018-07-13 07:58
Scene is progressive, doesn't stand in one place. Current Astralis is the best team this game ever knew.
2018-07-13 00:43
#28
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Belgium 69Savage 
Yes I agree
2018-07-13 00:44
Astralis purely because tsm beat fnatic pretty often and the players currently are far better then they were on tsm
2018-07-13 00:44
#32
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Belgium 69Savage 
Plus the IGL god gla1ve
2018-07-13 00:46
And i assume we are talking about pronax fnatic which means even if devve and dupreeh < olof flusha They are better overall since pronax is a bigger bot then zeus Pretty much all the astralis players are top 10 rating wise in the last 3 months that is absurd domination that csgo probably has never seen considering every top team in its history had a complete bot on it
2018-07-13 00:49
#33
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Brazil FaelEz 
Astralis because it knows new strategies, but Fnatic also has a chance
2018-07-13 00:46
#34
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Turkey SLendeRuLeZ 
Back then they used to rely a lot in individual performances, and a team such Fnatic with the mentality of 2015 wouldn't care about how good the team tactics of a team 2 years ahead of them is, they just gonna push and kill them.
2018-07-13 00:47
#36
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Belgium 69Savage 
This is why #13 has a point. Given time to prepare, Astralis could play around the aggresive playstyle of Fnatic.
2018-07-13 00:48
#67
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Croatia mds818 
the point being is that you can't prepare from that you can't prepare on that, if you watched them play... just check out inferno fnatic vs vp cologne 2015 how can you prepare against a team which is going to push on ct and t side randomly without any calculated timing or anything, or awper who's going to rush you on close range.... etc
2018-07-13 01:12
#73
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Belgium 69Savage 
You’re talking as if Fnatic were literal gods. Remember that TSM was able to Challenge Fnatic. Current Dupreeh and Magisk are capable of contending in aim-duels. And you can prepare by playing more calculated and heavily defensive, and I’m sure god gla1ve would be able to crack them down.
2018-07-13 01:21
#75
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Croatia mds818 
underline T S M, you can either pick TSM or Astralis against them you cant pick TSM but with glave... you cant prepare against something what is not calculated... its random push with 0 sense and uhm yes they were gods, 24/26 top4 and 17 titles including 2 majors in
2018-07-13 01:23
#80
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Belgium 69Savage 
Sure, they achieved the most, but they were not borderline unbeatable. And you are talking as if Fnatic players basically had no mics, and all solo-ramboed constantly. There was undoubtedly tactics behind, no matter how shallow they might have been.
2018-07-13 01:26
#86
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Croatia mds818 
yes there were tactics but the point being is that(and everyone can confirm you that) that there was next to no communication they used mics at the timeouts but other than that they were quiet because everyone knew what they were doing and everything if u dont belive me check out some interviews and comments from casters/analysts
2018-07-13 01:29
#94
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Belgium 69Savage 
They didn’t need top-tactics due to the general state of CS back then. I believe today, they would be overwhelmed by the structure and discipline of Astralis.
2018-07-13 01:37
#97
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Croatia mds818 
back then navi was hands down best tactical team there and they executed the site on 15 sec remaining and they still won it every round so don't talk about the structure and discipline... go watch some demos from 2015 and you will see what I'm talking about... its impossible to explain unless u were watching the scene
2018-07-13 01:40
#98
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Belgium 69Savage 
Oh I was watching the scene, and by no means am I saying that they were undisciplined. They just don’t compare to current Astralis
2018-07-13 01:41
#103
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Croatia mds818 
because astralis make all the possible comebacks etc? come on.. Lets put it this way... cologne 2015 Fnatic #1 team Envy #2 VP #3.. you had vp with countless expirience in semi final against fnatic with huge crowd behind them(best crowd i have ever seen tbh) First map vp rekts fnatic 16 2 Second map vp is up 13-8 fnatic calls timeout> 13 16 Last map> vp gets deleted Grand final envyus vs fnatic> envyus is up 15 9>fnatic calls timeout= envyus loses 15 19 and gets deleted on second map... when fnatic called timeout it was equal to team activating wallhack and aimbot.. you don't have this anymore you can't get away with that(and noone else could tbh even back then) you can't compare something what was impossible to beat to a great team in quite the competitive era
2018-07-13 01:47
#39
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Canada Skadiddle 
Major wining cloud9 would smack both of them
2018-07-13 00:49
#41
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Belgium 69Savage 
Unstoppable
2018-07-13 00:56
Astralis for sure
2018-07-13 00:51
#42
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Poland dreamShow 
3-0 fnatic 16-0 16-14 16-0
2018-07-13 00:59
#44
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Belgium 69Savage 
Hahahah, which maps tho
2018-07-13 00:59
#47
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Poland dreamShow 
any maps, during 2nd map fnatic will play without mouses
2018-07-13 01:01
#49
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Belgium 69Savage 
Which I assume is why Astralis got 14 lucky rounds?
2018-07-13 01:02
#52
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Poland dreamShow 
not lucky, till 0-14 score fnatic plays without keyboards and screens too. many Xv1 lost by swedish side also
2018-07-13 01:04
#55
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Belgium 69Savage 
Man what a game
2018-07-13 01:05
#68
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Croatia mds818 
genius
2018-07-13 01:13
Agency office canals
2018-07-13 01:02
#45
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Sweden ericlindberg 
fnatic 48-14
2018-07-13 00:59
2018 astralis claps 2015 fnatic
2018-07-13 01:00
#54
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United Kingdom dcrawford101 
FNATIC OFC
2018-07-13 01:05
it cannot even be compared like this 'cause of a lot of reasons
2018-07-13 01:05
#59
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Belgium 69Savage 
I agree to an extent, but do you care to enlighten me?
2018-07-13 01:06
fnatic would win against astralis but not against NA
2018-07-13 01:06
ez Astralis
2018-07-13 01:06
#60
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Europe H0wLinqDawN 
2015 olof > astralis Don't even need fnatic
2018-07-13 01:07
#63
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Belgium 69Savage 
2018 s1mple > 2015 olof 2018 Astralis > 2018 s1mple 2018 Astralis > 2015 olof Nah just kidding
2018-07-13 01:09
#223
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CIS Sm1leyw0w 
2018 S1mple n Electronic > 2018 Astralis How can they beat Fnatic if they can’t beat two
2018-07-13 11:28
#241
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Belgium 69Savage 
They won because of Zeus
2018-07-13 18:14
#243
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CIS Sm1leyw0w 
See what happens next time lol
2018-07-13 18:15
#236
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Europe H0wLinqDawN 
"2018 s1mple > 2015 olof" 0/8
2018-07-13 14:03
#242
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Belgium 69Savage 
It’s true lol, s1mple is the most skilled to ever touch the game
2018-07-13 18:14
#248
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Europe H0wLinqDawN 
Sure
2018-07-13 19:33
#85
Sadokist | 
Poland tr1xx 
2015 olof > 2018 olof 2015 > 2018 confirmed Imma get the Fields Medal
2018-07-13 01:29
#61
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Germany zeolikk 
fnatic
2018-07-13 01:07
ofc astralis teamplay better
2018-07-13 01:08
#64
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Belgium 69Savage 
Everything checks out But I agree
2018-07-13 01:18
#70
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Croatia mds818 
bruh if ur going to agree on astralis winning and ???? on fnatic winning at least give me the reply why
2018-07-13 01:17
#65
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United States XEROcs_ 
Fnatic, Astralis choke gods LUL
2018-07-13 01:10
Fnatic more raw potential, but Astralis more tactical. BO1/BO3 fnatic for sure. BO5? Ez 4 Astralis.
2018-07-13 01:11
#143
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Europe p1peb0mb 
2015 fnatic had the best mappol just like 2018. both team could play well in all maps. in 2015 nuke was not in mappool and in 2018 cobble was not in mappool.
2018-07-13 02:11
#69
device | 
France LauraS 
People forget that TSM were capable of beating Fnatic.
2018-07-13 01:15
#71
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Croatia mds818 
yes they were without a doubt, but tsm is not astralis... different igl different mentality point is 2018 astralis vs 2015 fnc
2018-07-13 01:18
#77
device | 
France LauraS 
I'm in two minds about it. Firstly because as Na'Vi has shown, the correct amount of mid round/almost random aggression and high individual skill ceilings broke Astralis. And they were some of the important factors that made Fnatic so dominant (I would say Fnatic at that time were easily more skilled than current Na'Vi). The only thing that kind of sways my judgement is how great Astralis is as a tactical team. Like TSM x10, with way better players.
2018-07-13 01:24
#81
 | 
Croatia mds818 
yes I agree with you but my point is.. the current csgo meta has everything combined some pushes some tactical approach etc etc like all 2015 styles combined, but you don't really have players clutching 1v5 with cz or flusha to kill everyone through the smoke and gg.. in normal conditions or if it was any other team you can say astralis but fnatic was something else... noone can deny that
2018-07-13 01:27
#84
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
Maybe we’re not seeing crazy 1v5’s because players and teams have gotten smarter.
2018-07-13 01:29
#89
 | 
Croatia mds818 
well thats true as well... but my point being is that they had it..
2018-07-13 01:31
#72
 | 
Hong Kong DIshsoap_OW 
2015 FNC with pronax
2018-07-13 01:18
fnatic ofc
2018-07-13 01:22
Fnc
2018-07-13 01:25
if they played today with current skill levels on astralis and 2015 skill level on fnatic it would be ez 3-0 for astralis
2018-07-13 01:36
T E C 9 M E I ST E R
2018-07-13 01:39
#96
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
I remember a certain play by olof with tec9, where he rushed out of apps on inferno.. today he would get crushed by PRINCE OF PIT magiskboy
2018-07-13 01:40
Also the tec 9 now is a lot shittier compared the the 2015 one.
2018-07-13 01:51
astralis 3-0, even though this is the least impressive "era" of them all and fnatics one was maybe the best (excluding nip 87-0)
2018-07-13 01:42
#100
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
Yeah undoubtedly the most godlike era, Nip was impressive, but had worse competition
2018-07-13 01:44
Not saying astralis would necessarily win but people overrate fnatic so hard and it is usually people who signed up in 2017
2018-07-13 01:47
#122
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Premier_Tou.. JUST CHECK THE PREMIER EVENTS IN 2015. AND 2018. YOU CAN SEE WHO S OVERRATED.
2018-07-13 02:01
there were more tourneys in 2015 and astralis refuses to go to low level tourneys unlike fnatic they were obviously an incredible team but people on this site acted like they won 16-2 every match while they got shat on several times by nv and tsm
2018-07-13 02:13
#151
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
+1 If astralis attended low-level tourneys, they could rack up unlimited trophies
2018-07-13 02:19
#153
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
those are premier tournaments just like current premier tournaments. those were not low level. they were just like current astralis now. also astralis will go to non premier events like blast series twice this year in coming months. fnatic also gone to few events just like current astralis.
2018-07-13 02:37
does not change the fact that there were far more tournaments in 2015
2018-07-13 02:38
#161
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
fnatic won won 9/20 premier events they gone to 2015. astralis won 3/7 premier events they gone to 2018. they are almost same in that category but are you sure that astralis will win around 4 in remaining 10 premier events that is coming? let them do that first then start to compare. not when they just won 3 events.
2018-07-13 02:50
different era, meta and teams but most of all astralis dont have the incredibly powerful weapons that fnatic had and yes i am very sure they will
2018-07-13 02:52
#165
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
I think it’ll be close
2018-07-13 02:52
where are you even getting your numbers liquipedia keeps track of all relevant tourneys and they only mark 10
2018-07-13 02:43
#163
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Premier_Tou.. just check premier events........
2018-07-13 02:52
yeah there is 10 but you said 17 earlier
2018-07-13 02:53
#169
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
when?
2018-07-13 02:55
yeah sorry i got you confused with someone else
2018-07-13 02:59
fnatic 2015 best cs go team
2018-07-13 01:48
#106
 | 
Brazil davidS_ 
2015 fnatic > 2017 SK > 2018 astralis > 2012 nip /close
2018-07-13 01:49
#108
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
/open 2018 Astralis > 2015 Fnatic > 2016/17 SK > 2012/13 NiP
2018-07-13 01:50
While the 2012 NIP was good, the only real reason that they went 87 and 0 was because it was still very early on in CSGO’s lifetime, and most people were still playing 1.6/Source
2018-07-13 01:54
#117
 | 
Brazil davidS_ 
it's still an impressive thing to achieve
2018-07-13 01:57
Indeed
2018-07-13 02:41
#116
 | 
Brazil davidS_ 
astralis aint that good, they got destroyed by faze at iem sydney, navi at cologne and almost lost to g2 in cologne as well but let me add this: mibr core > Astralis core 2014/15 fnatic > 2016/17 SK/LG > February - June 2018 astralis > 2012/2013 NiP
2018-07-13 01:56
#120
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
I’d say that the 2 cores are at equal terms. And I guess we have to disagree on the list ;)
2018-07-13 01:59
#125
 | 
Brazil davidS_ 
I mean, MiBR core is better on accomplishments, and if you go head to head i think mibr takes on a little difference Btw fallen knows how to play against astralis imo, even when they have a shit moment they can make a good run at astralis, just look at SK vs Astralis at epl s7 finals
2018-07-13 02:02
#152
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
I guess you can argue for both sides. Let’s see after the summer tournies and the major, maybe things will have changed.
2018-07-13 02:24
#119
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
how many events did astralis win on 2018? just 3 nip won 10 in 2013, fnatic won 10 in 2015,sk won 8 in 2017 even navi won 3 in 2018, and they were more consistent than astralis in 2018. first make sure that astralis is better than navi in 2018.then try to talk about other dominating teams in their era
2018-07-13 01:59
#121
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
Astralis is without a shadow of doubt better than Na’Vi in 2018 so far.
2018-07-13 02:00
#128
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
hltv.org/stats/teams/events/4608/Natus%2.. hltv.org/stats/teams/events/6665/Astrali.. here you go. worst result for navi on LAN is 2018 is semi finals. just check astralis.
2018-07-13 02:03
#135
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
Please check best results, and in what fashion they won it.
2018-07-13 02:06
#139
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
stop giving bullshit like fashion. faze did it on better fashion than astralis last when they won eleague and esl newyork. still sk was the best team of last year. astalis also lost against faze in fashion by going 0-3 in a bo5. actually they are the overrated ones.
2018-07-13 02:09
#142
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
Did you watch the BO5? The matches were extremely close, and minimal margins decided the game. Astralis’ wins were so incredibly dominant
2018-07-13 02:11
#147
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
but they lost 3-0 dude with choking on third map. just like luminosity to lost to fnatic in 2016 on katowice choking 2 maps after 12-3 lead. also remember that faze had a standin and struggled against t3 teams in that tournament.
2018-07-13 02:13
#150
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
The round count was 57-51. That’s pretty close man
2018-07-13 02:16
#155
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
ya but they lost like that to a team with struggles against grayhound,tyloo etc.
2018-07-13 02:39
#156
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
Can’t compare that lol. One team can counter a team better than another can. It says more about Faze than Astralis tbh
2018-07-13 02:41
#167
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
still they didn't win. first lt them win like 7-8 events in a year, tthen start staking. not now. they just won 3 events. less than sk in 2016 and same as nip in 2016.thats not impressive. what if astralis don't win any more tournaments in this year like last year after katowice or like sk after 2016 cologne.
2018-07-13 02:55
#130
 | 
Croatia mds818 
*coughs* 17 *coughs*
2018-07-13 02:04
#160
 | 
Indonesia linekerrr 
Youre talking as if it's 2019 already. Thats just wrong
2018-07-13 02:46
#162
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
then let astralis win more events. you are talking just looking at 3 winning events also.
2018-07-13 02:52
#174
 | 
Indonesia linekerrr 
Well its unfair AND illogical AND stupid to compare events won at a year when the the team has literally only played HALF a year.
2018-07-13 04:11
#183
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
even if we compare the results based on number of events they played, fnatic stands above astralis. by the time cologne ended,fnatic already won 2 majors of he year
2018-07-13 07:28
also doesnt mean anything considering two majors havent passed yet and the roster that we are speaking about didnt form til after the major
2018-07-13 07:30
#187
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
so why is every comparing astralis to fnatic then. they are not event that better than current navi.
2018-07-13 07:50
navi has only 1 full tier 1 title astralis has 3
2018-07-13 07:51
#247
 | 
Europe p1peb0mb 
they have 2 t1 titles. its not their fault astralis,faze etc pulled out from starseries. starseries is a t1 event.its more t1 than ecs
2018-07-13 18:39
#126
twice | 
Korea Tzuyu 
current navi is better
2018-07-13 02:03
#129
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
That’s gonna be a no from me
2018-07-13 02:04
#134
twice | 
Korea Tzuyu 
s1mple is the best player to ever play the game atm tho
2018-07-13 02:06
#137
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
Yes for sure, and he can always challenge Astralis, but the reason why Na’Vi won, was because of a one-in-a-million performance by Zeus.
2018-07-13 02:08
#145
twice | 
Korea Tzuyu 
i am aware but that shit just happens nothing u can do shouldnt be held against them
2018-07-13 02:11
#149
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
I’m not holding it against them, it was a deserved win. It’s however not a strong argument, when comparing the two teams as a whole
2018-07-13 02:12
ez fnatic awp not nerfed tec9 OP p90 stronk
2018-07-13 02:03
#131
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
If we’re talking non-nerfed awp, then both teams could take on kennyS solo and get whooped
2018-07-13 02:05
#133
 | 
Croatia mds818 
i completly forgot about the tec9 doe they used cz all way long excluding tec9meister
2018-07-13 02:06
tec9 was hella strong it was more reliable than the cz
2018-07-13 02:10
#141
 | 
Croatia mds818 
i know... fnc still used cz doe
2018-07-13 02:11
some used it yes but the tec9 was just ohh only few teams would win after winning the pistol
2018-07-13 02:11
#148
 | 
Croatia mds818 
dennis cz flusha cz jw cz olof tec9 krimz and pronax i dont remember
2018-07-13 02:12
#132
 | 
Europe FJUL 
fnatic 2015 best team ever
2018-07-13 02:05
The thought that 2015 fnatic (and any team for that matter) would be able to compete against the current pro scene is laughable at best, three years have passed and pros have gotten a lot better. But always fun to see fanboys being dumb.
2018-07-13 02:07
#138
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
Thank you
2018-07-13 02:09
#184
 | 
Croatia mds818 
underline 2015 fnatic with 2015 peak, not the 2018 olof flusha etc
2018-07-13 07:30
The thing is that u can argue that olof, flusha stayed the same level. They didn't go worse. 2015 didn't have s1mple-electro 2018, niko-rain, magisk 2018
2018-07-13 10:58
#235
 | 
Croatia mds818 
no you can't... yes maybe skill wise if we went 1v1 but the thing is that after Olof returned from his wrist injury he performed well but others were way below their level especially considering their "choke" against VP at the eleague, but the problem being is that when they made shuffle with botsent(at which point they were still the old 2015 fnatic) and came back anyone with any common sense understood what was going on in the "reunited" fnatic, you had olof and dennis covering a site jw flusha and krimz covering b site, pretty much noone rotating, noone helping each other out etc you pretty much could feel the "internal hate" among the players especially while watching their inferno defense
2018-07-13 13:44
If they didn’t get worse, they would still be #1
2018-07-13 15:11
FNATIC MAKE + MAIKELELELELELELE
2018-07-13 04:18
#176
KQLY | 
North America hesh 
fnatic won more tournaments in a row even after -pronax +dennis than astralis have won in 2 years
2018-07-13 04:18
they won 5 premier and astralis have won 6 tourneys in the last 2 years
2018-07-13 10:04
Which gun is glaringly broken and what is the mappool? Probably Astralis anyway
2018-07-13 04:22
ez 4 nip, literally nip's are goat's. stupid hltv kidds from 2000+
2018-07-13 06:47
HOW R U?
2018-07-13 06:47
#182
rain | 
United States TylerLib 
2015 Fnatic vs Astralis Ez win for Faze
2018-07-13 06:52
It doesn’t make sense tho Teams are a lot better today Astralis would rape fnatic
2018-07-13 07:31
#204
 | 
Argentina [Darkaren] 
2015 olof > any astralis player today. Meta is the only change, tec9 is shit and 2nd round forcebuys are the usual, still FNC wins to this Astralis.
2018-07-13 10:35
+1 olof would hit any shot it seemed like he was just godlike
2018-07-13 11:33
except that simple 2018 >> olof 2015 and he doesnt do that
2018-07-13 11:36
yeah s1mple 2018 is better than 2015 olof but compared to everyone else in 2015 olof was so fucking good
2018-07-13 11:56
#189
 | 
Canada Surzz 
both are of different time periods, tough to compare them. current Astralis play smarter and the team has chemistry. old fnatic didn't play as smart, but dominated everyone, and that team had major chemistry. plus, they had olofmeister at his prime.
2018-07-13 07:52
#192
 | 
Macedonia AstralisGoat 
Depends on meta only, not form or anything else because both teams were in their strongest forms in the those time frames. Basically if we go back to 2015 both teams at their peak and playing in 2015 meta, map pool, weapons etc Fnatic would dominate them, if we go 2018 Astralis in this meta, this map pool, these weapons than Astralis would dominate them. The game since those 3 years has many different map updates and weapon balances so I don't think you can compare, also anyone with intelligence knows comparing skill levels in different eras is not viable or consistently possible, there are too many factors at play.
2018-07-13 08:02
fnatik
2018-07-13 10:03
#197
 | 
Austria grammar_nazi 
astralis woud win. TSM was fnatics kryptonite.
2018-07-13 10:03
Fnatic4Life, astralis very very stronk but very very boring !
2018-07-13 10:03
fnatic easily, look who Astralis plays against and sometimes they still lose, Na'Vi who probably lose if electronic or s1mple perform worse, FaZe who had a stand-in for a few months and now they have a player in olof who hasn't even played the game for a long time, so it will take a few months to get back into it probably, then you have Liquid who are so inconsistent and then you have MIBR which again is consistently decent but not even good rn, mouz is better imo but still mouz isn't that good rn either, and then look at the top7, there is ssucha big gap between the #6 and the #7, meanwhile when fnatic dominated you had other teams playing great.
2018-07-13 10:21
navi was literally the same back in 2015 it was either guardian carries or they lose
2018-07-13 11:08
Except that there were other teams, it's to a point where the #3 team is/was much better (cause stand-in now left and olof hasnt played a lot) than the #4 team, and then the #6 team is much better than the #7 one, so yeah, obviously I am talking about rn. In 2015 you had TSM, VP still weren't bad, EnVyUs, NiP still being good, Cloud9 who had their runs and then you have teams like dignitas and Kinguin/G2, also Titan, now not all the teams I mentioned were those elite teams but you get my point.. And fnatic still dominated almost the whole year, meanwhile Astralis just started winning and guess what they time they started winning is just when competition went down, you might think I hate Astralis but I really don't, I think they will stay top3 even if things stabilize in the scene but I don't think in any way they are > 2015 fnatic
2018-07-13 11:16
they didnt dominate that hard nip was terrible after the beginning of the year c9 had three tourneys and the low level teams today are so much better
2018-07-13 11:18
They didn't dominate that hard? hltv.org/stats/teams/events/4991/fnatic?.. hltv.org/stats/teams/events/4991/fnatic?.. ???? Against those teams that is hard domination. This, is by no means terrible: hltv.org/stats/teams/events/4411/NiP?sta.. hltv.org/stats/teams/events/4411/NiP?sta.. I know C9 wasn't amazing btw, I just said they had their moments and runs too making it harder.
2018-07-13 11:21
i meant in comparison to the beginning of the year for nip btw and not all of those are tier 1 btw
2018-07-13 11:27
I know all of those aren't tier1 but a lot are.
2018-07-13 11:38
yeah 10 of them are and i actually made a mistake in my first comment navi today is way better then 2015 purely because simple >> guardian and electronic >>>>>>>>> flamie
2018-07-13 11:39
Well yeah, it's just my opinion btw, you can think differently
2018-07-13 11:40
i understand i just cant see astralis losing to fnatic because of 1 word pronax even if devve, dupreeh, magisk < krimz, olof, flusha xyp9x and gla1ve >>>>>> jw and pronax
2018-07-13 11:42
#203
 | 
Argentina [Darkaren] 
Fnatic can play every map except nuke so Fnc wins. Astralis would choke and rage while Fnatic would just be jumping around with mag 7 and what not.
2018-07-13 10:32
#207
 | 
Sweden s!d_xaxa 
Astralis would beat the shit out of fnatic. Even fragsters would beat the shit out of 2015 fnatic.
2018-07-13 10:51
there's no any good point to looking backwards. because life is keep moving forward u noob shet
2018-07-13 11:01
Situation similar to football. Milan 85-94 was considered best team in history, but if we somehow teleport them into today's reality, not only Madrid but teams like Bayern-Juventus would cripple them
2018-07-13 11:06
today astralis. Fnatic was more dominant in their prime, but astralis gameplay level is beyond.
2018-07-13 11:18
#224
 | 
United Kingdom h4mm 
+1
2018-07-13 11:30
#259
 | 
Belgium 69Savage 
Yes I agree
2018-08-31 00:51
even ignoring that pros get better with time, astralis by far fnatic were the kings of 16-14 also they occasionally got whooped by LDLC, TSM, nV, VP in the end they got a lot of important trophies but not in a dominant fashion
2018-07-13 11:23
Lmao most people here didn't even know CS was a thing when Fnatic dominated your shit scrub teams. Astralis can be broken with firepower, NaVi proved it recently. and if Navi managed that, sure as hell 2015/16 Fnatic would do it.
2018-07-13 11:25
fnatic
2018-07-13 11:27
#240
 | 
Brazil Diego117 
if u really wathced fnatic 2015 u already know the answer
2018-07-13 17:31
#244
 | 
Germany Constikdw 
Well if we consider the individual form: Jw = device Olof > dupreeh Flusha > magisk Krimz > xyp9x Pronax < Gla1ve Would be very close as Astralis is tactcally better but I think Fnatic would make it
2018-07-13 18:16
No chance for chokestralis
2018-07-13 18:17
#250
 | 
Faroe Islands memento_1 
how can you compare 2015 pro scene with 2018? likethe game has got so much depth in those years. playimg vs 2015 team is like playing vs a pug team.
2018-07-13 21:32
#260
Kvik | 
Lithuania andy_ 
+1
2018-08-31 01:15
fnatic
2018-07-13 21:34
#256
 | 
United Kingdom TypicalBrit 
astralis would get smashed 16-0 each map.
2018-07-14 13:37
#257
 | 
Denmark Xipingu 
3-2 Fnatic. Maybe 3-1 if Astralis turn to choke like they did against Navi in Cologne.
2018-07-14 13:40
fnatic was hacking a bit more than astralis now, so fnatic ez
2018-07-14 13:40
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