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Young KennyS VS Zywoo
apEX | 
France insxnity 
Found this old post while wandering on Reddit : What is your opinion on this ? Do you think Zywoo has a lot more potential than Kenny ? I know the context is very different and they have very different playstyles and roles but I tought it would still be an interesting question to ask.
2019-01-18 01:43
China Slasher8888 
I would say yes. Judging by Zywoo's recent performance, he probably has way more potential than KennyS. Maybe because i personally think kennys is extremely overrated, but kennyS needs to be more stable.
2019-01-18 01:46
"Kennys is overrated" You realize the reason he is overrated atm is because people sometimes hype him up to be at the level that we are talking about. The level he had in the early days of CS:GO.
2019-01-18 12:45
KennyS actually didn't consistently perform that well against top teams. Even his highlight videos are full of noobfests, like the knife kill on inferno or the 2v1 clutch on cobble. KennyS Pre-AWP nerf: Leaderboard at his peak: (Ps. No one cares about games with low tier teams) Olofmeister. Same period: Coldzera 2016 and 17: GTR 12, 13 and 14: S1mple 2018:
2019-01-18 15:59
Sooo uhm...what does all those players have to do with the topic? nt BR boy having to make everything a discussion about Coldzera :) Point is that there has never been a more dominant awper than KennyS at his peak imo. Obviously a case could be made for S1mple, but Kenny had a 1.27 overall rating in 2014 on LAN. So what are you talking about when you say he didn't consistently perform at his peak? btw all your stats are from a very spesific period, from june of 2014 to march of 2015? Why? Trying to spin the narrative?
2019-01-18 16:40
Well, it’s just that rating should be for big events. Why would you care about games against tier 3 teams at a time with few really strong teams? If that was the case, Xantares ratings are also amazing in 2016 I’m comparing with other great players. Is it too hard for you to understand? You’re the hater who could only see my flag and coldzera’s name.
2019-01-18 16:42
You're new to the scene right? Over half the events at that time was not considered "big events" even though they were stacked af. Just look at the teams...only tournament that had some t3 teams was the ESEA tournaments. Stop trying so hard to spin the narrative.
2019-01-18 16:42
Ok, so compare the “lan” events from kennys 2014 with s1mple and cold big events in 2018 and 2017 respectively Kenny had 72% rating above 1, simple had 85% and cold 80% The period of time chosen before was taking kennys prime. On April there was the awp nerf. If anything I was trying to be fair and not “spin the narrative “, remove the tinfoil plz.
2019-01-18 17:06
Of couse i'm not saying that KennyS was an overall better player than Coldzera and S1mple...only an idiot would make that statement. All i'm saying is that a clear argument can be made for KennyS' at his peak beeing the best awper of all time. So don't compare him "stat v stat" with hybrid's... Also, i don't know who told you that KennyS' peak was in any other team than Titan. But they lied to you. This would be the average over the year he was in Titan. However he peaked higher than his average during his stay there. Which is what people refer to as his "peak". Also the context; He was hard carrying his veteran shit players, apart from Apex, Just like S1mple is doing atm... My tinfoil will stay off my head for now. Maybe you should check yours.
2019-01-18 17:15
Indonesia FinZzz 
What?? KennyS overrated. The dude had the highest peak in all of CSGO history. No one comes close.
2019-01-18 12:58
no lol
2019-01-18 13:32
zywoo's peak is higher tho
2019-01-18 13:59
United States SweatyBawlz 
S1mple this year > KennyS's peak
2019-01-18 14:02
s1mple peak is higher, but he is #2 in terms of peak for sure.
2019-01-18 14:10
Proving why people call him overrated.
2019-01-18 14:59
Signed up 2018-09-18
2019-01-18 13:18
China Slasher8888 
and? your point being?
2019-01-19 04:58
if you think zywoo is better awp than kennys you probably have not seen kennys in 2014 new fagg cu
2019-01-19 13:59
China Slasher8888 
I'm not denying that kenny is a great awper: he set the meta before, his reaction speed and gamesense are definitely good, however people treat him too much as if he's the god of awp in cs, and that's where i think he gets overrated. KennyS is unstable, when he's good he's unstoppable, but when he isn't he's just simply another pro, and when a player is quite unstable I wouldn't consider him legendary. Also just becasue i set my account sometime last year doesn't mean i followed the pro-scene since last year.
2019-01-19 14:39
" when a player is quite unstable I wouldn't consider him legendary. " get right is unstable and is a legend of counter strike. I think u are retard. ps: followed the pro-scene since last year. /close
2019-01-19 14:47
China Slasher8888 
sure no problem, guess i'm retarded then :3
2019-01-19 14:48
Yes. you are. Trying to disparage a player that you have not even seen play. lmao xD. this is not your forum
2019-01-19 14:51
China Slasher8888 
jeez i get that i may have different opinions than you and you don't appreciate it, and by that rip and sorry, no need to be so harsh on little ol me XD
2019-01-19 14:56
I do not know if you were wrong, but this is a csgo forum.
2019-01-19 14:59
China Slasher8888 
and? your point being?
2019-01-19 15:00
kennyS is a better AWPer, but overall ZywOo beats kennyS.
2019-01-18 01:48
Norway shoxtop1again 
kennyS in his prime was a better AWPer but Zywoo is just insane overall, so better because of that.
2019-01-18 01:51
France PowwneD 
2019-01-18 13:33
Myanmar xdcc 
Kenny in his prime also had faster movement speed while scoped. Look at his stats early 2015 and after the nerf... Imagine if zywoo had that.
2019-01-18 14:15
+1 The awp nerf killed KennyS
2019-01-18 14:51
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
KennyS created his own meta with the AWP before the nerf... ZywOo is godlike now, but he wouldn't touch KennyS before the AWP nerf and those who understand just how KennyS was would agree with me immediately. Watch any old Titan clip for raw evidence of this.
2019-01-18 01:51
Israel asafborger 
2019-01-18 02:20
kennyS | 
Denmark Borsty 
facts +1
2019-01-18 12:47
Indonesia FinZzz 
True. If the awp nerf didnt happen Kenny would dominate the game by himself.
2019-01-18 12:57
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
I mean I understand why it was necessary to nerf the AWP, KennyS just made it ridiculous to the point of "it must happen", I suppose.
2019-01-18 13:03
kennys is overrated dude
2019-01-18 13:07
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
Now yes, back then obviously not... The ratings say otherwise.
2019-01-18 13:17
Which ratings? KennyS Pre-AWP nerf: Leaderboard at his peak: (Ps. No one cares about games with low tier teams) Olofmeister. Same period: Coldzera 2016 and 17: GTR 12, 13 and 14: S1mple 2018:
2019-01-18 15:47
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
"Watch any old Titan clip for raw evidence of this." KennyS single-handedly created an AWP-meta that wasn't used by any other AWP'er... Sure I can see that as somehwta overrated, but it's not to be taken out of context. GTR doesn't AWP and those stats are from before 2014.
2019-01-18 16:20
I understand that he created a new meta. I’m just saying that even with the op awp he didn’t perform consistently well. Thats why I say he is overrated. People remember his flashy plays and disregard the player as a whole. Other than the meta, his shots was not that insane even watching his videos. He missed a lot against strong teams compared to awpers nowadays. Ps: oh, yeah, I messed up with gtr rating
2019-01-18 16:38
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
I understand your point. :D Have a good day, friend. :)
2019-01-18 16:41
Russia anime_is_gay 
nice to see you again Jonty
2019-01-18 14:07
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
You too, friend. :) Have a wonderful day. ^^
2019-01-18 15:21
Faroe Islands memento_1 
kenny is not cheating tho.
2019-01-18 01:57
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
Neither is ZywOo...? Your point?
2019-01-18 02:24
are you sure ? prove it
2019-01-18 12:39
Indonesia tsokai 
youre the one who says he's cheating prove it
2019-01-18 12:41
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
Did you just say "prove he is not cheating"? You're the one accusing him unnecessarily, try to understand how the game works first and foremost.
2019-01-18 12:50
dw, he either will become just average or banned. first one most likely. comparing a 2018 hard carry vs a 2014-2015 one. professional cs developed a lot. teams making less mistakes, having better positional gameplay and really good nade usage. being a hard carry in 2015 is peanuts compared to 2018. this guy comes out of nowhere with 0 experience and reks people in fpl, pro scene and what so ever. having more weird clips than 95% of pro players in their whole carreer. to me he is just a fat frustrated kid cheating in a game.
2019-01-18 12:56
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
Or... he'll continue to play at the level he's playing at without fear of cheating accusations from those to spiteful to see past their own nose. Try again.
2019-01-18 12:55
read again, zywoo is at least 300% better than prime kenny naive people calling shit like "prodigy". cs exists for decades and the pro scene has pretty much hit the highest peak in skill ceiling. no fucking fat kid just comes around and reks pro players who have +5 years of experience in tier 1. if you want to continue discussing ill just send u some blatant clips.
2019-01-18 12:58
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
"read again, zywoo is at least 300% better than prime kenny naive people calling shit like "prodigy"." You just assumed ZywOo to be cheating and now you're claiming he is better than the man who created an AWP-meta before the nerf? "cs exists for decades and the pro scene has pretty much hit the highest peak in skill ceiling. no fucking fat kid just comes around and reks pro players who have +5 years of experience in tier 1." Evidently you have no idea of how raw talent or skill works, you simply assume him to be cheating out of "necessity" rather than provide any logical arguments? This, ladies and gentleman... is "witch-hunting" for you. Ridiculous. :/
2019-01-18 13:00
you are just a dumb fanboy denying the obvious things. watch him become just a average top 20 player soon. ugly fat kid.
2019-01-18 13:06
+1 ZyWoo is definitely cheating and Jonty is just biased being a fan of ZyWoo. I just watched him play and the obvious syndrome just hit me knowing clearly that he's cheating.
2019-01-18 13:11
this fangay probably never watched any vitality or AaA games. neither any fpl games of him.
2019-01-18 13:12
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
Did you? He's trolling you. :/
2019-01-18 13:16
Yes, I was thinking about this too. Look at him in #40 He's saying that I'm trolling you...unbelievable. It's sad to see how people speak without having any knowledge about the subject. Thank god that you're better... You just showed to Jonty who's the real boss here.
2019-01-18 13:41
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
"you are just a dumb fanboy denying the obvious things." Actually I have been playing CS since before you were born but that doesn't mean every kid is cheating because "you" think so... Try to understand the logicality of "possibility" and that opinions remain opinions. ZywOo isn't cheating just because "you think so", but your opinion is ultimately respected. "watch him become just a average top 20 player soon." I am watching him destroy professionals in awe alike everybody else who actually cares for the game. I'm not assuming cheats because of some insidious, insipid reason whatsoever. "ugly fat kid." I am incredibly ugly and I suppose slightly overweight(?), but none of that has anything to your with your arrogant delusions now, does it? Stop proving my point of "witch-hunting".
2019-01-18 13:15
fanboy words. "playing cs before you were born" and still dumb as fuck. guess low IQ players like you take a long time to understand basic things. dont worry man, even if you have shitty learning curve. one day you will make it (maybe).
2019-01-18 13:17
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
Once again, you prove the point I make by not knowing anything about what you preach. Irony at it's finest.
2019-01-18 13:49
your latest thread. "Cheating exists in pretty much every aspect of life and always will do. It's people doing unintelligent things for their own reasons in order to claim some kind of accolade or endeavour. Here in lies the issue" wake up
2019-01-18 13:57
Singapore Nephalith 
Jesus, I was gone for a year and its almost like time didn't move at all here on You're still sane having to deal with these inbreds for having an opinion about cheating? From flusha to k0nfig to this? Much respect for not going bananas as I have.
2019-01-18 14:15
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
Nephalith? Oh my god I am so happy to see you. :D Unfortunately the anarchy hasn't stopped... It got so bad I made this: As for going bananas? Will never happen, friend. :D I hope you had a wonderful Christmas and I hope you have a great 2019! Please return to HLTV to prove there are wonderful human beings on the site! :D
2019-01-18 15:24
Singapore Nephalith 
Ahaha likewise, my friend. I kinda had to 'rehab' myself from reading or commenting on this site for a long time as I was becoming as toxic and cancerous as them. So when I do visit, it's mostly for the news. :) But seeing that you're still as vigilant and unyielding as ever, I might just try to tolerate more idiocy and avoid nonsensical bickering.
2019-01-18 15:46
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
Hey - I think the site deserves to see "Nephalith" in action! :D
2019-01-18 16:19
NiKo | 
United Kingdom lr1015 
> my favourite player got rekt by this new guy > no way anyone's better than my favourite player > "OH MY GOD, THIS KID IS CHEATING" > stfu mOE
2019-01-18 14:19
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
Exactly... The illogicality of witch-hunting.
2019-01-18 15:25
He was playing with the aAa line up since 2015 so...
2019-01-18 14:04
Brazil 7vv$ 
2019-01-18 16:44
Kenny in Prime = Zywoo right now
2019-01-18 02:14
No one was as good as kennyS in terms of AWP when he was in his prime. Zywoo is undoubtedly talented and although he is very good with the AWP and rifles, i don't think we will see anyone as good with the AWP as kennyS was in his prime.
2019-01-18 02:17
United Kingdom Jonty04l32 
+1,000 KennyS was untouchable before the AWP nerf... he single-handedly created a meta of using the AWP as a shotgun. xD
2019-01-18 02:24
yeah and even after the nerf, he adapted and was very good
2019-01-18 03:17
tabseN | 
Germany NatsuS 
Ecovice and S1mple are better and S1mple isn't even in his prime.
2019-01-18 12:45
Kennys better awper than simple
2019-01-18 12:55
Im not talking about now. I'm talking about in kennyS's prime with the AWP.
2019-01-18 13:57
Zywoo is completely untested so it isn't a fair comparison. Once he's played big lans against the best teams then we can judge him.
2019-01-18 03:24
He CERTAINLY had the potential but we haven’t seen him against real top10 teams yet. I believe he could be a loving legend like GTR NEO and Pasha
2019-01-18 03:27
tabseN | 
Germany NatsuS 
KennyS was only good when Happy told him "don't play awp you are bad" So easy 4 Zywoo
2019-01-18 12:44
NBK- | 
Czech Republic Kwido 
cmon bois, zywoo is sick but he has to be tested properly. 1 lan and major qualifier wont cut it. Needs to play a few t1 events before we can start comparing
2019-01-18 12:52
not to mention kenny was already a pro playing for the best team in source before csgo
2019-01-18 13:04
tabseN | 
Germany NatsuS 
CS:S failfish
2019-01-18 13:30
why u ppl hate cs s
2019-01-18 13:44
tabseN | 
Germany NatsuS 
It was the step-son of Cs1.6 nobody likes the stepson. beside step mommy LUL
2019-01-18 14:01
i liked it
2019-01-18 14:48
France PowwneD 
I Don't think that ZywOo will underperforming against T1 team but maybe that the rest of his team will. It's Vitality who have to shine against T1. Also ZywOo is really more like Shox, he is good at every weapon and is incredibly smart in his plays as Shox did.
2019-01-18 14:11
NBK- | 
Czech Republic Kwido 
The thing is he is quite still raw. He is overly aggresive which is working at the moment. But the amount of overpeaks, going for the kills and dying is still too much for me. It's just a matter of time till the teams start figuring him out and he has to adapt. Don't wanna sound like im underestimating him but most of the prodigies bursting into the scene had to change their game after a certain amount of time. Also has to work on his gamesense meaning when to peak and when not to.
2019-01-18 14:16
France PowwneD 
The fact that he is already ultra-impressive, faster than most of the players and still can be better by some in-game choice made me think that he will be one of the best players as s1mple, coldzera or Olofmeister or even better. Yes it's just a matter of time.
2019-01-18 15:26
Canada Surzz 
2019-01-18 12:52
Twistzz | 
Russia Roneee 
2019-01-18 12:59
+1 guardian is real GOAT awper not these baggettes noobz
2019-01-18 14:03
+1 KennyS is the most overrated player ever.
2019-01-18 15:16
Ez ZywOo
2019-01-18 13:08
North America AlanSmith 
2019-01-18 13:09
2019-01-18 13:31
They nerfed a weapon solely because of KennyS. And zywoo hasnt proven himself yet vs top teams. Zywoo has huge potential and is Definately shining in the French scene.
2019-01-18 13:59
France PowwneD 
Shining vs high tier team Inc.
2019-01-18 14:05
There is no proof of that.
2019-01-18 14:15
They didn’t nerf “because of KennyS”, they nerfed because the weapon was OP. Like they didn’t nerf the tec9 “because of olofmeister”
2019-01-18 15:17
NiKo | 
France LauraS 
Is this with HLTV 2.0 rating or HLTV 1.0 rating?
2019-01-18 15:17 when you compare players from a time we had rating 1.0 the player on rating 2.0 also gets his rating 1.0 so effectively zywoo last year had 1.33 on rating 1.0
2019-01-18 15:52
hard to gauge. but its kenny for me. different maps. different mechanics. a shit ton of updates ever since. zywoo is great and all. but rating 2.0 pretty skewered early ratings. kenny 2014 is pretty similar to zywoo last year. kenny had more maps and played againt top teams all uear long while not being on a top 3 team.
2019-01-18 15:50
Other ktzz 
well, kenny had a HUGE potential and was really insane until they nerfed the awp. The global playstyle has changed aswell, teams are constantly renewing their plays/roles and game approach, which therefore ends up affecting the players since they have to adapt. Their potential can be judged by considering how much they evolved and how constant they've been/are. It can also be judged by how well they understand the game etc. In that regard, we can't really judge zywoo yet since he just started to play at this level recently. Potential isn't just raw talent, it's basically your ability to sit back, think and improve your playstyle etc. It's also the ability to use your strong points properly and to use them for your team's benefits. Kenny had loads of raw skills back then, he quickly evolved to become a dominant awper which would be crucial and decisive in most matches. He definitely had loads of potential considering how well he would understand the game and use his strong points for his team's benefits. Zywoo seems to have loads of raw skills aswell but his playstyle is totally different and i personally belive that kennys had more talent in that regard. When it comes to potential, i believe that zywoo will struggle in a few months once the teams he'll face will come up with anti zywoo strats/setups and got adapted to his playstyle (he's that impactful because is playstyle isn't something the actual pros are used to). Then he will have to sit back and find out how he can break through this and keep on being the heavy fragger that he is, then we will be able to truly judge his potential (even though he has a huge potential already). But at this point (let's suppose i'm talking about early 2012 kenny and early vitality zywoo), back at their debuts i would say that kennys had slightly more potential than zywoo.
2019-01-18 15:56
you compare both with the awp but zywoo is good at everything.. rifle pistols awp.. agressive, passive, clutching, entry.. everything, he is already more complete than kennys, he will be harder to counter . also the level evolved when kennys was great, zywooo would have been totally the level is way higher
2019-01-19 15:02
the level is higher nowadays it's true, but that doesn't change anything about their room for growth based on their respective potential. zywoo is ofc more complete since kenny is a dedicated awper but i don't think that zywoo will improve that much. btw, i didn't compare both players with the awp, i compared their potential by taking into account their specificities. i do believe that zywoo will quickly stagnate sadly. kennys now is nothing more than his own shadow which is quite sad
2019-01-20 04:18
zywoo is WAY better he is more complete, understand the rotations more, can support way better, etc old kennys when he was the best in the game, was cuz of broken awp, and the meta could be abused by him overpeeking everywhere, he was faster than everybody, so he could go ham in a crazy way look kennys now, he cant adapt to the new metas, play conservative etc, he still really good, but not even close to old kenny zywoo is way more complete, fresh, and will be better than kennys for now on by far!
2019-01-19 14:42
kenny > zywoo for sure
2019-01-19 14:49
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