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GOAT OF CS:GO OPINION ?
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
The only legitimate contenders are olof, flusha, dev1ce, coldzera, guardian, kenny & f0rest. Imo it's baitzera, u may hate him like i hate Br fans but on paper he is the best in CS:Go, two majors MVP, two time 1# and another 10#. Super consistent, tied for best achievement. dev1ce is the only real contender to cold imo. I expect s1mple & Niko to get there since they are still pretty young, but cold, device, kenny, olof & flusha are too so idk. strawpoll.me/17466399
2019-02-20 11:25
Olof
2019-02-20 11:26
#4
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Less achievement than cold, less good individually, only one major MVP, pretty average now, lesser rankings. No.
2019-02-20 11:29
Olof still better
2019-02-20 11:30
#8
Thorin | 
Netherlands RafV 
Lol, no
2019-02-20 11:31
Cs:go, yes
2019-02-20 11:31
#42
 | 
India Noobdian1 
Yes
2019-02-20 11:39
lol the guy is a living legend fnatic era depended upon him
2019-02-20 13:50
Baitzera
2019-02-20 15:12
#294
 | 
Poland Konteiz 
Baitzera
2019-02-20 22:54
Opinion btw
2019-02-20 11:31
#17
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
I ask u being objective, it's not about who u do like the most here.
2019-02-20 11:31
Thats my opinion
2019-02-20 11:32
#22
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Well i just demonstarted that you are wrong m8.
2019-02-20 11:32
I'm not
2019-02-20 11:36
#34
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Prove it like u just proved that cold is better than olof, stop being a fanboy for one second and look at real eveidence
2019-02-20 11:36
I'm not fanboy, olof is better, fact not opinion
2019-02-20 11:39
#53
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
How ? less you good than both device and cold in stats, major, achievement, consistency & ranking ? how does that make him better lmfao fnaboy
2019-02-20 11:44
Mad cuz cold id bad?
2019-02-20 12:32
#160
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
don't like cold, but he isn't bad, proove me how is he bad then we can talk toilet cleaner
2019-02-20 12:38
And fact aswell
2019-02-20 11:32
#23
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
22~then bro
2019-02-20 11:33
"Less achievement than cold, less good individually" delusional
2019-02-20 11:44
#57
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
And how is that ? he does have better achievements look it up, he's also better individually too, stats don't lie nigga. olof barely TOP20 two years ago and didn't even make it last year. Im okay with olof being the goat, but show me how with proof then and stop acting like a retarded fangirl.
2019-02-20 11:47
olofmeister won WAY more - how does he not have more achievements? If you seriously believe coldzera is individually better than olofmeister you have no idea about CS:GO. You calling me a retarded fangirl? Fuck off
2019-02-20 12:07
#108
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
13 big events won by device, 11 by olof. Show me concrete evidence and then no probleme, but olof just has less achievements overall wether u like it or not m8. cold is statisticly way above olof in everything, roles plays a good part in it but olof was still 1# while not being statisticly better than guardian in 2015, so no again bro.
2019-02-20 12:11
wrong, olof won like 7 more relevant events than device if I remember correctly (wont waste my time looking that up for you) your second sentence makes no sense at all so I will just asume you are a baiter
2019-02-20 12:16
#136
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
I did waste my time tho and your wrong, device won more big events than olof, two more actually. Device also won more mvp's than olof. On tournament won xyp9x, dupreeh and device are tied at 1#, olof has two less than any of theses guys.
2019-02-20 12:22
What are you basing this on? You can't dismiss the fact that he has been a legend in every major and the player to have won most trophies(~25)
2019-02-20 11:54
#79
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
11 big events won for olof, 13 for device, so no, device also played all the majors too, shox too, doesn't make him a goat contender. I like olof but he's just under cold and device on multiple levels, he is TOP3 to TOp5 arguably, but the point is being objectiv it's about whi is the CS:GO goat not who would you like it to be.
2019-02-20 11:59
Both have been the star players on their teams with relatively weaker players. Olof had to compete with not only other players but his teammates themselves.
2019-02-20 13:42
#226
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Switzerland Tang1 
this is the most retarded post i have ever seen in myy entire hltv time, u don't understand shit boout cs bro
2019-02-20 13:43
Then explain the parameters you are basing the statement that device and cold shadow olof
2019-02-20 13:44
#232
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Switzerland Tang1 
Theses are the parameter used by any HLTV rankings bro
2019-02-20 13:50
??? Reply needs to have actual content
2019-02-20 13:51
#237
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
just look at ur comment lmfao
2019-02-20 13:52
0/8
2019-02-20 13:53
+1
2019-02-20 11:31
Ty Indian brother
2019-02-20 11:31
ooflof
2019-02-20 12:05
#2
Romania jDT 
jimmy black
2019-02-20 11:27
#3
 | 
Algeria RunGo 
goat of csgo poll without gtr ok
2019-02-20 11:28
f0rest>GTR
2019-02-20 11:29
#9
 | 
Algeria RunGo 
i respect ur opinion but still flusha/guardian isnt better than gtr in csgo
2019-02-20 11:31
Yes they are retard, especially flusha
2019-02-20 12:00
f0rest is better than GTR, the only consistent player on nip rn
2019-02-20 12:17
#7
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Sorry NiP fan but it has been two years since gtr did achieve something or got into rankings, only one major, got good rankings when the game was trash, i mean he is TOP10 all time in CS:GO and maybe arguably TOP5 of all time but far from being the goat of CS:GO.
2019-02-20 11:31
#36
 | 
Algeria RunGo 
u dont know sh*t same happened to olof and the same will happen to cold gtr 2013 #1 2014 #1 2015 #11 2016 #18 olof 2015 1# 2016 #9 2017 #19 cold 2016 #1 2017 #1 2018 #10 no one stays on the top all of them either drop or bounce back gtr is washed up for the last 2 years thats right got only one major but been in 5 major finals(including the one he won) the level of cs was like that in 2013/14 just go watch old demos u will see that nip players also look like dmg's trying their best EDIT : and btw gtr is the only lurker player that got #1 in history of cs
2019-02-20 11:42
#49
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
You are a special breed of retarded fangay lmao, i don't predicte futur fag i only look at the past, and now ecvidence show it's beetween device or cold wether u like it or not. 5 majors final but couldn't win them, that's even worse m8. And yeah 2013 wasn't an objectiv year that why he hasn't performed since two years.
2019-02-20 11:42
#61
 | 
Algeria RunGo 
so u telling me that gtr achievement was bcs the game was new to everybody and he will be nothing without those 2 years. bullsh*t u are a newfag i bet u didnt even know that gtr got #2 in 2010 and 2011 if cs 1.6 lasted 2 more years gtr would get at least 1 top1 and also its too early to decide who is the goat of csgo we still got a lot of years in front of us and this topic is dead for me so is ur brain.
2019-02-20 11:50
#66
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Switzerland Tang1 
Wow literally 1iq algerian lmao. Im not saying he was nothing without theses years, saying he hasn't been very good since, he was barely top20 in 2016 and has been not TOP20 for the past two years. Also i said CS:GO Goat, i don't give a shit about " what if ", it's about CS:Go, funny how u say im a newfag but ur not even 1year old on this site lmfao. U don't have arguments only fangirling
2019-02-20 11:52
#78
 | 
Algeria RunGo 
xD sry if i offended u im not that hard fan of gtr but still putting guardian and flusha and not putting gtr is just a humilation and also being in this site for 1 year or 10 years is the same. u dont need to be in hltv to follow esports its a sh*t site anyway if u dont agree about my opinion on gtr i respect that but its very early to decide whos the goat of csgo thats it .
2019-02-20 11:58
#83
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Switzerland Tang1 
Im not offended u just don't understand the logic behind ur reasonning and others. U look like one tho for thinking he's the bets of cs when he is clearly not even close. being on this site for 1 year and calling otehrs newfag is a probleme tho brother I agree it's very early, and its just a temporary ranking, s1mple is the bets individually and if he joins a good team he could fuck up the entire scene, maybe device will be shit this year who knows
2019-02-20 12:02
#90
 | 
Algeria RunGo 
just look at ur poll who u think people voted for "others" ? hunden maybe lol ? its obv gtr and pls stop replying
2019-02-20 12:05
#96
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Switzerland Tang1 
Lol because peopel are as retarded as you, not serious player would ever say get right, only one major, no mvp, shit for two years. peopel as selecting otehrs for s1mple not get right ur the only one in this thread apart from one oter NIp fangay that suggested that. f0rest > gtr If it's get right prove it then im waiting for ur logic. don't say " what if 1.6 lived for more year he could have been bla bla bla " real concrete eveidence and then NO PROBLEME, nothing against gtr i like him but ur retarded af.
2019-02-20 12:08
#104
 | 
Algeria RunGo 
okay im retarded u're right im wrong just leave me alone idc
2019-02-20 12:10
#109
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
i don't want to bully u man, cheers
2019-02-20 12:11
#112
 | 
Algeria RunGo 
mrc
2019-02-20 12:13
#115
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
derien deso
2019-02-20 12:14
I didn't know that medkits can bully
2019-02-20 12:28
#293
f0rest | 
Belgium Qker 
As a die hard fan of f0rest he's always been behind GTR in the rankings in .6 and csgo except once. He's still rockin it and gotta love that! he's prolly amongst the best of all time but GTR is ahead of him even tho he's been off for two years, the fact that he's off atm can't erase his pastt achievements. .6 : #1 #2 #2 #1 cs go #1 #1 # 11 # 18 Lvl was at its peak in .6 and you might argue the level was lower in csgo butt all the players you listed played at that time + competition will always evolve anyway. Your poll kinda speaks for itself on the matter that he should atleastt have been on the list : "others" is basicly GTR. You just can't say that doesn't matter because competition was lower : Maradona Damon hill Schumacher Micheal jordan Pelé .... All those guys are legends who had their prime in the past and the competition has obviously evolved since then yet they're all amongst the GOAT's of their discipline. You just can't tell how good he'd be with all the structure, the ability of focusing only on gaming, salaries, training environment if he was 20 and in his prime atm.
2019-02-20 22:56
#296
f0rest | 
Belgium Qker 
While i can understand your thinking process, it's not well thought enough cause you're only taking the parameters that suits with it into account but you will eventually understand that someday.
2019-02-20 23:01
#298
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
gtr is not the goat end of the story bro
2019-02-20 23:14
#299
f0rest | 
Belgium Qker 
Well you made your point i made mine. Yours is backed up by a flawed thinking process implying that as soon a competition evolves past achievements should be dismissed, mine is backed up by numbers & rankings. Anyway discussing this any further would be useless so we'll just agree to disagree.
2019-02-20 23:17
#300
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
I combine both look at my other comment i can't write shit vitalityn is playing ot man !
2019-02-20 23:18
#301
f0rest | 
Belgium Qker 
No problem bro, enjoy the game. None of this really matters and none of us will change his mind anyway. :)
2019-02-20 23:21
#302
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
But seriously tho who do u think atm is in goat position in csgo ? imo its device, this major will comfirm it i think.
2019-02-20 23:21
#303
f0rest | 
Belgium Qker 
To me GTR is the one who managed to stay on the top for longest period atm. So he is atm That being said, device has been relevant in rankings for a long time atm and is at his peak for now. GTR kinda disapeared into oblivion for two years so if device keeps going (wich i'm sure he will) he will definitely take the throne. Anyway i don't really believe in "GOAT". I'd rather see that as the "HALL OF FAME" because there will always be a better one since competition will never stop evolving and you can't always compare so more than one will deserve their name up there.
2019-02-20 23:33
why would u include some who has played his whole csgo career with guy who is better than him considering ALLTIME
2019-02-20 11:43
#62
 | 
Algeria RunGo 
i respect ur opinion but still flusha/guardian isnt better than gtr in csgo
2019-02-20 11:49
srsly drop the fanboypants, gtr had 2 good years millenium ago. flusha relevant whole csgo, same on guardian
2019-02-20 13:01
#198
 | 
Algeria RunGo 
last time flusha seen in the top20 2016 last time gtr seen in the top20 2016 guardian is consisetent i could agree with u but flusha as much as i like him i dont agree
2019-02-20 13:05
#12
 | 
Finland no_man 
gtr and simple old age and the new age
2019-02-20 11:31
#13
Estonia rYm 
s1mple ofc, no doubt
2019-02-20 11:31
#20
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
In the futur i do think he'll get there, individually he is the GOAT, but never won a major so not yet
2019-02-20 11:32
#103
Estonia rYm 
it doesn't matter if we ever wins major or not, he is just in the wrong team
2019-02-20 12:10
#114
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
just no, majors are the most important trophies and are necessary to be the goat, s1mple is the bets individually but is not even TOP5 contender because of he didn't win any.
2019-02-20 12:13
#246
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
TOP20 = You miss every game from the start of csgo to september 2015. hltv.org/stats/players?startDate=all&mat.. This is the good vision, add to that other parameters ( Achievement, including TOP4 placing, Majors placings, MVP, consistency, role, numbers of map played, DPR, DDPR, KPR, DeathPR, +1KPR, KAST, Support Rounds, Clutches, OKPR, Succes in opening duels ). Not even talking about tournament stat stratifications and some other obscure variables.
2019-02-20 14:48
12 year old p1mple fan boy spotted
2019-02-20 11:44
#106
Estonia rYm 
yep s1mple number#1 you need to deal with it sorry
2019-02-20 12:10
Because you're 12 and p1mple fan boy, we understand
2019-02-20 12:30
#240
Estonia rYm 
2019-02-20 14:21
We know you're 12 and all, maybe you saw your first CS match in 2018, but CS:GO existed for many years, kid. We understand though your brain is underdeveloped.
2019-02-20 14:23
#243
Estonia rYm 
2019-02-20 14:43
We know you aren't able to think. That's why we know you're 12 and obviously dumb.
2019-02-20 14:44
#247
Estonia rYm 
you don't provide any facts to support your opinion, lets try again
2019-02-20 15:09
I already did, but since you're 12, uneducated and plain stupid you wouldn't realize.
2019-02-20 15:10
#251
Estonia rYm 
facts are on my side s1mple GOAT s0rry
2019-02-20 15:12
Because you're 12 and p1mple fan boy, we understand.
2019-02-20 15:13
#255
Estonia rYm 
copy/paste yourself when you have no more arguments feelsbadman
2019-02-20 15:14
No need when reading your comments, it's obvious for anyone following this conversation.
2019-02-20 15:15
dude, all uve been saying this entire time is "oh ur 12 and pimple fan" u have less of an arguement than him
2019-02-20 22:29
That's on you then. If you don't understand why s1mple wouldn't be considered 'GOAT' of CS(:GO), it's on you.
2019-02-20 22:32
s1mple is an amazing talent and COULD be considered the goat depending on these next two years i wouldnt have made a comment if u provided an argument besides "12 year old p1mple fangay spotted" and copy pasted it 5/6 times
2019-02-20 22:34
I hinted he only saw CS in 2018. If you weren't 12 year old maybe you would be able to figure my point out.
2019-02-20 22:39
12 year old p1mple fan boy spotted Because you're 12 and p1mple fan boy, we understand We know you're 12 and all, maybe you saw your first CS match in 2018, but CS:GO existed for many years, kid. We understand though your brain is underdeveloped. No need when reading your comments, it's obvious for anyone following this conversation. LOOOL ima do my best impression of u lol newfag 12 y/o spotted no arguement
2019-02-20 22:41
Get out of my face kid.
2019-02-20 22:41
lol nt newfag 12 y/o spotted
2019-02-20 22:41
#15
 | 
Poland DYSKREje 
kennys ofc lol delete brazilian ip from that strawpoll
2019-02-20 11:32
#27
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Switzerland Tang1 
Im french and i like kenny way more than i do cold, but facts are here bro
2019-02-20 11:34
#16
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Russia zbogus 
if we consider consistency=dev1ce if we consider peak=s1mple
2019-02-20 11:31
#26
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
s1mple didn't won any major, i think he is the bets individually but until the end of cs he has much to do before getting there.
2019-02-20 11:34
#33
 | 
Russia zbogus 
so dev1ce? he was on top for 5 years while coldzera for only 2, I was also going to mention guardian but since a major is a requirment...
2019-02-20 11:36
#55
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
yes device is tied with cold, i can be ok with him being the goat at this point. This major will probably tell us who's the best.
2019-02-20 11:45
#273
s1mple | 
Ukraine d3adLY 
with cold LUL s1mple>coldzera of all time
2019-02-20 22:24
#161
NEO | 
Romania giony 
if u consider all time csgo = you are so wrong
2019-02-20 12:38
#223
 | 
Russia zbogus 
about dev1ce or s1mple
2019-02-20 13:41
#24
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Germany Naviever 
s1mpleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
2019-02-20 11:33
#28
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Switzerland Tang1 
no major, lesser achievements, rankings. SO maybe in the futur, but now he's not even TOP5 yet.
2019-02-20 11:35
olof no question about it.
2019-02-20 11:33
#30
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
#4
2019-02-20 11:36
theres only 1 reasonable answer and thats device. on top of CSGO since the very begining, unlike simple or coldzera. he was consistent thruout his career and would be the #1 right now if it wasnt for simple and his absolute unbelievable 2018 ^^ for me, if you count from start to now, it can only be device
2019-02-20 11:36
#37
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Switzerland Tang1 
I agree, i think eh and cold are even because device is there for so long, but he still ha sto be a 1# ranked and to be a major mvp one more time.
2019-02-20 11:38
thanks medkit but device better than cold
2019-02-20 11:39
#51
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Debatable.
2019-02-20 11:43
#87
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Spain elskio 
Until 2019 before Katowice gtr/device/cold After Katowice only dev1ce
2019-02-20 12:03
How can f0rest get so many votes? Its not like his legacy in 1.6 count in being the GOAT in CS:GO
2019-02-20 11:36
#38
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Fanboys are not objectiv for shit, it's beetween device and cold and 90% of the poeople here disagree but can't prove to you why lmao
2019-02-20 11:38
BUT BUT S1MPLE HAD A SICK YEAR, SO THAT MEANS THAT WHAT HAPPENED FROM 2013 TO 2018 DOSE NOT COUNT
2019-02-20 11:46
#58
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Switzerland Tang1 
olof fanboys are the worst atm, s1mple fans are just newfags.
2019-02-20 11:47
> device > no gtr nice list btw
2019-02-20 11:37
#45
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Switzerland Tang1 
get won only one major, not even the mvp, way less achievement than others, rankings in early cs were flawed, and has been trash for the past two years wake up.
2019-02-20 11:40
gtr is nowhere near as successfull as device in CSGO^^ device was playing toplevel at the 87-0 nip run aswell but gtr wasnt playing toplevel the last 2 years while device was still at the top
2019-02-20 11:41
#113
 | 
Sweden Trkmag 
+1
2019-02-20 12:13
#39
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Portugal MR_CAL 
its pretty much between device and cold, ppl saying olof, s1mple, gtr or even f0rest (WTF HAHAH) are just dumb. as u said, u cant argue against straight facts and cold and device are the best
2019-02-20 11:39
#43
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India Noobdian1 
Yeah
2019-02-20 11:40
#59
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
ur the real mvp
2019-02-20 11:48
coldzera so esy for skgaming!!!!
2019-02-20 11:40
#47
 | 
India Noobdian1 
Csgo:Device/olof/cold Cs in general: forest or Gtr
2019-02-20 11:41
#60
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
CS:GO : device / cold ( this major will show us ) CS : in general f0est not questions.
2019-02-20 11:48
#185
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India Noobdian1 
Yep I think Device tho cuz he's been around for a while
2019-02-20 13:01
#197
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Switzerland Tang1 
+1
2019-02-20 13:05
#206
 | 
India Noobdian1 
U and me agree on a lot of things XD
2019-02-20 13:11
#214
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Switzerland Tang1 
ah but sadly nip fans don't agree with us it would seem, ur one of the first nip fans that isn't saying gtr is the goat.
2019-02-20 13:14
#215
 | 
India Noobdian1 
Yeah K gtg
2019-02-20 13:16
#48
 | 
Slovakia Rhanus 
Goat is Guardian, best form across all time CSGO is out, He was in every ranking since beginning. Not that much achievents but constant and stable performance whole 5 years. No like other players that play good for one year and then they are trash.
2019-02-20 11:41
#63
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
No majors, mediocre achievements, individually there better than him. Sorry slovakia but guardian isn't the CS:GO goat.
2019-02-20 11:50
#73
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Slovakia Rhanus 
And who is it? Simple who is good only for last 1,5 half year? Or olof with his 1 year form?
2019-02-20 11:55
#74
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
coldzera or device, can you read lmao ?
2019-02-20 11:56
If you consider the whole of CS:GO Guardian is better than Coldzera. Cold only became a someone in 2016, Guardian's been there since the beginning. With that said, Device is the only candidate.
2019-02-20 13:48
#235
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Switzerland Tang1 
cold did better in two years than guardian in his whole career, just no
2019-02-20 13:51
TONIONE
2019-02-20 11:51
Shox /close
2019-02-20 11:52
#67
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
not even close
2019-02-20 11:53
#68
NEO | 
Ukraine s1v9mple 
who is device?
2019-02-20 11:53
#70
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
2019-02-20 11:54
e-sport is just starting now. csgo probably bring 10 other ppl that are better than s1mple f0rest and all together in the future.
2019-02-20 11:54
CSGO won't last 10 more years Probably 4-5 more years before the majors stop
2019-02-20 11:57
#107
 | 
United Kingdom H3nryG 
Well CS has been around for 20 years and people have been saying it's gonna die in the last 5 years
2019-02-20 12:11
#175
Romania jDT 
why majors stop? I think that this is just the beginning...of course will be a lot of updates but man...this is the future
2019-02-20 12:51
Goat of cs 1 f0rest /Close
2019-02-20 11:55
#75
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
goat of CS = forest BUT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT CS:GO C + S + G + O > CS:GO
2019-02-20 11:57
hate me, your hate is my desire.
2019-02-20 12:01
#84
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
speak english
2019-02-20 12:02
HATE THE BRAZILIANS, I wanna your hate. YOUR HATE IS MY PLEASURE!!!
2019-02-20 12:07
#99
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
h, i don't hate brazillians only the annoying fans, i like brazillians and brazil in general tbh, just don't like the death threats and hltv spamming.
2019-02-20 12:09
No,no,no,non, hate me, please.
2019-02-20 12:10
#110
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
are u sadomachistic or smthng? gyazo.com/f822da1c4b2d5a869d90ab21db0c37..
2019-02-20 12:12
Yeah, my friend, i like it.
2019-02-20 12:14
#118
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
what doing on hltv go favelas to get beaten and robbed than carahlo
2019-02-20 12:15
#295
 | 
Brazil guihub12 
Kkkkk *caralho
2019-02-20 22:55
#77
 | 
Denmark Magisk 
Device for sure. His ingame mind is insane.
2019-02-20 11:57
#86
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
it's beetween cold and him, this major will decide i think.
2019-02-20 12:03
#82
Romania jDT 
you can speak about goat when cs go era will end. for example in 1.6 is neo. On go are many very good players but it s still ongoing So what are we are doing now are just useless discussions...come back in 5 years If you ask me it s no goat without major
2019-02-20 12:01
#88
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
i agree it's a temporary ranking never said it was definitive. 1.6 = neo CS:S = ex6tenz CS:Go = device / simple for now CS : f0rest
2019-02-20 12:04
#85
 | 
Europe SQXZAF 
s1mple true goat
2019-02-20 12:03
#89
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
in some years maybe, he has the best potential.
2019-02-20 12:05
#92
 | 
Turkey KOKSALTARES 
olof coldzera
2019-02-20 12:05
#120
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
cold / device > olof
2019-02-20 12:15
#155
 | 
Turkey KOKSALTARES 
cant be goat without #1 one year
2019-02-20 12:32
#164
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
device won the big events, the most MVP, was in TOP20 for the last five years. i agree with you but he was better than any other on others thing so it compensate.
2019-02-20 12:42
1.6 neo GO device cs f0rest
2019-02-20 12:06
#98
 | 
Finland Alko^ 
device?? he has never even peaked top1
2019-02-20 12:09
who else was better in go from 2012-2019? maybe olof or guardian but thats it.
2019-02-20 12:10
#119
 | 
Finland Alko^ 
device's invidual skill has never reached top5, so I'd say GuardiaN or olof. GuardiaN has been top1 sniper for like 3 years in the row
2019-02-20 12:15
#20('14), #3('15), #3('16), #5('17), #2('18) according to hltv. iam not even an device fanboy but cmon.
2019-02-20 12:16
#130
 | 
Finland Alko^ 
All those over top5 years he reached with his team achievements?
2019-02-20 12:18
hltv wrote that teamachievments are not included in the rankings otherwise device would have been #1 in 2k18.
2019-02-20 12:21
#210
 | 
Finland Alko^ 
Then why he was top2 when NiKo had better stats?
2019-02-20 13:12
#121
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
reasonnable, we'll see at this major, it will be the decisive tournament beetween cold and device.
2019-02-20 12:16
cold srsly ? it is olof or guradian instead of device if anything. the point why you could argue guardian>olof/device is that guardian never played in a topteam beside faze and still performed. olof had jw, flusha and krimz but i am sure he was the mainreason why fnatic had an era.
2019-02-20 12:22
#145
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
guardian isn't even top5, no majors won, way less big events won, never was TOP1 ever in any rankings. olof is currently tied with flusha but still behind device and cold in almost everything.
2019-02-20 12:28
coldzera had 3 great years in a game that is played for 8 years. 1 of those 3 years he barley won anything and had no over the top impact in tournaments. thats not enough for goat. if you want you could argue he had the highest peak ever okay but you cant argue if he is goat of GO.
2019-02-20 12:32
#162
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Acheiving so much in so litlle time could be a case for why he is better. You come into an island, you stay there 8 years and build a house, the another guys comes in a build a house in only two years. is he a better builder than you ? a case could be made that's why i say w'ell see who's teh best at this major. I think it's device but unlike cold he lacked rankings and an mvp but is better on some other criteria.
2019-02-20 12:40
#97
flusha | 
Germany J0hnnyB 
dev1ce 100% !!! 2x major winner, 1x major MVP, most MVPs in a year, first time winner of the Intel Grand Slam, maybe the star player of the most dominant CSGO era so far, 2nd 2018, 5th 2017, 3rd 2016 and 2015, 20th 2014, made it to all major quaterfinals except Boston Major but bounced back with the best year of his carrer, 7x times made it to Major Semis (record together with olofmeister)
2019-02-20 12:08
#100
 | 
Finland Alko^ 
cs overall: f0rest
2019-02-20 12:09
The thread is about: GOAT OF CS:GO OPINION ?
2019-02-20 12:14
#122
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
yep peopel are retarded and can't read :(-
2019-02-20 12:16
#124
 | 
Finland Alko^ 
I dont consider a player who has never been top5 invidually "the greatest"
2019-02-20 12:16
#141
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
in csgo forest got top two in 2013 and two top 7 in 2014 & 2016. Als o he is the goat of CS, just not csgo.
2019-02-20 12:26
#207
 | 
Finland Alko^ 
Invidually and statwise f0rest was top1 in 2013
2019-02-20 13:11
#216
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Debatable too, imo gtr is overrated.
2019-02-20 13:17
#220
 | 
Finland Alko^ 
Nah he was really good 2012-2016 but because of his illness his performance has dropped
2019-02-20 13:20
#221
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Indeed, but overrated still, ppl think he is the goat lmfao
2019-02-20 13:22
#101
 | 
Spain elskio 
Most MVPs ever*
2019-02-20 12:09
#128
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
i agree with what u said, but olnly this amjor will close the discussion beetween device and cold, cold got two 1# rankings, and was a major MVP one more time than device. it's 50/50 but i like device more, we'll see
2019-02-20 12:17
#111
 | 
Sweden Trkmag 
When you think dev1ce or baitzera are goats of CSGO xddddddddddddddddddd
2019-02-20 12:13
#129
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Who it is then ? Explain to me bro im waiting
2019-02-20 12:18
#183
 | 
Sweden Trkmag 
I'd say flusha, shox, olof, GTR are the best. dev1ce is up there as well but if you watch him play you see that he is more a product of his team than a superstar. But he is really skilled as well. I'm not even gonna bother with coldzera, most inflated stats in the history of CS. EDIT: Snax is up there as well
2019-02-20 13:01
#204
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
stats, achievement, rankings, consistency & mvp,theses guys are under device in everything. cold has boosted stats but also has non(inflatedd in big events so no. but imo device > cold, we'll see this major.
2019-02-20 13:09
LMAO everyone on ure list had really bad years recently... French scene is dead without Zywoo and Shox had 2 bad years in a row and 2015 wasn't really good as well. GTR rly? 2017 not qualified for a major and 2018 just one... Flusha is good but he isn't an allrounder and never was the main star player of the team. His stats are not even close to dev1ce or coldzera. Olof is as well a really great player but individually he isn't even close.. he is to inconsistent in the last few years
2019-02-20 22:12
#272
 | 
Sweden Trkmag 
Yeah no doubt that they had bad years recently but that doesn't undo what they did early on, better to have a bad year and get like #18 on the top 20 list than to be completely nonexistent in the scene until 2016 like coldzera. Neither coldzera or dev1ce are freaks of nature like s1mple/NiKo/f0rest etc, they are products of their team having fantastic teamplay where they are set up, I wrote about it in #209. flusha is fucking insane, he was fnatics best player in 2014 and was the one with the best rating in the world. I think the opposite of what you think, he is incredibly versatile and probably has the best game sense of all time. But he has been shaky last years with the exception of early 2018 and the present of today. The thing with players like coldzera and dev1ce is that I really can't honestly say that they are the best players ever, they simply lack too much skill for that. They are both incredibly consistent and are very effective CS players, knowing exactly what they should do to kill a lot and die little. But as I said, to me they are being set up too much by their teams, they are not playmakers.
2019-02-20 22:19
But there is simply no proof for that.. dev1ce and cold played with the same core so u can't really know it... and btw freaks of nature isn't a real thing in CS.. sure ure genetics can give u the edge put S1mple just grinds really hard.. 100hrs past 2 weeks is normal for him. NiKo played back in the days 2 hours of HS only to train his deagle skills. Surely there are players like NAF and fer who don't practise their aim as much but they are simply not reaching their full potencial.
2019-02-20 22:29
#284
 | 
Sweden Trkmag 
wdym, if you watch Ast or mibr play you can see how they set up their players, and especially cold/dev1ce? Insane talent definitely is a thing in CS, just look at f0rest play, it looks so relaxed and easy and he even is famous for not practicing as hard as other pros. What I meant to say was that NiKo and s1mple are much more skilled than coldzera.
2019-02-20 22:34
#139
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
im waiting nip fangay
2019-02-20 12:24
The only one "goat" is get_right
2019-02-20 12:17
#131
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
get right not even top5, f0rest > get right.
2019-02-20 12:18
now yes, historically not
2019-02-20 12:19
#137
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
in CS:GO it's dabatble, in CS f0rest > gtr not even close. Also like i said gtr is not even a contender in goat of csgo atm.
2019-02-20 12:23
#152 imo forest is better than gtr since 2016 and that's not enough
2019-02-20 12:42
#167
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
1.6 gtr > f0rest HAHAHAHAh ur some extra spicy retard, f0rest was better ranked than gtr since 1999, it's not two years taht will change shit, especially when everybody agrees than f0rest > gtr in 1.6 and now in csgo.
2019-02-20 12:45
Again you have to use vulgarism but it doesn't mean you're right. Deal with it. btw. None of them played in 1999 competitive CS.
2019-02-20 12:51
#179
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
both started in 2003 and f0rest is renowned to be better than gtr until 2010 to 2015, then for the past 3 years he was better. 10 years forst was better than gtr, gtr was better for five years, clear cut, also u can't find anybody with a brain that think gtr > f0rest in 1.6, f0rest won a lot more and played at an high level for longer. u are retarded on every subject i discuss with u inasnity
2019-02-20 12:56
Get_right start in 2003 but he was too young to play tournaments (He was 12 years old in 2003 so he start play competitive from 2007 - 16 years old) and he was a star player almost immediately (2008+) like zywoo today. He had 1,2+ rating until 2015.
2019-02-20 13:08
1.6 f0rest>gtr 2012-15 gtr>f0rest 2016-2019 f0rest>gtr how can gtr be goat over f0rest ?
2019-02-20 12:26
1.6 gtr > f0rest 2010 - 2nd best player of a world hltv.org/news/5990/top-20-players-of-201.. 2011 - 2nd best player of a world hltv.org/news/8053/top-20-players-of-201..
2019-02-20 12:32
Very hard due to how up and down teams have been. But probably device for his consistency or get right for his peeks. He's got the top 1 ranking 2 times just like cold. But additional top rankings aswell cold lack as of yet due to surfaceing around 2016. I still think flusha might be a hidden top 3 just for what I think he brings to his teams. The midround and clutch master. But I don't know how I would show. Other then the meny interviews where his teammates say he is the smartest player they ever played with and the fact that even after being hated by the entire US, one of the most respectable and likes or cloud still wanted him
2019-02-20 12:28
#138
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
device is tied with cold and i favor him to be the goat, but he didn't had any 1# ranking ever. this major will decide abou who's the better, unless olof or flusha wins it lmao
2019-02-20 12:24
Flusha is by far my favourite but it's hard to argue cause he lack the stats to show for it
2019-02-20 12:29
#151
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
indeed, but achievement wise he is pretty ok, depends on hwo is he gonna do in the next years, he could be TOP5 all time CS:Go atm.
2019-02-20 12:31
havent s1mple but have guardian & device ok
2019-02-20 12:26
what does he did to be in this list?
2019-02-20 12:27
#148
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
s1mple no major, barely any big event won, maybe in 5 years. guardian no major not even TOP5 of csgo
2019-02-20 12:29
Tom Brady
2019-02-20 12:28
#149
 | 
Luxembourg alex24 
olof or flusha olof only cs:go player Legend status at every major flusha only cs:go player with 4 majors (after katowice19)
2019-02-20 12:29
#157
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
olof is behind device & cold on almost everything so no, a case could be made for him to be 3 bets of csgo but unless he wins this major he will not be classifed as the goat. flusha is maybe TOP5, behind device, cold & tied with olof.
2019-02-20 12:33
#158
 | 
Luxembourg alex24 
cold had just 2 good years, 2016-2017 device had 1/2 good years, 2018-onwards olof and flusha were playing cs:go tournaments in 2012-2013 when coldzera was making brooms with his dad, and device was a just in highschool getting bullied everyday
2019-02-20 12:37
#169
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
device was there in 2013 lmao, also i don't give a shit if they were better in 2012-2013, olof wasn't even in TOP20 at theses years. imm looking about all time CS:GO not just the first two years are you retarded. device won more big events than olof & device, has better rankings, better stats, what can you even say the evidence is overwhelming lmao
2019-02-20 12:47
#262
 | 
Luxembourg alex24 
jesus kid u dumb... hltv.org/player/885/olofmeister hltv.org/player/7592/device fucking compare their flairs... olof was playing and winning events, when device was still trying to figure out how cs:go works
2019-02-20 15:44
#263
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
U are a special breed of retardation, their first even was for both DHW2013. They are started at the same time the only difference is that device 13 big events in his career and olof 11, device also was there in 5 yearly rankings, olof at 4. Majors perfs are the same, but device is way better statisticly in every time of selection. he's also dominating olof skill wise : hltv.org/stats/players/compare/885/olofm.. I did a mistake with rankings but even with that mistake fixed device shows again he's a level above olof. gl prooving reality wrong fuccboi
2019-02-20 15:53
#264
 | 
Luxembourg alex24 
funny thing is that device boosted his stats only in 2018 2013-2017 he was a bot like his pleb fans
2019-02-20 15:56
#265
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
hltv.org/stats/players/7592/device?match.. gyazo.com/5119b31caa3932a687874d6fbb12d0.. im no fan of device tbh, but i respect him, and tbh i prefer retarded astralis fan to a desilusional moron like you "2013-2017 he was a bot" , the dude was 20#, 3#, 3# & 5#. gtfo
2019-02-20 16:01
#266
 | 
Luxembourg alex24 
don`t lie... you are secretly device`s gay lover fan
2019-02-20 16:08
#267
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
i don't give a fuck about device, im a fan of fxy0 & zywoo
2019-02-20 16:13
#268
 | 
Luxembourg alex24 
you realised i was trolling you right ? :) cheers dude, don`t be mad
2019-02-20 16:14
#269
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
shit trolling, not mad just dissapointed
2019-02-20 16:15
For csgo? -coldzera -kennys deeply overrated Majors irrelevant btw. Zeus won a major. Is he goat. this major factor is irrelevant, tired of people bringing this low self worth bs up. "he cant be a goat without a major title" What if there were only weak contenders in a major? We gonna stop calling that a major win also? Who decides who is goat.. ffs Quit being basic plz? Ok so if someone has 14 majors and the other has 15 majors does that mean the one with 15 majors is superior. So whats the diff between 1 major and 0? Same number difference. CSgo is deeply luck based and theres 100000 factors. if you call someone a GOAT it means you are referring to THEM individually. not their team accomplishments. Its a team game. GOAT means you talking about them not their team.
2019-02-20 12:34
#159
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
"if you call someone a GOAT it means you are referring to THEM individually. not their accomplishments. Its a team game. GOAT means you talking about them not their team" i agree with this logic but it has been working like that for the past 20 years so fuck off ? coldzera is overrated ? how so then ? explain to me ur wonderfull noflagger cuck scienec so i laugh a bit. majors are liek world cups in football, thay are not everything but they are a factors like others, stats are the most important one, you also have consistency, individuall ranking among many other parameter. zeus has a major but isn't close to some of the contenders in every other apsect, probably too hard to understand for ur low iq ass but i would have tried.
2019-02-20 12:37
#165
 | 
Russia SP3C73R 
f0rest
2019-02-20 12:43
#170
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
CS:GO NOT CS. CS ALL TIME : f0rest CS 1.6 : neo CS:S : ex6tenz CS:GO : device / cold
2019-02-20 12:48
#166
 | 
India Sim0 
neo?
2019-02-20 12:43
#172
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
neo in csgo lmfao
2019-02-20 12:49
In my opinion it has to be device at this point. He's been a top 10 player since 2015, he's always statistically one of the highest rated players, he's won 2 majors and contributed massively in their victories, he's won countless other tournaments and has the most MVPs. The only thing that doesn't always check out is the eye test, because he tends to go for a very default style of AWPing, but the fact he does that is what allows Astralis to be so good in my opinion, he's a true backbone of this team. He doesn't have the highest skill ceiling, not even close to be honest, but he's arguably been the most consistent player in CS:GO history. Whoever says that device isn't impactful and that he could easily be replaced is fucking stupid. Yes, his role isn't the most difficult, but you're simply not going to find anyone else who plays it with such perfection as he does.
2019-02-20 12:47
#174
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Good point, even tho cold is still tied with him, this major will ultimatly decide which of the ttwo is the best. Are u really swiss ? proud of my countrymens so far, i think using logics instead of feelings serves us good in that topic, i still ahve ppl telling me gtr is the goat of csgo bro.
2019-02-20 12:51
Yeah, this major has to be really important in this conversation, especially considering it's actually fairly stacked, hardly any team isn't good enough to be here (maybe coL). And yes, I am Swiss, I'm from the canton of Zurich to be precise. I do try to use logic rather than emotions generally when having a debate with somebody, as it allows for better reasoning and thus more productive results. I love GeT_RiGhT, he's a really nice guy and definitely a legend, but his time as the number one player of all time in CS:GO has unfortunately expired quite a while ago. Obviously he's got great achievements, but how can someone who hasn't even been in contention for top 5 players in the world since late 2014 be considered a contender for the best player of all time? Especially when the conditions of play back then were very different from today. Cheers to you. :D
2019-02-20 13:09
#208
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
I agree, yeah coL is gonna get raped hard i think. Im from Fribourg, zurich looks nice never vistied but would love to. We ahve the same opinion, not surprised ur swiss then ;D hahahaha.
2019-02-20 13:11
#171
 | 
France LanaRhoades 
TACO , because no taco no coldzera
2019-02-20 12:49
#173
 | 
Brazil Boldro1965 
How can he be the best if he only start to winning things in 2016? He is god but not goat. The scene is way longer.
2019-02-20 12:49
#177
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
that's why he is tied to device. now let me explain something with a metaphore. Acheiving so much in so litlle time could be a case for why he is better. You come into an island, you stay there 8 years and build a house, the another guys comes in a build a house in only two years. is he a better builder than you ? a case could be made that's why i say w'ell see who's teh best at this major. I think it's device but unlike cold he lacked rankings and an mvp but is better on some other criteria.
2019-02-20 12:52
where is neo and snax
2019-02-20 12:54
#180
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
both are trash with at least 10 players being better in almost everything, even magisk atm is better in the gaot ranking than them, and in only a couple of years.
2019-02-20 12:57
#187
 | 
Sweden Trkmag 
okay you are baiting
2019-02-20 13:01
#193
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
no, stats, acjievement, rankings, consistency & mvp, they are way too overarated, same shit with gtr and people arguing he is the goat.
2019-02-20 13:03
#200
 | 
Sweden Trkmag 
Go look up snax in HLTV Top 20
2019-02-20 13:06
#202
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Yeah has has been rly good in the past, but both cold & evice are better in everything sorry it's just like that, also snax completly fell off last year.
2019-02-20 13:07
#209
 | 
Sweden Trkmag 
dev1ce has a fantastic history in HLTV top 20, I agree. But for me it's hard to fully credit both dev1ce and coldzera for their stats/MVPs/etc when they are probably the two most set up players in their game. Both are amazing though at playing ''effective'' CS but they both require a very structured team to function. As standalone players they would not have the same impact.
2019-02-20 13:12
#211
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
I agree for cold, not as much for device, but u got a point, doesn't change anything tho.
2019-02-20 13:13
OLOF. Fuck off now mate.
2019-02-20 12:58
#182
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
fanboy much
2019-02-20 12:59
#184
NiKo | 
India Sishir 
Olof. Now shut up.
2019-02-20 13:00
#194
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
stats, achievement, rankings, consistency & mvp, littearlly under device in everything
2019-02-20 13:04
rn f0rest in future probably s1mple, if he could play on this level for the next 10 years Btw cs will die in a few years so we can say f0rest is the goat
2019-02-20 13:01
#201
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
f0rest under both device & cold in stats, acjievement, rankings, consistency & mvp
2019-02-20 13:06
f0rest will soon turn 31. No one at that age is as consistant as f0rest is. When cold is 31 he'll be working at McDonalds.
2019-02-20 13:18
#218
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
idk maybe, doens't change anything
2019-02-20 13:18
Yes it does. f0rest has dominated CS for 15 years. Cold has been a good player for 4 years. It does matter.
2019-02-20 13:19
#222
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
CS GO what do u don't understand abouT CSGO. NOT 1.6 NOT CS, CSGO. C S G O
2019-02-20 13:23
my bad. cs - f0rest cs:go - idk, s1mple, cold, olof. we need more time to know
2019-02-20 13:45
#236
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
csgo we need more time ofc, it will be simple in 5 eyars but atm its devic / cold > olof
2019-02-20 13:52
Olof.
2019-02-20 13:02
#203
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
stats, achievement, rankings, consistency & mvp, littearlly under device in everything
2019-02-20 13:07
GODZERA
2019-02-20 13:02
LOL HLTV fucked up your flag
2019-02-20 13:02
#196
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
Theses motherfcukers can't make a squar apparently, but its fine we also have a rectangle version for some occasions.
2019-02-20 13:05
Lord SEx6TenZ
2019-02-20 13:03
#195
 | 
Switzerland Tang1 
CS:S goat, not csgo
2019-02-20 13:04
f0rest is the GOAT, all of you who think different, wait until your candidate turns 30+ and let's see if they still got it.
2019-02-20 13:13
What about hunden you newfag?
2019-02-20 13:13
f0rest is the GOAT for sure . the only player who turned 30 & still rocks
2019-02-20 13:42
#229
 | 
Russia SP3C73R 
Agreed. I want to see him & KRiMZ in one team
2019-02-20 13:45
#228
 | 
Finland Waari 
All of CS it is undoubtedly f0rest. In CSGO I think we are at the point where we have to give it to device.
2019-02-20 13:45
No s1mple No gtr 8/8 b8 m8
2019-02-20 14:06
Coldzera only relevant since 2016 and started playing in 2015 how is he goat??
2019-02-20 14:46
No GTR? ahahahah
2019-02-20 15:11
no get_right no party
2019-02-20 15:13
OlofM can legit play all roles Cold cant in Fnatic he was awping sometimes and a god rifler and now in FaZe hes a secondary fragger which is very hard for some1 who has been the primary star in his team his entire carrer so i would call OlofM the Goat
2019-02-20 15:14
Gtr and olof , forget baitzera and baitimple . Always baiting team mates to get fraggs. And simple has 14k hrs of csgo, his he virgin ?
2019-02-20 15:14
it's hard to say, but it's coldzera
2019-02-20 15:15
#259
 | 
Austria iVulkaN 
What a newfag puts in Coldzera&Device but not GTR who was BY A MILE the best player in the first 2 years
2019-02-20 15:16
#260
 | 
United States FlagMaster 
Device
2019-02-20 15:18
You can call device the most consistent csgo player but there’s no way someone can be number 1 of all time who’s never been the best player at any point, whether hltv ranking, fan consideration, or skillwise. As for cold; lol... heavily inflated stats due to his playstyle and was good for 2/8 years. It’s hard to call a highest peak of all time because the scene as a whole will only get better in terms of skill; so in a couple years, there may be peaks better than simple’s current peak, in the same way his peak is better than kenny’s (who had the most insane peak of all time before simple’s current peak). However, the 4 most *dominant* and/or unplayable players at any point in the game were gtr first 2 years, kenny next 2, olof next 2, simple next 2. The 4 most consistent players across all 8 years were device, forest, flusha, and guardian. Seeing as neither list has players who overlap, then it’s just based on what you consider more impressive- skill or longevity; cold has neither, sorry.
2019-02-20 15:24
Would like to see a top 10 list since u seem to be a pretty rational human beeing !! :)
2019-02-20 22:18
coldzera OMEGALUL
2019-02-20 22:24
#275
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Poland Miti123 
s1mple
2019-02-20 22:25
#276
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Europe CZADzz 
FALLEN
2019-02-20 22:26
s1mple /closed
2019-02-20 22:27
#280
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Israel soprendo 
krimz 3 majors s1mple 0
2019-02-20 22:30
krimz /should i close ?
2019-02-20 22:31
#286
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Israel soprendo 
Krimz, JW or flusha?
2019-02-20 22:39
krimz better Krimz /Closed
2019-02-20 22:40
#285
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Brazil guihub12 
S1mple prime is way better than coldzera prime.Stats is not my thing, I say what I saw.S1mple is a beast that can't be controlled.srry broke English
2019-02-20 22:37
device ofc
2019-02-20 22:45
Ok kids so it is 1.6 forest Go forest Overall forest
2019-02-20 23:05
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