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NRG
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Luxembourg alex24 
i just want somebody to explain to me why NRG are currently top4 world ranking according to HLTV and all cross 2018 they have been in the top10 world ranking - they haven`t won ANYTHING big in the past 2 years - they haven`t even played against t1 teams like astralis, navi, faze etc... i personally never saw a match of them playing any top5 teams i`ve been asking myself this question everytime i read the updated world ranking in HLTV are HLTV editors subjective, or i`m missing something ?? they should be beyond top10, somewhere in the top15-16 place are u kidding me ? top4 world ranking for 1st place at cs_summit 3 ?? and 2nd at Malta ?
2019-02-22 07:15
#1
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Luxembourg alex24 
at least gosugamers has them in the right place gosugamers.net/counterstrike/rankings
2019-02-22 07:16
#2
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North America B0bbutttoast 
I love how gosu's ranking is either really wrong or really right. IDK why people complain so much about HLTV's ranking, they can't just manually do it or people would bitch about bias. There ranking is the closest to a perfect ranking you can get. And if you really can't understand how they got into #4 then you probably haven't put enough thought into figuring it out or you're just an idiot. The ranking isn't for today, its for a week ago, and at that point it made sense that they were #4, don't worry they DEFINITELY won't be after the major lol
2019-02-22 07:22
#6
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Luxembourg alex24 
gosu ranking is real time and just makes sense because its about the team`s performance AT ANY event they play, either online or offline HLTV`s ranking takes indiviually players stats and cooks messed numbers and ranks... bla bla
2019-02-22 07:25
#10
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North America B0bbutttoast 
"and just makes sense" Vitality #5 cheifs #14 Windigo #16 my dude HLTV's ranking is way closer to making sense than that garbage.
2019-02-22 07:27
#12
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Luxembourg alex24 
top4 NRG when they haven`t won any T1 event or played against ANY T1 team that makes sense to you ?
2019-02-22 07:28
#16
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North America B0bbutttoast 
You don't have to win any events to be top 4, you don't have to win any events to be top 3, you don't have to win any events to be top 2, I don't know why that is such a common opinion. Why the fuck would a team have to win anything to be the 4th best team in the world? In a hypothetical situation If na'vi, liquid, astralis and NRG were in the same 10 tournaments in a row with other random teams and Astralis won, with Liquid 2nd, Na'Vi, 3rd, and NRG 4th every time then obviously NRG would be the 4th best team in the world. And they wouldn't have won a single fucking event, not even got top2. Obviously that isn't the same as what's happening here but its a perfect hypothetical to show why you don't have to win anything to be in any spot but #1. The ranking system is based of off events and placements in those events in relation to how recent the events were. FaZe's last event wasn't as recent as NRG's was, so NRG gained more points and the points FaZe gained for winning the eleague invitational became less valuable. And NRG gained enough points for getting out of the qualifier 1st to pass them. It makes plenty of sense if you just use your brain. I'm not saying its a perfect ranking system, a perfect one doesn't exist. However its about as close as you can get. Before the major started no one had any fucking idea how any of these teams were going to perform. Is NRG the 4th best team in the world? Obviously fucking not, its easy for you to say that now. But going into the major HLTV's system made the most reasonable ranking possible.
2019-02-22 07:35
#20
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United States n0rdie 
Agreed. I would rank a team who gets consistant 2nds over teams who get 1sts but also go out in groups and 5-8s
2019-02-22 07:38
#22
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North America B0bbutttoast 
Thank you! No one is saying that HLTV's ranking is perfect, but I don't get why so many people are just dumbfounded by how it works.
2019-02-22 07:39
#18
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
Its ELO, it’s a lot more accurate Vitality won a lot cause they won challenger, are winning again in legend, won a dream hack last year, etc. The fact that their ELO progresses fast is perfectly understandable. Only problem of ELO is that you don’t have inactivity decay (even if gosu removes teams if they don’t play enough) that’s why NRG stayed so high. But as soon as a team which isn’t where it should be plays, their ELO lowers really fast
2019-02-22 07:35
#26
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United States n0rdie 
"Chiefs won a lot lately on local tournament, so their ELO has been boosted." Yea only problem is no rank decay. I never heard of the chiefs and their #14, higher than faze fnatic g2 big ghost Also rank decay exists in elo systems
2019-02-22 07:44
#54
Magisk | 
African Union nwaarr 
renegades top 4 and vitality top5 ?
2019-02-22 08:27
#11
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
Its ELO, it can’t be wrong
2019-02-22 07:28
#14
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Luxembourg alex24 
its called garbage if t2 team chooses to play online t3-t5 events against t3-t5 teams and have good results... then they overtop the teams who play in t1 events against t1 teams ? ffs logics
2019-02-22 07:30
#21
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
No they won’t because of something called Kvalue Look at chiefs that got a lot of wins in t2/t3 league, they win 2 points per match Look at Vitality winning at major, they win 20 points per match When you don’t know what you talking about, just shut up or you look dumb
2019-02-22 07:38
#24
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Luxembourg alex24 
then freaking explain NRG in the past 12 months what t1 event did they win ? at least one match they won against a t1 team.. pls link me
2019-02-22 07:39
#58
Magisk | 
African Union nwaarr 
they won more tournament in the past 6 month the other team behind them that why thy are top 4
2019-02-22 08:33
#40
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United States flyflit 
+1 hltv users thinking with their feelings again
2019-02-22 08:02
That is literally the best i have ever seen it on this site yeah vitality is a bit high til we get to chiefs...
2019-02-22 07:25
#13
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
Chiefs won a lot lately on local tournament, so their ELO has been boosted. Same for some CIS teams when they play local tournaments. The only flaw of Gosu ranking is that there is not enough difference in the value of a win according to tournament size.
2019-02-22 07:30
#15
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Luxembourg alex24 
yeah thats the flaw in gosu, winning a match in a major = winning a match online... points wise hltv is also wrong because if you play a lan match against t3-5 teams, you get boosted
2019-02-22 07:32
#23
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
#21 Clearly wrong But the value différence for T1 events isn’t enough, even if it exists
2019-02-22 07:39
#29
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United States n0rdie 
Lol sure beating big/c9 is totally equal to beating 10 irrelivant teams from a weak ass region Beating a global team is totally equal to beating 10 gold nova teams @Yo_Les_Noobz clearly wrong
2019-02-22 07:49
#36
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
For a team that is ranked 30- it is. For astralis it’s not. And guess what, ELO system takes that inconsideration You clearly don’t know how the system works
2019-02-22 07:57
#41
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United States n0rdie 
O M E G A L U L Yo_Les_Noobz's guide to becoming a top 20 team in the world: Step 1: become silver 1 Step 2: play only silver 1 teams Step 3: beat silver 1 teams Step 4: enjoy your spot in the hall of fame Stfu
2019-02-22 08:03
#56
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
must be fucking retarded or brainless Expected from burger Step 4 would be getting invited to play against GN Step 5 getting rekted Step 6 go back to silver You don’t even realise that it’s the same system that is used for CSGO ranking system.
2019-02-22 08:32
#57
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United States n0rdie 
Oh fuck burger what a roast i cant move
2019-02-22 08:32
#61
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
At least read the real content of the post Fact is, your comparaison is just dumb, even if it’s actually working exactly the same but at different level
2019-02-22 08:39
#66
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United States n0rdie 
Fact: chiefs isnt close to #14 and if you think they are you need to get out of silver ¯\_(*v*)_/¯
2019-02-22 08:46
#61
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
At least read the real content of the post Fact is, your comparaison is just dumb, even if it’s actually working exactly the same but at different level
2019-02-22 08:39
#31
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Luxembourg alex24 
nrg vs astralis nrg vs navi nrg vs liquid nrg vs faze nrg vs mibr nrg vs nip nrg vs fnatic has NRG encountered these teams at least once in the past 12 months ? have they won anything against them ??????
2019-02-22 07:50
#34
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
You clearly don’t know what you’re talking about and how this system works.
2019-02-22 07:56
#35
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Luxembourg alex24 
for sure, but at least answer my question above its like i have the best ELO in my house, my rank is better than my dad, my mom, my sister or my brother si i guess world wise i`m also high ranked... just because locally i had good results
2019-02-22 07:58
#39
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Czech Republic Sauronek1996 
NRG beat Liquid, I think twice.
2019-02-22 08:02
#42
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
Your question doesn’t make sense so I don’t see why but I’ll answer No they didn’t But that doesn’t mean anything regarding how ELO is better than HLTV rankings
2019-02-22 08:04
#49
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
So let’s take Chief example First, gosu gives I think something like 10 max points for t3 events and 2nd division leagues, 20 max for t2 events and 1st divison leagues and 30 max for t1 events/majors. Major should be more but let’s not talk about that. So Chiefs are on 12+ win streak in 2019 and were allready on a win streak in 2018, against local teams and 2nd division league. But some of those wins were against teams So yeah their ranking progressed a lot and fast, and it shows that they are better than the teams in the tier they usually plays. So now, they have a tier 2 rating and ranking so they will perhaps play tier 2 events. If they do, they look probably loose against better teams and in 2 or 3 losses they will get at this level, they’ll loose as much points as they won in a 12+ winstreak and will really fast go back to the ranking their real level is. The real problem for CSGO regarding ELO system is how big the regional differences are. But you can just look at the ranking with EU/NA teams. And what people fail to see is that rankings, both HLTV and ELO, are not a real ranking, they are just a performance rating. And you can say it’s tier 10 CS, sure, but a 12+ winstreak, against teams at your level, is performing. The difference between the 2 is that ELO is a lot more accurate because real time when HLTV rankings takes to much time to reflect performance Decay. That said, you have 2 things you need to have a good ELO rating system : You need to define correctly the relative value of tournaments You need to have raring decay for inactivity and roster changes. Both things Gosu ranking does
2019-02-22 08:23
#64
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
And your example just shows how it works Your rating is high cause you won all matches in the house Go play the town tournament Get rekt Get back to initial rating
2019-02-22 08:42
#43
fer | 
Switzerland byter 
Vitality #5 omg. This ranking is so wrong
2019-02-22 08:06
#53
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
Look at their win/loss history you’ll undesrstand They won dreamhack They won qualifier They won minor They went through challenger They are 2-1 in legend Obviously, all that comes with a really high W/L ratio, so obviously their rating progressed fast. The problem is that people think that it means they are #5 best team in the world. It doesn’t, It just says that right now, they have the #5 performance of all teams. And with their W/L ratio, hard to tell otherwise. Especially when they stomp everyone and just loose against best teams, very closely
2019-02-22 08:28
#68
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Sweden LynXelele 
Gosu is more or less a form ranking.
2019-02-22 08:56
#59
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France Yo_Les_Noobz 
And when you realise that they lost more points loosing to tyloo than they gained winning against grayhound + vici you understand better that it’s a good system. That shows that winning against teams like that is normal for’them And loosing is underperforming
2019-02-22 08:36
their coach is just PogChamp
2019-02-22 07:23
#7
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North America B0bbutttoast 
IDK if you're being serious or not, but i have no idea why everyone is blaming imapet, the guy made optic SHIT tons better, he made CLG SHIT tons better, and made NRG SHIT tons better. There's only so much you can do as a coach, daps isn't that great of an IGL.
2019-02-22 07:26
#4
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Korea DadaDahyun 
They're just doing great in T2 tournaments while doing decent enough in T1 ones to not drop in rankings
2019-02-22 07:24
#8
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Luxembourg alex24 
but to be top4 you need to at least win some matches against T1 teams that never happened to NRG in the past year
2019-02-22 07:26
#69
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Sweden LynXelele 
They did beat Liquid 2-0 a few months back I believe but I see what you mean
2019-02-22 08:59
#9
tabseN | 
Germany Ratwar 
becuz htlv ranking is fucked, would fukcign avangar win this major they would be #1 here :D
2019-02-22 07:27
#17
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United States n0rdie 
They play mibr and liquid a lot accually. They r pretty consistant too. Dispite them going 0-3 i dont think that they were that bad tbh. All their games were really close. They should have won against coL tho, but i bet it was nerves. I think that they should be #5, faze #4. Consistant but they dont serm to have a very high celling
2019-02-22 07:35
#19
Romania jDT 
they attended at all t3 t4 t5 tournaments ...from here they have points. anyway t2 team for sure
2019-02-22 07:36
#28
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Luxembourg alex24 
thank you, that`s what i`m also rooting for as a valid explanation if anyone has a link with a match between NRG and any current top10 team... pls share nrg vs astralis nrg vs navi nrg vs liquid nrg vs faze nrg vs mibr nrg vs nip nrg vs fnatic has NRG encountered these teams at least once in the past 12 months ? have they won anything against them ??????
2019-02-22 07:47
I agree that they should not be in top 5, but here is the tournament at which they were pretty decent last year (the only one I can think of) hltv.org/events/3666/starseries-i-league..
2019-02-24 10:52
#25
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United States hltvconfirmed 
They just dont have consistent fraggers. If cerq,brehze, and ethan frag out they can balance out fugly and daps lack of frags. They need everything working to win games and cant rely on "someone" stepping up
2019-02-22 07:43
#27
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Finland Faust_fSt 
1) HLTV ranking should be interpreted, rather than taken just as it is 2) NRG has been so high up because A) They have - up until the New Legends stage - performed very consistently and played good cs B) The top 5-20 was just a steaming pile of weird, inconsistent shit all through 2018
2019-02-22 07:45
#32
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Luxembourg alex24 
agreed, but still top4 and you never played or won against any top10 team ????????? thats beyond my understanding of ranking...
2019-02-22 07:52
Pretty sure their America Minor showing + Major Qualifiers gave them a "form" boost that can give up to 200 points because they won all their matches, not dropping a single match. Also they had some good results in the past which are still "relevant" (2nd in SuperNova Malta, 3rd/4th in ESL NY, 1st place at summit 3).
2019-02-22 07:50
#33
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Luxembourg alex24 
ok you are right, but still in the past 12 months they have been a regular presence in the top10 world ranking and they haven`t played ONE match against t1 teams, like astralis, navi, liquid, faze.. or even t2 like nip and fnatic this can`t be logical
2019-02-22 07:54
I see your point but also take into consideration that most of the teams had barely any activity in the last 2 months: NiP, MiBR, FaZe played a 3 match tournament, mouz lost 2 players, etc. I'm not saying that NRG "took advantage" of that but they have had a lot of activity in the last months where they barely lost. I guess after the Major everything should go back to normal and they should be dropping to the #10-15 zone of the top 30.
2019-02-22 08:01
#38
f0rest | 
Mexico bfish8 
They won multiple tier 2 and tier 3 tournaments throughout the year while securing Top 4 finishes in multiple big tournaments. They beat Liquid, MIBR, and FaZe multiple times on LAN including in bo3's. They became the clear #2 team in NA and also dominated the online scene because they are far more dedicated than anyone in NA other than Liquid. They've also stomped North, OpTiC, G2, BIG, Gambit, HellRaisers, Renegades, TYLOO, Virtus.Pro, and Luminosity on LAN over the last year or so while taking maps off of NaVi in bo3's. This is why they are 4th in the ranking. They are a solid team who have overachieved far more than they've underachieved over the last year. You also have to remember that teams like FaZe, MIBR, G2, Cloud9, fnatic. mousesports, and North have all sucked over the last 6 months compared to what is normally expected out of them.
2019-02-22 08:00
#45
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Luxembourg alex24 
another good explanation, but still rank4 world wise because the other teams slumped its kinda ridiculouse
2019-02-22 08:10
#46
f0rest | 
Mexico bfish8 
FaZe, MIBR, and mouz the 3 teams ahead of NRG in the most recent rankings all made roster changes. That alone affects their ranking and they lose points instantly. When those new lineups start playing matches or tournaments and they drop maps/matches to teams they should otherwise not, they lose a more significant amount of points. These 3 teams have been dogshit over the last 6 months. Then they changed rosters. It's no surprise they dropped below a team like NRG.
2019-02-22 08:19
#44
s1mple | 
Russia neroler 
Nrg is more overrated than ence(NRG IS THE MOST OVERRATED TEAM IN THE WORLD. NOOBS. HOPE DISBAND.)
2019-02-22 08:06
#47
ile | 
Finland Vkims 
Bro keep ence away from this
2019-02-22 08:20
#48
s1mple | 
Russia neroler 
Sorry bro, but their performance on this major is awful (legend stage)
2019-02-22 08:22
#50
ile | 
Finland Vkims 
???? They just won a game?how is that awful?
2019-02-22 08:23
#51
s1mple | 
Russia neroler 
Vs big XD
2019-02-22 08:24
#52
ile | 
Finland Vkims 
It doesnt matter who they won, its a major. If you win games in major, you cant be awful
2019-02-22 08:26
#70
Australia DubL 
taking a group stage win in a major against a weak or underwhelming team is really no different from doing the same in another tier 1 event or lower just because its the major that doesnt mean you should regard weak/under performing teams as any better than youd normally view them as even if a team wins a match in a major group stage they can still be considered to be a pretty poor side compared to their surrounding competition - until theyve proven themselves against the stronger oppositions
2019-02-22 08:59
#72
Australia DubL 
id like to add that there is added pressure in the major obviously due to it being the most prestigious event, but i still dont see taking victories against weaker sides as anything noteworthy especially if a team is already expected to beat those types of lower level opponents
2019-02-22 09:06
#73
s1mple | 
Russia neroler 
+1
2019-02-22 11:48
#55
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United States jay_320 
Your premise is off just as an aside. NRG have faced a lot of top 5 teams and won. They got drummed out of this major because their stars are kids and the pressure got to Cerq. It's not exactly a shocking first time result. There is a ton of talent on this team. Would not be surprised to see them take a T1 trophy in 2019. Same goes for Liquid. If NA teams step up and finally win multiple big events in a year it'll be a big deal. 2019 seems the most promising year so far.
2019-02-22 08:29
#60
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Denmark wakils 
why is astralis at 933 points? the 4th feb they had 1k points, the 11th they had 933
2019-02-22 08:38
#63
tarik | 
Hungary EEver 
dafuq? They won 2 tournament in 2018
2019-02-22 08:40
#71
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Luxembourg alex24 
tier10 invitationals because the t1 teams rejected going to china or cs_summit house
2019-02-22 09:05
#65
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India AAgOnFire 
Remember when G2 were ranked 3 before Boston Major ??
2019-02-22 08:44
first team since the swiss system has been used to go 3-0 in the qualifier and 0-3 in the main tournament
2019-02-22 08:50
nrg piece of shit, just like nip, navi, fnatic, c9, faze etc.
2019-02-22 11:49
NRG is the most arrogant team in the scene. Makes shit veto to lose again col and avangar but bashes other teams for the same thing. Barely beat tyloo in 2 maps then acting like they were gods. You beat 3 teams that didn’t qualify for the next stage. Once they got a decent opponent, they fall apart and go back to the minors.
2019-02-24 10:35
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