Thread has been deleted
Last comment
VITALITY
ZywOo | 
Belgium itachiico 
I'm so happy everytime Vitality loses and get destroyed by a lower team like NIP. I want them to get eliminated from any tournament, to never reach playoffs with this lineup, and to mot get invited anymore. Because I want them to understand that 4 bots + Zywoo will never work, they need to go full international by kicking at first Alex and RPK and then bringing some young talents that would bring firepower.
2019-10-14 08:18
Topics are hidden when running Sport mode.
#1
 | 
Russia ToughGuy 
nt zywOo
2019-10-14 08:19
Alex a good igl team could be better with kioshima though
2019-10-14 08:19
#6
ZywOo | 
Belgium itachiico 
Alex Good IGL Pick one Vitality's CT side is now the worst I've seen in years, props to NBK who was doing a great job.
2019-10-14 08:22
#8
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
Doesnt mean Alex wont improve over time, just like with their T sides. On top of that Vitality's t sides are top 5 in the world, alex is an outstanding IGL. Apex and rpk are the ones who sandbag
2019-10-14 08:24
Alex doesn't have enough firepower for tier1 not even tier2
2019-10-14 08:26
#13
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
So far from the truth. Hes consistently placing top 4 in tier 1 tournaments that makes no sense
2019-10-14 08:26
Really? Alex ratings in all tournaments is below 0.99
2019-10-14 08:28
#18
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
Annnd hes the IGL and is responsible for the structure and cohesion of the team and aims to enable the star players. If the strategies are working and his stars are comfortable he doesnt need high impact. If shox and apex could actually put up 20 frags every other game... who btw have the good positions
2019-10-14 08:30
No that's the old cs where IGL like Xizt don't need to have firepower, the current time requires IGL like BlameF and Nexa!
2019-10-14 08:35
#22
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
Yeah blameF and nexa are definitely leaders of top 5 teams... oh wait
2019-10-14 08:37
alex isnt neither currently...and blamef and nexa never had carry like alex has
2019-10-14 08:47
#33
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
Alex has actually made teams play at an elite cohesive level regardless of the talent hes had his teams have always been greater than the sum of their parts. And you could stand to be a bit less semantical - Vitality is a team that regularly places top 4 and has actually won multiple big events this year. The vast majority of analysts would consider them a better and more successful team than Avangar and Fnatic
2019-10-14 11:32
"Alex has actually made teams play at an elite" his teams in the past werent most likely even t2. not sure what are you talking about "has actually won multiple big events this year" they won 1 big event bcs alex and apex were actually able to step up "Vitality is a team that regularly places top 4 and " and this is how it looked like: hltv.org/stats/players/11893/ZywOo?start.. zywoo: 1.33, rest of his team: 0.99, 0.99, 0.94, 0.93 hltv.org/stats/players/11893/ZywOo?start.. zywoo: 1.20, rest of his team: 1.16, 0.96, 0.93, 0.84 hltv.org/stats/players/11893/ZywOo?start.. zywoo: 1.36, rest of his team: 1.03, 0.97, 0.96, 0.94 this team is relevant only thanks to this kid. the hardest carried teams in history. the hell zywoo will be most likely the fist top1 player of the year without ani single team mate in it which speaks for itself
2019-10-14 11:59
#42
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
And his team now is currently elite. That's kinda how it works when you move your way up the tiers. You missed the key point tho, his teams always perform better than they are on paper when he fully implements his system Did you see zywoo winning tier 1 tournaments on his previous teams? No? So his teammates on Vitality are actually enabling him and allowing him to perform on the biggest stages. I dont see your issue. If a team is capable of supporting one player to carry hard enough to win tier 1 tournaments then by all means neccessary they should do it. Now does that mean that I dont expect more fragging out of some other players? Absolutely I do, Apex regularly underperforms in playoffs and rpk is nothing special. But alex took Vitality from a fringe top 10 team to title contenders. I didnt see zywoo carrying them to t1 tournament victories with happy on the team did you?
2019-10-14 14:03
"And his team now is currently elite." hltv.org/stats/players/11893/ZywOo?start.. this is your elite "team" hltv.org/stats/players/11893/ZywOo?start.. this is your elite "team" is zywoo has an off game "Did you see zywoo winning tier 1 tournaments on his previous teams? No? So his teammates on Vitality are actually enabling him and allowing him to perform on the biggest stages." jesus at least get your facts str8. he didnt attend single big event and he rejected offer from bigger teams bcs of school. it has NOTHING to do with his team mates in vitality. like i already said: not even single top20 player "I dont see your issue. If a team is capable of supporting one player to carry hard enough to win tier 1 tournaments then by all means neccessary they should do it." this supposed to be an argument? all his team mates are supprots and they dont have to perform? whole team except zywoo is underperforming individually and he is wasting his time here. without him they wouldnt be even top10
2019-10-14 14:09
#47
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
He didnt attend a single big event because his team was garbage and couldnt ever make it past online qualifiers. Case and point. Alex is a great IGL that has created a unique system, I'm not here to defend any of them on their individual performances, albeit Alex should be the last one were looking at to step up with how much structure and cohesion he brings to their team. Almost all of their losses come from individual misplays not a lack of tactics or teamplay. You absolutely cannot fault Alex if you believe this team should be better than they are.
2019-10-14 14:14
i never fault alex and i never said that he is bad igl. the only reason why i replied was this: "Yeah blameF and nexa are definitely leaders of top 5 teams" vitality are top10 teams thanks to zywoo. you have no idea how would both nexa and blamef were able to lead with player like this
2019-10-14 14:16
#49
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
Ignorant thing to disagree with. The point was that despite the fact that nexa and blameF are better fraggers they dont bring as much tactically to their teams as Alex so in the end it isnt worth it. And neither do you... or anyone. So until that time arises Alex remains the more established and successful IGL
2019-10-14 14:22
lets wait what will nexa show in g2/blamef in col if they will bring another good player. then we can judge i guess
2019-10-14 14:26
#52
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
Yes that's fair these are their first "big breaks" let's see what they do with their opportunities
2019-10-14 14:30
#35
 | 
France Chylvain2 
I have listening a lot of ALEX interview (you probably NOT) He looks very smart & a good captain, just wait some time before they can fix the new addition of Shox. + XTQZZZ is a very smart coach + they have one of the best video analyst (ViPR)
2019-10-14 11:38
*WiPr
2019-10-14 14:02
#54
 | 
France Chylvain2 
yep sorry :)
2019-10-14 14:34
Shame on you, such a disgrace Kappa
2019-10-14 15:29
calling shox a bot hahaha
2019-10-14 15:31
#61
 | 
Sweden Lagge15 
NBK stopped doing CT calls months ago. I think Cologne was the last one for him
2019-10-15 08:03
LULtality
2019-10-14 08:20
#7
ZywOo | 
Belgium itachiico 
+1
2019-10-14 08:22
#4
 | 
Brazil Florastation 
-rpk -apex +international talent although ZyWoo carries, it's ALEX who created a game where he could indeed carry, he's a good IGL
2019-10-14 08:21
#9
ZywOo | 
Belgium itachiico 
Their coach is the one creating strats, Alex is just executing them
2019-10-14 08:24
#10
 | 
Brazil Florastation 
coach has been there the whole time but the team only improved when alex came by (mostly because Alex and the coach thought about the game the same way)
2019-10-14 08:24
No they improved because they kicked Happy who was literally a bot.
2019-10-14 08:27
#15
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
And added a real IGL who brought structure
2019-10-14 08:28
#11
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
Even if that were true keeping players on the same page and making the right calls vs elite teams in high pressure tournaments is still incredibly difficult for most IGLs which is why most dont make it to tier 1
2019-10-14 08:25
#19
 | 
Brazil Florastation 
+1
2019-10-14 08:31
-zywoo +kennys
2019-10-14 08:21
#16
 | 
France G2_top_5_soon 
Shox was bettwr than Zywoo against NIP
2019-10-14 08:28
1 game...whats yout point?
2019-10-14 08:37
#25
 | 
France G2_top_5_soon 
Shoxie is performed in the other games too
2019-10-14 08:38
he had 1.03 rating at malmo and has 0.93 in esl pro league. he had few good clutches, i have to give him that but but other than that he is average at very best
2019-10-14 08:39
Nop
2019-10-14 09:02
#20
Maldives qeqd 
shox ruined every team he was on, overrated bot who's way past his prime
2019-10-14 08:33
Shox is decent, he one of the best lurkers and clutchers Also pretty solid secondary Awp In my opinion problem that apEX consistently underperforming, ALEX igl so we cant kick him, RpK is solid but average So basically if ZywOo not dropping 30 bombs each map - Vitality struggle vs any team So they need replace apEX in my opinion if he continues underperform by someone sick , but who?
2019-10-14 08:38
#26
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
That's the problem, you essentially have to go international and if you're doing that why not just -rpk as well and revamp the roster. So you need a passive rifler and an aggressive rifler.
2019-10-14 08:39
do u know atleast one team that changed language and improved? I'm not, usually its downgrade cause lack of communication
2019-10-14 08:42
#29
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
No but I also dont know of any team that has fully committed to it properly. No logical reason it cant work though given the proper commitment. Mouz and faze have both fought for top 3 spots with 5 players and a coach speaking a secondary language.
2019-10-14 08:45
Yeah but Mouz players all fpl talents and all of them had long career in international team, frenches will never be good with communicate on English
2019-10-14 08:49
#34
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
That's a bold statement, it's just a language with the effort anyone can do it.
2019-10-14 11:33
Well if you look at the grand scheme of things, the most successful teams (based on Major wins but also "era's") are teams from the same country/region that speak in the same language.
2019-10-14 12:01
#39
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
And that means the French will never be able to go international?
2019-10-14 13:56
Well they can go international, but, judging from the past and the pattern of top CS teams, they never will be as successful as a full french speaking team
2019-10-14 13:58
#44
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
The past doesnt dictate the future. Ideas and abilities will evolve, I wouldnt even be surprised if in 5 years the majority of teams were international, I mean just look at Dota.
2019-10-14 14:04
shox zywoo kennys AmaNEk Happy ez top 3 team
2019-10-14 11:58
happy ???? he is playing in tier 6 now jackz would be better
2019-10-14 14:08
man shox is shit igl happy is better igl
2019-10-14 19:43
#60
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
Happy brings nothing to any team. His strats have been outdated for 4 years and hes a useless lurker. Much rather have shox or jackz who can at least kill people.
2019-10-15 08:02
#41
23 | 
Austria cm_attack 
Ok
2019-10-14 14:01
> young talents that would bring firepower Oh wow 1) Any young talents that got more firepower than RpK and ALEX? I can recall bodyy, devil, xms - remind me where they are now? 2) Firepower by itself gives you nothing, ask FaZe for more info - even on a bad day NiKo and coldzera are easily better in raw firepower terms than 95% of their opponents, and how does it work for them without any strats, huh?
2019-10-14 14:26
#59
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
Yea but Vitality already have an established and competent IGL, their problems lie within individual performances. Faze are a completely different story, they essentially have their zywoo IGLing. Dont compare the 2 as if they're similar. Vitality would heavily benefit if there were some young fraggers to pick up
2019-10-15 08:00
#68
kennyS | 
New Zealand INxNITY 
Yes, but hes saying to get RID of Alex, I agree, maybe add someone who can do a little bit more fragging but does RPKS roles, like Kio for example. But, people are retarded by thinking the team only needs star players like NiKo kennyS Shox Zywoo and s1mple. I guarantee a team with a structure can beat them.
2019-10-15 08:40
why do you want them so bad to be young? it's not your girfriend, their age should mean nothing to you and im repeating: bodyy, devil, xms, oh and lucky - remind me where those guys are now and how their youth worked out?
2019-10-15 09:28
#72
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
They could be 71 for all I care, just need to actually bring some consistent fragging ability to the team outside of zywoo, its just that the most likely result is that they are a newer younger player. Young could also be in reference to their experience, not just their age. Moving on, those obviously are not the quality of players I'm talking about. I dont even know what you're arguing at this point. If there were better players available than apex and rpk then Vitality, in an effort to remain an elite team, should pick up those players no?
2019-10-15 20:22
They're people, not robots, and guys like s1mple that leep consistency for several years are rare. If there had been at least one up-and-coming talent they would've picked him already. But apart from ZywOo there was and still is none. When Ex6TenZ looked for a replacement for KQLY he said ALEX was such a talent, they still picked RpK though, and now ALEX plays for Vitality and you want him gone. Don't you see a pattern? A talented guy on paper, just like bodyy or xms, remember how you all liked those "talents" when they came? Again - where are they now? Do you really think they don't want to pick that consistent player to fix their issues? But they can't because there's none left, ZywOo was the only one, you see they even picked shox and gained some firepower over NBK for sure, but that's about it. It doesn't work that way. Ofc they could find a Stewie2K or an automatic out of almost nowhere, but it works out not so often, otherwise you would already see bodyy and xms being among the best. Some "talents" turn out to be s1mple or ZyWho, the rest simply disappear because they weren't so good or because they were unlucky at joining the right team, although the latter seems like bullshit, people like s1mple or shox played for shitty teams too and they didn't disappear, so it's about having what it takes, and there's no right guy left for Vitality, you see G2 even picked 2 Serbs because of that. As for international teams - it slightly worked for Na`Vi because they spoke the same language anyway and it was their initial language (it was not for GuardiaN but it's a Slavic language of the same language group so he learned it), look at SK with Stewie2K and tarik, look at FaZe even with karrigan, look at mousesports - it will never work, unless they're native speakers of the language they talk to each other, like Liquid.
2019-10-16 10:01
#74
 | 
South Africa nimmaJ 
Do you really think they don't want to pick that consistent player to fix their issues? But they can't because there's none left, ZywOo was the only one, you see they even picked shox This is pretty much the only thing you said that was relevant to my comment. My entire point is that IF there are new talents in the French scene (like Denmark, NA, CIS have) it would greatly benefit the top teams and would be cause for some changes in them
2019-10-16 14:42
They are consistantly making at least playoffs, and sometimes finals in all of the last big events they participated I don't think that you can say that it doesn't work
2019-10-14 14:34
just -rpk -apex +jackz +amanek and u have top 1 team easily
2019-10-15 08:06
+1
2019-10-14 15:30
#63
 | 
Switzerland RU!N 
Hahaha the hater...
2019-10-15 08:28
#67
 | 
Finland wolfplayer 
The anger towards them comes from the fact that one man carries the whole team. It is frustrating to lose to a team where one player does so much damage. In the big tournaments, they did well in the group stage, then they get dropped in the playoffs when zywho plays bad and the rest of the team can't do anything special...
2019-10-15 08:40
#69
 | 
France Nairelav 
As long as it works I don't get why they should change, going inter will maybe make them weaker
2019-10-15 08:48
#64
kennyS | 
New Zealand INxNITY 
Bruh, do you realise that 5 star players aint gonna work either? Look at faze and how that worked out.
2019-10-15 08:30
bruh thiange brain... maybe u are conterminated
2019-10-15 08:32
Personally I'd swap out apex for kennyS Shox to entry Kenny awp Alex IGL RpK support god Zywoo superstar Apex has just been playing terrible, if he improves, then no change will be needed tbh
2019-10-15 08:33
Omg people so dumb I'm not a vitality fan but Alex obviously is a pretty good igl and there are not many good igls nowadays Zywoo is pretty good when he's showing up Shox is a consistent star Rpk is doing his job and doing so much for the team he is definitely not the one to change Apex looks like a bot these days
2019-10-15 09:00
#75
 | 
Italy CHEBBOxxx 
vitality and consistency name a more distant duo
2019-10-16 14:42
Login or register to add your comment to the discussion.