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fallen > karrigan
Brazil eumesmo 
seriously, fallen made two majors sleeping in the floor. karrigan had niko, rain, olof and guardian, probably the most overpower line up in cs history, with the best awper and the best riflers in the world, but he couldn't win one single major. why is he so overhyped? why do faze want him back?
2021-01-13 00:12
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flag checks out
2021-01-13 00:12
3 replies
unexpected.
2021-01-13 00:13
1 reply
#51
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Denmark Yikesslol
cuz what happened when they benched him? You can clearly see he had a great influence on the team
2021-01-13 11:49
#52
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India xEleanorex
Flair doesn't checks out
2021-01-13 11:50
#3
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Europe PeaceDATA
flag checks out
2021-01-13 00:14
#4
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Poland Astoner55
Olof and Guardian weren't in their prime anymore, but yeah, Karrigan choked the major and a lot of other games, I actually also don't know why they want him back. I mean he is better than no IGL at all but still, I think they could at least give a chance to a younger IGL with more potential than a 30 year old guy that is well known for his chokes since the old days...
2021-01-13 00:14
15 replies
#8
rain | 
Czech Republic Guczy
wdym? GuardiaN was in his prime in 2017 and early 2018
2021-01-13 00:26
5 replies
#17
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Poland Astoner55
Guardian's prime was in 2014 and 2015. He was good in 2017 and early 2018, but he wasn't quite in his prime.
2021-01-13 00:45
4 replies
you cant say that, the skill ceiling on 2017-2018 is much higher than 2014-2015.
2021-01-13 01:11
3 replies
#32
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Poland Astoner55
Bruh have you ever seen Guardian or KennyS actually play in 2014 and 2015? They were fucking DESTROYING everyone with flicks all over the place. Their skill ceiling capped in 2015 and they never came back to their form. Talking about individual skill ofc
2021-01-13 01:35
2 replies
AWP was so much OP back then, thats why.
2021-01-13 01:37
1 reply
#35
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Poland Astoner55
Not saying it wasn't. The only thing I said is that Guardian's, KennyS' and Olof's prime was in 2014-2015. Tec9 and AWP being OP surely did have something to do with this, I think everybody knows it.
2021-01-13 01:38
Sure Karrigan choked, but you can't omit the fact NiKo was completely carried If NiKo had actually done ANYTHING in the finals, it'd have been a guaranteed win for FaZe hltv.org/stats/players/matches/3741/niko.. He was a complete bot on the first 2 maps and an average rifler at best on the third lmao Expected from a G2 fan though
2021-01-13 00:37
7 replies
#16
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Poland Astoner55
I absolutely agree, NiKo choked as well, but the tactics are often more important than individual skill. And have you seen Karrigan's tactics throughout the whole major final? Becacuse I've watched that match live and facepalmed quite a few times. Not saying Karrigan is bad... just saying he is outdated.
2021-01-13 00:45
5 replies
He certainly choked, but when you consider that he's got players who can say "fuck this, I'll take an ak and go fak zem", you can't solely blame him. Plus, there's a reason that he's been at the top 1 spot with 3 different teams, having made major playoffs consistently since 2015 (playoffs at 8/13 majors attended) Yes he chokes in the critical moments, but he's also an all time great, and still not outdated.
2021-01-13 00:51
4 replies
#34
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Poland Astoner55
Sure, he is really good, but I just think it's better to take someone that isn't 30 yo and slowly declines individually. And the argument you've made in the first paragraph makes no sense, since according to many interviews with FaZe members and Karrigan alone, at Atlanta 2017 major everyone was listening to his every word, nobody ever opposed to him or did something against his will. If anything, it might have been Karrigan that told NiKo to "take the ak and fak zem", not the other way around. The distrust in Karrigan came much later, at Faceit 2018 major, according to the players themselves.
2021-01-13 01:37
3 replies
I worded the first paragraph pretty poorly, but the point was that the players he had at the time should've been winning most of their aim duels hence being able to just "grab an AK and fak zem". Since players like NiKo were terrible in the major final, it's not just Karrigan at fault for the loss. However bad a strat was, players like Rain, Olof, NiKo, and Guardian should've been able to turn the game with individual skill, just look at Guardian on the mirage game as an example, or even Rain's insane CT Dust 2 games. If I remember correctly, Karrigan did better than NiKo in 1 of the 3 maps and similarly over the whole series (bar inferno where NiKo woke up but rain dropped off the face of a cliff), and NiKo is meant to be the superstar carry potential player. Also, NiKo was questioning calls as Karrigan made them in game and suggesting other things shortly after Boston. You never to that to an IGL under any circumstances unless you want to totally ruin them. First off, it's plain disrespectful to the person who is leading your team to success as it makes you seem like you think you know better, which is absolutely not the case because NiKo is one of the worst IGL's to ever touch the game. It also starts throwing team chemistry into question, with NiKo departing FaZe, no teammates said a single good word about him, the best he got was from Rain who said 'It will be... different playing without NiKo because I've heard him for so many years'. If you do this to the person calling the strats, it causes the IGL to start doubting themselves and get in their own head, which is the worst thing that can happen as they'll constantly second guess themselves resulting in self sabotage. The reason Karrigan became so bad at leading in the end of FaZe is because he had 'no support from his team or coach at all' (Quote from Guardian in a rivalry.gg teammates video, who also said the team totally failed Karrigan) TLDR - NiKo destroyed FaZe, ruined Karrigan's confidence, and lost Boston. Also I can try and link anything you want proof on.
2021-01-13 02:29
2 replies
NiKo was supposed to get a 1.25 rating, that was his job, him choking was probably the sole reason FaZe hasn't won a major, he is supposed to be insane even if he doesn't have that great leadership, just look at 2020 FaZe he was top 5 player with him as IGL
2021-01-13 17:53
1 reply
You've done a TLDR of my comment so easily >< wpwp
2021-01-13 18:53
+1
2021-01-13 00:47
#56
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United States xcalibot
on the major guardian was on prime, he was carrying them all ffs. niko was choking so hard
2021-01-13 12:24
karrigan is a good IGL but he is always unlucky in the grand finals
2021-01-13 00:20
1 reply
unlucky? 0/8
2021-01-13 01:09
no
2021-01-13 00:25
#7
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Russia NOD777
Karrigan eu, fallen na. EU > NA. Get rekt
2021-01-13 00:26
4 replies
+1
2021-01-13 00:30
#10
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Europe legal2333
Fallen = SA*
2021-01-13 00:31
in this case, NA/SA > EU fallen better igl and player (considering all time)
2021-01-13 01:05
1 reply
#50
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Russia NOD777
Whatever makes you comfortable bro. Karrigan is able to close astralis when fallen is balding overhyped oldman
2021-01-13 11:39
#11
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Brazil Largato
+1 Karrigan always got the best teams and accomplished so little in comparison to Fallen who got "milk out of stones" and achieved two majors and a lot of championships. So why Fallen get all the hate about the age stuff and Karrigan is treated like a god IGL on the community? Makes no sense.
2021-01-13 00:32
3 replies
FALLEN GOT MILK OUT OF STONES??? DONT OVERDO IT, DONT GO OVER THE TOP, LG/SK HAD VERY GOOD PLAYERS AT THAT TIME, FNX AT HIS PRIME WAS THE SECOND TO NONE BESIDES FALLEN AND COLD, FER WAS TOP3 IN THE WORLD, TACO WAS SECOND TO NONE AS ENTRY(ONLY BEHIND RAIN 2017 IMO)
2021-01-13 03:38
I mean, in 2016 four players of LG featured the top5 cluchters.
2021-01-13 04:21
#59
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Poland kvvach
bcuz of Wisła Kraków destroing fallen
2021-01-13 12:38
Karrigan has been winning tourneys since 1.6. He took several lineups to 1# and won S-tier tourneys with them including players who had never played on a pro level before. Fallen showed that he is unable to change. he's still running the same strats as in 2016 which is why his teams havent won anything relevant since 2017
2021-01-13 00:33
2 replies
#22
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Brazil mrkkkkos
fallen used to play on cs1.6 too on old col with fnx
2021-01-13 00:59
1 reply
But he didn't amount even 20% of what karrigan did in 1.6 tbh
2021-01-13 12:51
thats a fact, theres nothing to argue in favor of karigan both are/were great players tho
2021-01-13 00:33
karrigan is one of the best igls, his ability to adapt to whatever type of lineup he gets is INSANE, not being better than one of the best igls in the history of the game isnt something bad, karrigan isnt better than fallen but he still super good.
2021-01-13 00:39
2 replies
+ 198382 WAS NOT EXPECTING U SAYING THIS
2021-01-13 03:39
1 reply
I'm always spreading facts my brother <3 karrigan legend!!
2021-01-13 03:48
coldzera seems to admire karrigan. so he must be good/top IGL
2021-01-13 00:50
1 reply
WHATEVER MASTER COLD-SENPAI SAYS, I WILL BOW DOWN MU HEAD TO THE GROUND TO HIS ULTIMATE TRUTH
2021-01-13 03:42
Hurr durrr Karrigan overrated. Karrigan won many trophies, against SK, Astralis and other teams so respect him low iq user
2021-01-13 00:54
5 replies
#23
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Brazil mrkkkkos
faze never beat sk on a final, you are a brazilian you shoud know that
2021-01-13 01:00
3 replies
But they won trophies in tournaments that Sk, Astralis and other teams was playing. Yes, you are really dumb
2021-01-13 01:04
2 replies
#41
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Brazil mrkkkkos
sk still better than faze, so prime fallen> karrigan
2021-01-13 03:15
1 reply
Yes but Karrigan isn't overrated, he is more consistent IGL than Fallen. But Fallen have more titles and firepower
2021-01-13 03:24
-1
2021-01-13 01:04
Fair point I also believe karigan is overrated I don’t yet have a opinion on fallen I want to see what he does with liquid then I’ll decide. Good post Yo clarify I think karigan is good but I think he’s overrated
2021-01-13 01:08
because ChoKo choked away the finals. NiKo is the main reason Faze failed to win the boston major imo. he was an absolute bot the first 2 maps. if NiKo played even 65% of how we was before the final FaZe wouldve easily taken it
2021-01-13 01:09
ofc, first time Karrigan beat Fallen's team on a bo3 was in 2018 LOL he didnt do it as TSM, didnt do it as Astralis and just could do it as FaZe in 2018 when SK-Mibr was already on their downfall.
2021-01-13 01:13
5 replies
TSM > Kabum TSM > LG Astralis > LG Astralis > SK Astralis > MIBR Astralis > MIDisband
2021-01-13 01:47
4 replies
TSM/Astralis couldn't beat on bo3 LG/SK until they get rid of Karrigan. Then Karrigan got to Faze and they couldnt beat them still until 2018. So Karrigan got butt slapped by Fallens team for 3 years straight.
2021-01-13 02:36
3 replies
but Astralis is better than ex-MIBR, keep this in mind, don't be a delusional
2021-01-13 02:37
2 replies
Astralis with Gla1ve yes. Astralis with Karrigan never won agaist Fallens team on bo3. We are talking about Karrigan here.
2021-01-13 02:38
stupid
2021-01-13 17:47
MY HONEST OPINION ABOUT KARRIGAN: HE SEEMS TO HAVE SOME SORT OF NATURAL LEADERSHIP, HAS GREAT EXPERIENCE IN DOING CALLS AS IGL, I DONT THINK HE IS OUTDATED AS U CAN SEE WHAY HE DID TO MOUSE SPORTS IN THE RECENT YEARS, PLUS IS RENOWNED TO BRING TO TIER1 LEVEL PLAYERS LIKE ROPZ AND FROZEN IN OTHER WORDS HE HAS ALL ASSETS FOR A GREAT IGL HOWEVER THE ONLY THING THAT BOTHERS ME IN HIM IS HIS LACK OF FIREPOWER... MODERN CS CANNOT AFFORD A 4 AND HALF MEN ON THE SERVER, U NEED 5 FULL MEN WITH FIREPOWER TO BECOME A MAJOR CHAMPION. WHEN I SAY FIREPOWER IT DOES NOT TRANSLATE PURELY IN KDA(BLAMEF HAS INSANE KDA BUT I DONT CONSIDER HIMSELF AN INSANE AIMER), BUT A GUY WHO HAS A CHANCE TO WIN ANY AIM DUEL AGAINST ANYONE
2021-01-13 03:52
4 replies
+1 Sunny > AleksiB
2021-01-13 12:22
1 reply
OK IGL HAS TO HAVE BOTH GOOD STRATS AND FIREPOWER, ONLY FIREPOWER ALONE IS LIKE FAZE NIKO 2.0
2021-01-13 17:43
Did you spill a can of gamer fuel over your keyboard and got your caps lock stuck?
2021-01-13 12:27
+1 Sunny > AleksiB
2021-01-13 17:49
#53
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Brazil Mad_bettor
FaZe are in talks with tactical mastermind MiGHTYMAX to replace olofmeister hltv.org/matches/2344201/mousesports-vs-.. hltv.org/matches/2344255/endpoint-vs-mou..
2021-01-13 11:57
device>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>faleen
2021-01-13 11:59
i think fallen is a good igl but not better than karrigan. Karrigan has showed he can bring up teams to nr1 too while fallen has just igl'd one core team, until they went to shit (mibr).
2021-01-13 12:29
Good joke.. Its not often people on this site is okay with making jokes about things from there own nation.
2021-01-13 12:43
1 reply
BECAUSE HE IS A BR HATER OF OTHER BR
2021-01-13 17:44
career wise Fallen is easily better than Karrigan... at the moment they are probably the same level, washed up but lets see what Fallen can do with good players
2021-01-13 17:49
Karrigan is overrated
2021-01-13 18:59
karrigan has made every single team he joined better so far, even if he hasn't won much yet
2021-01-13 19:02
Eclipse
1.33
Watch This
3.12
Wisla Krakow
3.24
forZe
1.31
AGO
1.60
PACT
2.28
Bet value
Amount of money to be placed
Winning
Odds total ratio
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