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Karrigan's effect on FaZe.
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Latvia adzmons 
Karrigan joining Faze this year seemed like an a terrible idea with the current results they are showing. But his effect is obvious. Broky who was a mediocre awper is now showing he can compete with the best in flash point . Coldzera and Rain who were hit hard in the stat department now are starting to show more success. The only player to not improve under karrigan right now in faze is Twistzz . But its obvious that Faze is improving at a unchallenged rate. they nearly 2-0 G2 in flash point , what Karrigan said he wants the team to peek in 9-12 months . So people calling Karrigan to Faze a terrible move is wrong because Karrigan can't instantly change everything so everyone just becomes great again . If you do believe that you're Naïve as Karrigan took 8-12 months before they started becoming top tier competitors.
2021-05-16 19:56
Topics are hidden when running Sport mode.
+1
2021-05-16 19:57
17 replies
#16
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CIS ronaIdo9
bad thread, just proves my point that karrigan is the most overrated cs player oat
2021-05-16 20:25
13 replies
I still don’t no why the fcuk karrigan thought 14-13 was a good to time to force
2021-05-17 04:39
8 replies
i have a theory that karrigan and Faze are scared of reaching 14-X scorelines, thanks to all the 16-14 losses. Maybe that's why they wanted to get it over with
2021-05-17 04:57
they were on a double eco
2021-05-17 08:05
no loss bonus, even if they saved they would have no money. So it was going to be 15-14 anyway, the force just gave them a chance to go to 15-13, and maybe get some money off of it.
2021-05-17 16:34
5 replies
It was 14-13 in favour of Faze. If Faze would've lost that round they could full buy at 14-14. But got nutted with that force buy on 14-14 and couldn't even buy fully when it was 15-14. Idk if he was playing mind games with G2 or what but this did cost them
2021-05-21 21:53
4 replies
they wouldn't have, maybe enough for galil's and some utility but that's it, they had 1400 loss bonus btw, rewatch the game $2000 +$1400 = $3400, not enough for ak armor. SO it would have been 15-14 anyways, so there's no reason to not force (maybe don't full force but instead like half force like leave 500-$1000 left). 14-14 get $1900, full glock save 15-14 $2000 +2400 = 4400 ak armour util
2021-05-21 22:27
3 replies
Wait on 14-13 (in favour of Faze) Faze already got 1400. And even if they lose 28th round making 14-14, they would've got 1900. So, 2000 +1400+1900 = 5300. Enough to spank G2 on 14-14 and take the match point.
2021-05-22 06:39
2 replies
dude it was 14-13, they lose, it's 14-14 2000+1400 = 3400 where are you getting the 1900, it was 14-13 not 14-12
2021-05-22 15:31
1 reply
understand. it was round 27th, scoreline was 14-12 (In Faze's favour), both Faze and G2 had a full buy. Faze lost this (27th) round, making the scoreline 14-13 and Faze received a $1400 loss bonus. Then Faze forced on the 28th round and again lost making it 14-14. And received 1900. If faze hadn't forced in 28th round, then they would've got 1300 (left before 27th round) + 1400 (27th loss bonus) + 1900(28th loss bonus)= 4600. enough for a good buy
2021-05-22 16:35
agreed
2021-05-17 05:14
Nothing can be more overrated than gambot
2021-05-17 08:28
he managed to perform with many different rosters, he's not overrated Just not as good as before
2021-05-17 13:27
i dont know about that, he has had a good career but he has been an absolute disaster since comming back to faze.
2021-05-22 11:33
-1. Karrigan said that they will be in peak form during the major. But now they might not be at the major.
2021-05-17 08:27
1 reply
Major's spots decided by 3 rmrs,not by single 1
2021-05-17 08:29
+1
2021-05-17 08:28
tldr
2021-05-16 19:58
1 reply
#12
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Latvia adzmons
GIve faze 6 months and they become better. Also players play better now.
2021-05-16 20:13
wdym twistzz hasn't improved? he's a very good player
2021-05-16 20:01
17 replies
#10
Polin | 
Europe Daudy
But he didnt get much better after karrigan
2021-05-16 20:12
16 replies
#23
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United States Azaqa
You clearly didnt watch 2020 Liquid... pure depression as a Liquid fan
2021-05-17 04:46
He has, just not at Flashpoint. For whatever reason this event was really poor for him. His other events this year have been solid though, aside from the odd map he's been on point.
2021-05-17 04:51
14 replies
#34
Polin | 
Europe Daudy
Didnt he instantly perform better when he left faze? Twistzz played for some time without karirgan and performed pretty well
2021-05-17 07:46
13 replies
#51
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Portugal cyn1cal
I think Twistzz was a star player before. Now with karrigan he is support for some reason
2021-05-17 13:32
3 replies
Why do people keep saying this? He's got all the high fragging positions as CT on every map, and he's only entrying when he feels there's an opportunity, in the same vein as k0nfig, dupreeh, electronic, etc.
2021-05-17 18:57
2 replies
#60
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Portugal cyn1cal
I said "I think"
2021-05-17 21:07
1 reply
It sounded like the second half of your comment was being more definitive, my b
2021-05-18 05:47
You mean when he left Liquid? Yeah he looked pretty good but he didn't play many games. I think he's only gotten better since Karrigan joined though, just look at his series vs Ence, Train vs Na'Vi, Mirage vs G2, etc. For the most part whatever Karrigan is doing is allowing him to reach a pretty high level very consistently.
2021-05-17 18:56
8 replies
#62
Polin | 
Europe Daudy
Yeah i meant to type "when he left faze". Idk i just think that twistz was good and with players that are that good any improvement is hard to spot for someone like me (i dont watch that many of his games...)
2021-05-18 14:01
7 replies
Twistzz has looked really comfortable for the most part, especially on CT sides. Definitely better than where he was in Liquid, though we don't have enough of a sample size to say that the version of FaZe with Olof & Twistzz would have sustained the level they had at Blast. I can't say if he's in Grand Slam form as FaZe haven't made it far enough in tournaments to have enough games against top 5-10 teams (also I wasn't watching much CS in 2019), but he's definitely getting there. Flashpoint was an off event for him unfortunately, and I think that's given people a worse impression of the team as a whole because he's expected to put up at least a 1.10 almost every series. If FaZe make some more improvements or swap out any of the players who are under performing (seems to just be rain who is having a really hard time at the moment), then Twistzz could definitely have more opportunities to show just how good he's been.
2021-05-18 23:54
6 replies
#65
Polin | 
Europe Daudy
Yes but is putting player in position he likes really improvement? I mean it is for the team but i wouldnt call it player development. Its not the same karrigan did with bymas and frozen for example Edit: My question is if he had same positions in liquid like he has now do you think he would perform the same worse or better? And if worse why do you think he performs better in Faze. Its ebcause of Karrigan or because he changed teams and some players are really motivated when this happens.
2021-05-19 12:07
5 replies
I mean I don't know how much "better" Twistzz can really get. He was already one of the best players in the world in 2019 (top 5 by Thorin's ranking), and he's a pretty complete player all around. If you set him up for success then he'll play at a really high level most of the time, as he's done so far. Karrigan isn't known specifically for developing players, he's known for getting the best out of his stars. This means giving them the tools to succeed themselves, because generally superstars know what they need to do once they've been set up. This is a pretty underrated part of being an IGL, and is part of the reason why I think people defending NiKo's IGLing are braindead. He never managed to get a consistently high level out of any of the players on that team, aside from himself and possibly Broky. Compare that to someone like MSL, who brought k0nfig, aizy, Magisk, and Kjaerbye to an insane level, with only Magisk really reaching his peak outside of MSL's leadership. It's also part of the reason why why Aleksib is so great, because on both Ence and OG he's been able to squeeze performance out of players that wouldn't be nearly as good without him. Part of why Twistzz was never going to reach that level in Liquid again is because no one really cared to help him do that. There's enough publicly available evidence to suggest that he was essentially forced into the backseat both socially and in game on Liquid. What an IGL like Karrigan does is puts stars like Twistzz in positions so they can be the absolute best version of themselves (among other things), which many IGLs don't always understand or know how to do. I don't think his performance was just due to motivation, otherwise he wouldn't have been hit so hard by the player break in 2019.
2021-05-19 23:03
4 replies
#71
Polin | 
Europe Daudy
"Karrigan isn't known specifically for developing players" Not true karrigan is known for improving even the most Xprienced players But overall i agree
2021-05-19 23:30
2 replies
Yeah I meant more developing as in bringing up inexperienced players (i.e. most of mousesports). Idk if he necessarily "improves" players, but rather puts them in optimal roles for their skillsets. Like I don't think NiKo got better under Karrigan, he was just given the support to unleash his full potential.
2021-05-21 21:45
1 reply
Ok fair enough i guess.
2021-05-22 11:23
#110
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Poland Menaheer
+1
2021-05-22 11:42
yeah this buy at 14-13 was 1000iq karrigan effect
2021-05-16 20:02
3 replies
#5
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Denmark pebblez
wtf FaZe about to lose a map to Sproot lmao
2021-05-16 20:03
#14
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Latvia adzmons
That is something I can't explain because im a 0IQ faze fan.
2021-05-16 20:14
if people think matchfixing doesn't exist in t1 events, then this should prove it. at least that's my opinion.
2021-05-16 20:18
eh not sure broky has been faze's best rated player for a while now cold's performance was expected to improve because he was relieved of IGL duties and twistzz really needs to start showing some consistency
2021-05-16 20:03
5 replies
Right now Twistzz is used for gathering info and doing supportive playstyles which explains him underperforming. Kind of a waste of talent.
2021-05-16 20:10
4 replies
according to karrigan he's playing the roles he wants to + they're experimenting a bit. Besides, they keep getting eliminated in the first round its not like they're getting much experience
2021-05-17 04:58
#35
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Asia Torsyen
in t side, rain and cold doing the lurk mostly, wdym mean twistzz support role when he is the 2nd 3rd guy to entry site?
2021-05-17 07:50
2 replies
He entrys and gathers info for ct. he plants bomb and so on at t side
2021-05-17 08:03
1 reply
He doesn't hard entry, he's a play maker. When he goes out first it's because he's trying to capitalize on a read, not because he's playing a supportive role. A lot of the best riflers do the same, like electronic, k0nfig, NiKo, etc. Dunno what you mean by gathering info on CT, he plays standard high frag, high impact positions like short B on overpass and connector on mirage. Those are preferrable, the bitch roles on CT are small site anchor positions.
2021-05-21 21:48
giving time doesn't change karrigan strats
2021-05-16 20:08
1 reply
He's experimenting my friend, from what i've seen he's trying to have a double awp setup between broky, twistzz and coldzera. He also had twistzz play support roles and having rain be the backup plan. cold is getting better ever since karrigan came so that's a positive impact i can point out currently.
2021-05-16 20:12
+1
2021-05-16 20:10
+1
2021-05-16 20:14
#17
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Ireland cawley2
not sure about rain tbh
2021-05-16 20:25
5 replies
agree, him and coldzera have been underperforming for so long
2021-05-17 04:40
4 replies
cold sucks ass in faze
2021-05-17 04:44
+1 :(
2021-05-17 08:39
Cold is playing great, twistzz is bad rn
2021-05-19 23:16
1 reply
He's been pretty good at Flashpoint, but aside from that he's been really underwhelming since Karrigan joined. As a lurker he should have better stats than he has because he has opportunities for easier kills. If he can maintain that form without impacting Twistzz then the team is looking good, otherwise idk.
2021-05-21 21:51
#20
ZywOo | 
India aR__
+1, he said results will come in around 3-6 months. Have patience and believe in the process and Karrigan!
2021-05-17 04:41
+1 also LAN will be benefitical
2021-05-17 04:42
#27
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Brazil JgzMcz
+1
2021-05-17 05:05
Rain has gone from poor to absolute disaster. Otherwise the roster is okay
2021-05-17 05:12
5 replies
#48
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Finland Khroni
If he doesnt become the absolute hard support then theres no reason for him to be there anymore, karrigan puts up basically the same numbers as him now
2021-05-17 13:26
4 replies
Yup, also it would be better for rain himself to get out of Faze
2021-05-17 16:28
He's pretty much a fill player at the moment. He doesn't really have a super defined role it seems, he just does whatever nobody else wants to. So I guess he's a support now.
2021-05-21 21:52
2 replies
#99
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Finland Khroni
Well rn he's a support player that doesnt know how hes supposed to be supporting someone It could all come together nicely at the end when karrigan sorts out Twistzzz broky and colds roles properly but right now hes about as supportive as a toothpick is in holding up a steel bar
2021-05-21 22:24
1 reply
Yeah seems that way. Launders did a pretty good video about it recently, rain is playing ladder on T side train for example, which isn't really suited for a more rigid and "precise" player like rain (he compared him w/ flameZ, who is a really scrappy, twitchy player by comparison). I have a suspicion that Karrigan is putting rain in some of the roles ropz is good at because he expects that ropz will be bought out at some point in the future. Rain playing pop on train only solidified that for me because it's a spot I've seen ropz play a bunch.
2021-05-22 23:08
imagine he wouldn't have left mousesports... i think he gets what he deserves.. he was kicked by faze and mouz gave him more than a 100% support... he build a team around him that actually worked! but then... then he thought he could win more in faze? he not only ruined mouz (i hope they do good in the future just because karrigan betrayed them) no he ruined two teams! well to be honest faze was already ruined... just imagine a mouz lineup that changed bymas and chrisJ... always liked karrigan a lot but now i'm cheering for him to loose!
2021-05-17 05:26
5 replies
#50
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Finland Khroni
Karrigan left mouz because they benched woxic and put Bymas onto the starting roster without having an awper ready to replace him They wasted 3/4 months with karrigan/chrisj awping because of that, it's easy to get annoyed when your org wont give you one of the most important roles in the game
2021-05-17 13:28
4 replies
But +acoR happened ? Imagine if they just -bymas +twistzz Karrigan Ropz Frozen Twistzz AcoR This roster is better than this FaZe roster will ever be.
2021-05-19 23:10
3 replies
#73
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Finland Khroni
Yea that roster would legitimately be stacked for individual skill The acoR move happened after it was pretty much too late though, a few weeks before his contract was set to expire mouz realised that he was going to leave and chose to overhaul the lineup properly
2021-05-20 00:01
I think Twistzz would be a better substitute for Frozen tbh. They ideally play the same role on T side.
2021-05-21 21:53
#120
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Spain ez25
-karrigan +sexter
2021-05-22 16:42
#31
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Portugal MrPato
Idk man... Rain has been on downhill for a couple of months now, roles have switched, lots of players have found their pacing like Cold and Twistzz, Broky is almost there, but nothing seems to be working for Rain... even when they let him off his entry duties, he still failed to deliver
2021-05-17 05:49
lol are people still believing in karrigan? I guess some things never change. They play better? Yeah, that's why they always end up at the bottom. They only played better with olof, karrigan is so bad that there are no words to describe it.
2021-05-17 05:56
1 reply
#39
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Finland :XD
+1 Dude plays with mostly tier 1 players all his career and yet barely any achievements
2021-05-17 08:16
flair flag
2021-05-17 06:02
#36
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United States _salmoN
this lineup has a good winrate on mirage (7-3) and inferno (4-3), they lose train every time and it's leaving the pool soon. Like they're not far at all from having a map pool that works for them if they can win on Ancient or Nuke or Dust or whatever
2021-05-17 07:54
2 replies
#45
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Asia Torsyen
but their performance is not consistent enough, only showing some good performance in 2 maps is not enough to win trophies
2021-05-17 13:20
1 reply
#56
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United States _salmoN
I would still rather be Faze than Fnatic lol
2021-05-17 18:15
#46
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Norway BijeaN
0/8 AWFUL thread. The only thing this shows is that NiKo wasn't as bad of an IGL as people thought. At least with NiKo they could win some series against a few teams. WIth Karrigan now they can't win against ANYONE. Idc how close they get.. it doesn't matter if u can't close the games out. I love Faze but im kinda happy they are losing everything the way they are cuz it shows the problem definitely wasn't NiKo, like all braindead haters say
2021-05-17 13:24
1 reply
Niko good igl but an idiot when considering new players for the team, like broky and bymas were super good but fucking hell NEO, Adren and Kjaerbye made no sense (either game vision wise, language wise or role wise like hoooly shit)
2021-05-21 21:50
#47
REZ | 
Sweden flabbit
wow so many delusional faze fans in this thread lmao
2021-05-17 13:24
tbh Twistzz has been the best thing about FaZe so far
2021-05-17 13:36
Wrong, imagine giving 8-12month's for a professional team, organisation pays big money for this, so you think they gonna faking wait for year, and hope ther will be succes?! And if not?! Think logicaly, Twistzz is playing well as waited from him, he does hes job as suspected, coldzera 1of3 matches shows good play's, he is ther not always but its ok, broky to be honest a bit regressed, statistic doesn't mean everything... hes impact is very small lately, Rain starting underperforming even more, and from Karrigan nobody waits mega kills, but nowadays if you want to be succesfull, ingame Leader have to be ther to win matches........
2021-05-17 13:44
#59
ropz | 
United States Goob
but you don’t realistically have a year in the current CS climate to make a team great, not enough money in the scene to have a team make middling results every time.
2021-05-17 19:17
ok they need time everyone gets it. But baby boy they faced G2 like 3-4 times and never defeated them. + they lost to some tier 2 teams. ?
2021-05-18 23:57
#66
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Ukraine Dert_
what's wrong with you
2021-05-19 12:00
2 replies
#68
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Denmark Humber98
Karrigan bot
2021-05-19 23:05
1 reply
#72
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Ukraine Dert_
sure but it's not the main reason
2021-05-19 23:30
i think karrigan bad and adren good.
2021-05-20 00:02
"because Karrigan can't instantly change everything so everyone just becomes great again ." But he's making things worse. #23 is now FaZe's all-time lowest ranking on the HLTV leaderboard, beating out the previous all-time low, #21, which iirc was back in October 2019.
2021-05-20 03:55
rain improved? you mean his 0,87 rating on flashpoint?
2021-05-21 21:47
G2 were ass with Niko literally until now and niko has been there for like at least twice as long as karrigan has been in faze so yeah...
2021-05-21 21:47
4 replies
they were so ass that they were first in their blast group in the first event niko joined and made it to a semifinal in the event after. Do you really want to compare this to faze bombing out in groups every damn tournament they enter?
2021-05-21 22:28
3 replies
and went lackluster afterwards man im a G2 fan but you cant just go into the extreme everytime you analise a team G2 were ok and now faze are bad but damn that it its not like they are playing like silvers just chill out with half assed team analisis (not you but hltv, i mean its fun but not when people start arguing over it)
2021-05-21 22:46
2 replies
yes they are not playing like silvers but the expectations and the potential they got is pretty high compared to what they are playing rn
2021-05-21 23:06
1 reply
ofc but there are similar stories of liquid, navi and g2 underperforming and at some point they started kicking ass best plan for faze is to grind and to try again
2021-05-22 14:36
0/8
2021-05-21 21:48
rain still same
2021-05-21 21:49
he is good IGL but not great, on par with blameF (if we compare with other Danish Player)
2021-05-21 21:52
2 replies
after read other comment, your statement about: "...Karrigan can't instantly change everything so everyone just becomes great again . If you do believe that you're Naïve as Karrigan took 8-12 months before they started becoming top tier competitors..." is really dull because, Karrigan himself said he chose Faze because of the experience and that mean 8-12 month to become great again, IMO, is too long. for me, an experience player only need adaptation process around 4-6 months, if Karrigan can't make Faze top 10 in that period, i think the problem could be in his style or elsewhere (unsupported management, underperform players, other rising better teams, etc) to elaborate what i mean about his style as the problem, from what i watched when he was in Astralis (i don't really watch other Karrigan's team playstyle), i can tell that Karrigan had his own thought about how to approach the game and it's logical but every logical thing could be wrong
2021-05-21 22:10
1 reply
Faze (at least prior to this season) had the least amount of support from staff, no analists or mental coaches or anything... there were many shit tier teams with better resources than bloody Faze
2021-05-22 14:38
Karrigans effect on Faze is that they fell to the lowest position for last 5 years
2021-05-21 21:52
#88
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United States tictok
rain has taken a steep decline ;\
2021-05-21 21:53
"But its obvious that Faze is improving at a unchallenged rate" got folded by sprout, twistzz getting worse, broky no impact, rain still collecting cheques, but yeah, "unchallenged" rate
2021-05-21 21:54
5 replies
40% brain damage
2021-05-21 21:56
4 replies
40% win rate
2021-05-21 22:04
3 replies
26% to be exact))
2021-05-22 06:35
2 replies
#111
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Poland Menaheer
30-40%
2021-05-22 11:57
no?
2021-05-22 16:13
Rain really needs to improve his aim ffs He is losing games for Faze. I really love him he is sucha nice person but this won't excuse his performance
2021-05-21 21:55
Yup. Give them a couple of months. Faze will bounce back for sure.
2021-05-21 21:56
#94
broky | 
Egypt MuXSS
They just need to swallow their pride and start to play some t2 tournaments like spring sweet spring. I remember mouz with karrigan in the beginning, they were playing some of these tournaments to gain confidence as a team, All what FaZe needs right now is more officials together and grind like all other teams do.
2021-05-21 22:00
0/8
2021-05-21 22:04
lmao ahaha I'm dying 8/8
2021-05-21 22:06
i like u
2021-05-21 22:27
Karrigan is a butterfly, free in the wind
2021-05-22 11:59
#113
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Portugal Rpfmc
Make Faze Great again!
2021-05-22 12:54
#119
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Portugal W!LDF1RE
Yes loosing 2-0 against G2 rn isn't a shamefull result for FaZe at all rn. Even if they didn't play at a level to win that game, they still showed some fight. Give Karrigan time people
2021-05-22 16:35
broky played better with niko than he has played with karrigan, at least for now
2021-05-22 16:46
Unbeliavable how delusionaly stupid some people are, they literally think that FaZe with olof was better than FaZe with karrigan. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
2021-05-22 23:13
You are a new fag if you think karrigan's had positive impact on FaZe. Only thing karrigan is known for is to have impact in the first few months of joining lineups. He has done it in the past but this time around it hasnt worked. Partly because of washed up cold and rain. In my opinion he should have stayed at mouz. He had ropz, who is better than all of FaZe combined. Karrigan's only possible chance of winning a major was with ropz. I don't see hiim winning a major with cold & rain.. Twistzzz & broky are very good but cold and rain are washed up... so to sum it all up.. Karrigan's FaZe move is an utter disaster!
2021-05-22 23:14
6 replies
wrong, it took time before he does something with faze and mouz. For example he had kio + allu ect when he joined faze, and it took some time and olof to reach to god tier cs they were playing you throw "new fag" in your comment like you know your shit, but you have short memory
2021-05-22 23:22
5 replies
Lol. when he joined FaZe he immediately had an impact on them at an Eleague studio tournament, wtf u on about bro? ..also you say that I have "short memory" lol, kio wasnt there when he joined FaZe lol. also God tier CS? Lol. They were never god tier, they were really good under him but never God tier. Only SK & Astralis played god-tier CS in 2016-2018ish You too are a new fag Sir..
2021-05-23 06:44
4 replies
they were stomping every one for months, so yeah it was god tier btw kio was there when Karrigan joined faze, try again. Inactive for a month then back with karrigan
2021-05-23 12:14
3 replies
and.. that stomping that you are alluding to.. resulted in how many Major victories? Nope. He wasn't. You try again new fag. Calling others "Short memory" when you yourself don't know anything for shit lol
2021-05-23 12:17
2 replies
Stomping for months yeah, and smashing everybody when they played. And it didn't happen when he joined, it took much time, olof and niko. They made the major finals, won by C9. No other team was even close to them back then Even if Faze didn't win the major, you have to be delusional af to ignore their dominance during several months. Better skip facts and shit on karrigan, because hltv does? Speaking about facts: yes, kio and even allu played with karrigan liquipedia.net/counterstrike/KioShiMa liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Karrigan Now take some time to throw another made-up argument
2021-05-23 12:30
1 reply
Smashing everybody ok.. but you didnt answer my question, that smashing all that dominance accounted to how many majors? you know because when SK dominated they won 2 majors.. when Astralis dominated, no one came close to them in teamplay and major victories.. so.. If FaZe was that good, why didnt they win a major? If no other team was close to FaZe in that Boston major, then how did C9 beat them? I am not shitting on karrigan. I really admire him as an IGL but his decision to leave a team which had youngsters full of potential (ropz & frozen) to join a team renowned for being a retirement home for washed up players was a seriously dumb one. karrigan could have achieved so much more with youngsters in mouz than he ever would do with cold and rain. When did I say that kio didn't play with him? Please show me? I only said that when he joined, there was no kio in the lineup.. You think pointing out that X player played with Z player in the past would change the fact that you are a new fag who just recently started watching CS?
2021-05-23 13:48
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