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Liquid Lazy
CARLOS | 
Latvia Comzie 
After blast, instead of taking a small break going to NA for a bit perhaps then coming back, seemed to spend most of their time in NA rather than actually practicing for their next tournament, There's no other way to describe them than lazy, after a solid month of hard work they already took a decent break an event after the player break. Sad to see that this is their best roster since 2019 yet they're clearly not bothered enough to put their best foot in
2022-09-24 18:36
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2022-09-24 18:36
#2
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France weedwalker
hooneymoon period is over. no team with an igl like nitro will be a top contender team.
2022-09-24 18:37
4 replies
Not even honeymoon period, they performed when they put the work in, put they were simply lazy this time around
2022-09-24 18:38
2 replies
#6
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France weedwalker
nah they just surprised teams with their new team and having a couple of new tricks up their sleeve. i doubt this team can get any better even with more hours of work put in. they are simply not talented enough. their awper is mediocre and their igl is awful.
2022-09-24 18:38
1 reply
I'm pretty confident in saying they definantly can keep performing, which as you said it is up to consistancies of oSee and nitr0 to atleast perform to a minimum standard. They clearly lacked teamplay and coordination today more than anything and seemed poor as a team which you get by putting hard work in scrims
2022-09-24 18:40
Yeah he is stuck in 2018 it seems. Dry ass playbook and aim of a grandma
2022-09-24 18:38
#8
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Brazil Anarchybr
Dude Liquid is probably the team that spends less time practicing in the scene. Yes, they’re lazy, there’s no other way to point this out. When FalleN was on their roster I was well aware of their routine because I follow him on social media. They’re used to take breaks in the middle of season to go back to NA and their normal day practice is of just 6 hours. It was clear that a lot of times they got to events without even practicing the week before. It’s ridiculous. Everyone on that roster are paycheck stealers.
2022-09-24 18:41
35 replies
Fallen and Stewie biggest paycheck stealers in liquid history
2022-09-24 18:41
20 replies
#17
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Brazil Anarchybr
The last time Liquid got top 3 in a top tier event, FalleN was their awper and IGL. (Katowice 2021) Since then they chosen to give Bot2k IGL duties and FalleN wasn’t able to carry NA bots again
2022-09-24 18:43
19 replies
True stewie2k fucked over fallen in liquid. I feel bad for naf and elige Stewie held them back for 3 YEARS!!!
2022-09-24 18:44
18 replies
#28
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Brazil Anarchybr
Elige and NAF are insane, I love them both but Elige seems to be a difficult person to deal with, even more now that he’s practically a part-owner of the team, I bet he has too much decision power inside. He should focus more on his aim which is his best asset and leave the tactical side for whoever is IGLing. NAF in the other had is a player that 100% of the top teams would bring in if he was avaible, a rock solid player, insane clutcher and chills personality
2022-09-24 18:49
17 replies
#44
 | 
United States Gonginator
Elige is becoming ego-centric like Shox and NiKo used to be. He wants the team to be run in a certain way. No other IGL worked with Liquid that well because Elige has to be told what to do. He's afraid to be given any sort of freedom because anytime his teammates and/or himself are given free reigns to make a play as they see fit, he just gets overwhelmed mentally. If anything AleksiB would've been a good pickup for Liquid because he plays VERY structured and has particular setups. That is something Elige "needs" or else he just won't play that well. Also, Elige and NAF have great peaks when they're in the zone, but they're relatively inconsistent as of late. This much should be obvious. oSee is a good AWPer, but people expect him to play like ZyWoO or s1mple. It also doesn't help that his team plays like dog shit half the time. oSee and YEKINDAR are equally affected in this regard when the rest of their team isn't hitting any shots or the communication is bad. I do agree though that nitr0 is using textbook strats from 1-2+ years ago instead of being up to date with the current meta.
2022-09-24 18:57
16 replies
Fairly good reasoning, I don't think they need a superstar AWPer of any sorts, but a consistant pillar who is not a star but on the brink of and able to hold his weight respectively, a player like mantuu slots into this catagory perfectly.
2022-09-24 18:58
9 replies
#56
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United States Gonginator
Exactly! People expect every pro team to have a "star" AWPer, or just multiple "star" players for that matter. However, the truth is that there are multiple top 15 teams who only have 2 "star" players, or maybe 3 at most. Consistency is key because high highs mean absolutely nothing if someone has very low lows. It's either you're consistently winning or you're just going to flip flop between getting a W and taking a fat L.
2022-09-24 19:03
8 replies
Generally speaking, it really all depends on the team, a team like liquid just needs an awper to pull his own weight considering they have 3 star riflers with high potential, some other teams may also have 2-3 star riflers but not as high of a potential which is where they need an awper on the same page to create an entire perfect bond of consistancy. To win I think you need a mix of a high peek along with consistancy, as consistancy will net you deep runs, but high peeks is what will win you finals / semis
2022-09-24 19:06
7 replies
#67
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United States Gonginator
All very valid points. I'm just very disappointed with Liquid's recent performance. It's so crushing to see a team that you support "throw away" a great opportunity to get themselves 1 step closer to making a deep run in a LAN event.
2022-09-24 19:10
6 replies
Wasn't much of a liquid fan before yekindar and not fully one at the moment but it's just sad to see how if they would put in a bit more work could get their best roster in years to their deserving positions and showcase themselves as a team
2022-09-24 19:15
5 replies
#74
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United States Gonginator
Liquid fans like myself can only hope. They have the ball in their court, but they've dropped it several times now. I still have hope though because if I don't, then how can I be a fan and have something to look forward to? I wish them success, but that doesn't do anything for them unfortunately :\
2022-09-24 19:22
4 replies
Well it's a good mentality to have, if you lose hope in the dark times, to put it straight, you might aswell be a plastic fan, all you can do is hope for the best :)
2022-09-24 19:24
3 replies
#78
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United States Gonginator
I'll be drinking my copium and most likely get clowned on then :D
2022-09-24 19:25
2 replies
Better to keep supporting with honor than be 2 faced and change teams every other week. As a Faze fan maybe you will get the same treatment one day :)))
2022-09-24 19:27
1 reply
#82
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United States Gonginator
You're not wrong there - glad to see FaZe stand where they are now. It was a long time coming.
2022-09-24 19:32
#54
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Brazil Anarchybr
I don’t agree with the oSee hate, he’s not the one who should’ve carry TL, they have 3 insane Aimers this is enough firepower. Similar to what happens in FURIA, (KSCERATO, yuuriih and arT can carry the burden) oSee and saffee both doesn’t have to carry, they just have to play minimally decent because those teams don’t rely heavily on awping anyway. Nitr0 on other hand have to plan better strats, those past games they seemed lost
2022-09-24 19:01
5 replies
#59
 | 
United States Gonginator
Yes! oSee is good on his own in my opinion, and he's relatively consistent. The problem is nitr0's strats are outdated as most people constantly mention. Also, Elige and NAF are not nearly as good as people make them out to be. Don't get me wrong, they're both great players, but they're definitely not that consistent.
2022-09-24 19:04
4 replies
#63
 | 
Brazil Anarchybr
Elige is being inconsistent since last year. NAF is more solid in my opinion but is hard to perform when they keep changing players
2022-09-24 19:06
3 replies
#66
 | 
United States Gonginator
Yeah. I agree with you on both things. I hope Liquid can permanently sign YEKINDAR because this roster has a ton of potential. If nitr0 can adapt to the current meta, then they can be just as good as if not better than the Liquid that won the Intel Grand Slam in...2018, or was it 2019? It's been quite some time so my memory is foggy.
2022-09-24 19:08
2 replies
#73
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Brazil Anarchybr
2019 And I agree But they to spend more hours praccing, on top of increasing their playbook
2022-09-24 19:21
1 reply
#75
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United States Gonginator
Thanks! I knew it was either 2018 or 2019 haha. Yes, they definitely need more practice and to diversify their playbook. If their results at ESL Pro League Season 16 group stage aren't a wakeup call for them, then I don't know what is or will be. On another note, I hope FURIA can go back to their old form where they were just explosive. It'd be nice to see teams outside of EU win tournaments and claim Rank 1.
2022-09-24 19:24
It's not acceptable, even before when they had a terrible roster, it still wasn't acceptable but it's especially not acceptable when they have a top 3-5 roster and their roster has developed the most its had in ages. NA is simply not made for this stuff
2022-09-24 18:42
12 replies
#23
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Brazil Anarchybr
I don’t know man, all EU and SA rosters I know practice insane hours daily. NA rosters in other hand like to limit their daily hours so they can spend the rest of the time playing Valulrant. There was a point last year that Stewie, Brehze and CerQ were playing more hours of Valorant than CSGO weekly even being professional CS players
2022-09-24 18:46
11 replies
S1mple must still have the ethics from since he left liquid then lol
2022-09-24 18:49
10 replies
#30
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Brazil Anarchybr
Is he still playing too much Valo?
2022-09-24 18:50
9 replies
Couldn't tell you tbh, all I remember is him streaming valorant before, the major I believe it was? or cologne one of the 2. Maybe he is though who knows :) look at his recent performances
2022-09-24 18:51
8 replies
#36
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Brazil Anarchybr
Maybe there’s a reason behind his recents struggles but idk, with this Russian invasion going on I dont blame him for anything
2022-09-24 18:52
7 replies
Yeah as much as I understand and respect that reason you have to admit it's a bit drawn out, they managed to win an event like a few months after it and it's been almost 7-8 months now. Maybe he's just a bit burned out
2022-09-24 18:56
6 replies
#51
 | 
United States Gonginator
You can't really compare s1mple to anyone else though except for ZyWoO. Nobody else comes close to him. s1mple has natural talent, so even when he does slack off, that's about the same level of skill as when most other players put in many hours of practice. The quantity of time spent practicing doesn't necessarily correlate with the quality of practice. apeX could practice 24/7 and s1mple could practice 6 hours day, but he'd still be better than apeX would ever be no matter what. There are factors out of peoples' control that separates them from another person.
2022-09-24 19:01
5 replies
#58
 | 
Brazil Anarchybr
You’re right. Even when s1mple is on a “slump” he has statistics that 99% of the pro players would dream of having (1.17 rating in the past 3 months, his lower since I don’t know, 2019!?)
2022-09-24 19:03
Wrong message reply or?? xd But yeah I see your point but that doesn't only come down to talent but also years on years of practicing mixed with the experience, it's built in practically like muscle memory to such a high extent. Your points aren't wrong, but the point where I'm coming from is that the teamplay and coordination seems incredibly weak, of course the individual level wasn't perfect, but in a game like csgo coordination / teamplay are just as important which is why I bring up the point of them being lazy. Your teamplay will slowly deteriorate and communication will get slower if you don't put the hours in and for me, it's evidant they didn't as much as before, the reactions are slower etc
2022-09-24 19:04
3 replies
#65
 | 
United States Gonginator
Nah, my intention was to reply to you, but looking back at my message, I definitely said things the wrong way, so my bad for the misunderstanding. I just meant to say that even if s1mple is underperforming for whatever reason, that's still the level of performance that most other pro players can only dream of reaching. That's how big of a skill gap there is between s1mple and ZyWoO and everyone else. Even then, ZyWoO is still a far behind s1mple in terms of pure talent. I wholeheartedly agree with you that they definitely lacked practice because their teamplay today was pitiful compared to the past. I don't know what Liquid are doing, but clearly they're not practicing enough because they made so many simple mistakes.
2022-09-24 19:07
2 replies
I get your points, just seemed unrelated to the previous points beforehand but that's besides the point, I agree with you on that hand, S1mple most definantly is incredibly talented, and his lows are as good as some top tier pros highs, but as I said I think that still factors in with ofc s1mples talent, but also his past hard work and experience, as I said it becomes muscle memory to you to be that capable and talent also plays a big role But I think in terms of talent I wouldn't say theirs a big gap in terms of talent, I would even argue for raw talent, Zywoo has even more, comparing s1mple who was on the scene for 2 ish years before getting top 4 where he would join navi and would be a good 6 months before that team became number 1, in which after 2 more years, s1mple would only get number 1. Compared to Zywoo who would hit number 1 after his first year of t1 experience, that for me is talent compared to years of hard work which gets you n1
2022-09-24 19:14
1 reply
#72
 | 
United States Gonginator
True true ; For s1mple, his hard work of his past has become muscle memory for him and ZyWoO achieved greatness in a shorter amount of time than s1mple. Why can't people learn to mimic the good habits of others? :(
2022-09-24 19:20
#88
 | 
Italy PhilD06
well their practice days got longer with yeki though
2022-09-24 20:48
They took 1 week off like vitality and other teams after the epl. But 1 week off is lazy when they will play for 1 month Jon stop
2022-09-24 18:44
2 replies
Everyone deserves a break of course, but after you take that break you should be putting hard hours into developing your game and working on team chemistry with your best roster in 3 years. Be honest with yourself you think it looks like they did that? Incredibly sloppy games last 4 days
2022-09-24 18:46
1 reply
I was horrible but they changed a lot of their roles. Naf should return at b anchoring on vertigo. Nitro should play a pit and naf return to b inferno.
2022-09-24 19:01
poor Yekindar.. I hope he makes a big fat paycheck while he's suffering playing at Liquid. No man outside North America should take this burden of carrying super bad NA team..
2022-09-24 18:47
6 replies
That super bad NA team is better than your team though haha
2022-09-24 18:51
5 replies
NA is bad just twistzz is good i think even mm players are better from sa
2022-09-24 18:53
1 reply
SA copium
2022-09-24 21:27
Wrong.. not in the present nor in the past.. Liquid is just a shitshow. hltv.org/matches/2357746/liquid-vs-furia..
2022-09-24 18:57
1 reply
Liquid is top 3. They are better than your team. Keep crying.
2022-09-24 19:18
Liquid can be summarized by that CT 1v2 clutch that woxic won on inferno.
2022-09-24 18:54
#40
 | 
Austria wdy629
so they wont be in the playoffs :-/
2022-09-24 18:55
#46
apEX | 
CIS imixiu
osee is literally trash, he is like konfig. 2/10 good matches, tier3 awperz
2022-09-24 18:56
What’s wrong with spending time in NA? They do live there after all. It’s not their fault with the European bubble that was created that their region gets cucked. NA used to have 6 events in NA a year. We have gotten one since 2020 due to Covid unfortunately. I agree that they should be preparing, but breaks are good and needed. I don’t think lazy is the right term though.
2022-09-24 18:59
18 replies
2022-09-24 19:25
17 replies
Don’t think they’ve been that sloppy. Today was bad and yesterday was alright but first two days were good. They do look a little off but that happens with time off. I mean look at faze and navi. I think the highlight of this group so far is EG looking decently good for the first time in quite some time. It’s crazy to see how much difference it makes when you have an igl who actually cares about the game and puts full effort into it instead of Valorant. HexT is a good young player. Brehze and autimatic are great players as usual. If Cerq can just find his consistency again. This team will be good in time.
2022-09-24 19:54
16 replies
Even in the first two days imo they were definantly sloppy, if you watched that game vs movistar I can recall them losing to a full eco possibly 3 times if not more, also that can be put down to them playing weaker teams, along with the fact YEKINDAR was playing out of his mind, nitr0's lack of prescence was also felt along with oSee's. EG definantly looking upwards but this team isn't one you expect to make multiple deep runs or deep runs in the first place, of course it's nice to see positive NA reimbersment but I've always said this, the best path is to just import EU players which will almost always result in deep runs, just odd considering EG's paychecks compared to what they get in return
2022-09-24 19:59
15 replies
oSee has had an off tournament no doubt. People saying they should replace him though are nuts. Dude has been great since joining Liquid. People just like to hate and hate on anything NA. And no I didn’t watch the first match. The games start pretty early for me and I’m not waking up and watching cs right away lol. I don’t think importing eu players is the move. Maybe one or two but the overall core is good. If they put it together, they can make deep runs. Same way flames and Movistar riders did it. The problem with NA and NA cs is the lack of tournaments and events we get. Like I said we used to get 6 tournaments a year. That is 6 times the best teams came here to play CS. Not only did it help out our NA teams for scrims and practice so we didn’t have to goto EU but also the lower tier teams to develop/practice and understand the current metas. Now with the current eu bubble, any region that isn’t eu just gets cucked.
2022-09-24 20:06
12 replies
I don't think the problem is with oSee having an off tournament, sure it's not gonna help but it's the entire picture, I have no problem with him but when you look deeper into it, Liquid at the moment is a team that should be capable of competing for trophies and the biggest weak link is oSee / Nitr0, for oSee, his overall rating vs top 5 this year is not even above 1.00 which is scary, and when he did have a good tournament cologne, he averaged 1.11 which is also scary if it's considered a ''good'' event for him. I think he still needs time to develop but firepower wise what they lack is a consistant awper. It's definantly not helpful that theirs no NA tournaments, but I think it still goes without saying EG is not a t1 team, this event is a result of Brehze and Autimatic performing and Nealan to an extent, just looking at it it seems way to lack luster to consider putting into playoffs imo, Definantly not easy to get into cs as a different region thats for sure
2022-09-24 20:12
7 replies
What NA lacks nowadays is experience. All our young players have never been a top tier lan event before. This is HexT first time and to be fair I think he’s holding his own quite well. NA has good players that lack the experience which is the problem. You look at EU and they constantly get to play against the top teams and players which develops the younger players. People like shit to on NA for something we can’t really control. I don’t think Liquid lacks fire power. They got 3 good riflers and a good awper who is still developing. Like I said oSee has been great and he’s shown more potential than the other young awpers in tier 1 tbh. Nitr0 is like the Karrigan for Liquid tbh. Being gone for over a year in Valorant doesn’t help either. Cs is a game that you need to consistently play to keep up your mechanics and skill.
2022-09-24 23:02
6 replies
Exactly, thats why NA needs an academy system which would genuinely develop the system can't really comment much more than that. Not that they lack fire power or anything but when you have a player who can't carry his own weight it becomes a liability which I hate to say it is what oSee becomes at times along with nitr0 and 2 liabilities is too much. I don't know if I agree with the statement, I think oSee is just about the 10th best awper simply because their is a lack of good awpers. IDK about that one, nitr0 doesn't bring 1/10th of what karrigan brings, he's also like a liability and his strats aren't the most updated nor does he do a whole lot
2022-09-24 23:09
5 replies
I compared nitro and Karrigan just due to their fragging abilities. Neither consistently frags anymore which happens. I get Karrigan is older and nitr0 was gone for over a year. I think nitr0 needs more time realistically. Strat book wise yeah Karrigan probably has the best in the game. I think oSee can hold his own weight. Besides this tournament like I said he’s been pretty good. But yeah he’s had an awful tournament but you never know what’s going on with players if he had personal stuff going on etc. Sometimes you just aren’t feeling it which I get I’ve been there, I know probably have. NA Academy system would be good but they would need established orgs because currently the only way to develop is by being EU. Idk CS is in a weird place rn. I honestly don’t know how the scene will look next year with the franchise league. I don’t know if players will come back or not. The NA Valorant league is only 25 NA players lol. People saying the t2 scene will thrive but I don’t know about that. The two best NA teams in Valorant aren’t even in the league lol. Only if writing essays were this easy for school.
2022-09-24 23:20
4 replies
Statistically wise, you'd think Nitr0 would be similar frag wise but that's the thing, it's like comparing an exit frag to an entry frag, if you watch karrigan play he creates an incredible amount of space for faze while for me watching nitr0 I simply see him get kills against low HP players and lacks game sense karrigan has, so even if the statistics portray they frag similiarly, karrigan has far more impactful frags imo I can understand this tournament isn't great but I really think you're overestimating oSee which is fine, but I think oSee pulls his own weight in the last roster but this roster is one that on paper should be title contenders and I'm sorry but oSee is not fitting on a team that has one of the best firepowers and experience in the top 10, fair enough if liquid were like they were before around top 5-10 but this team is 3-6 among the best teams and I don't see a place for oSee on a top top tier roster like this one Valorant is all fucked I don't even know whats going on from what I heard they just removed all the partnerships of all top teams or something on the lines of that which simply makes no sense lol
2022-09-24 23:23
3 replies
Who would replace oSee? There is literally no one lol. oSee has been good the guy is a great player. It’s just a bad tournament. I just don’t understand with this site that if a player has a bad event the team should drop them lol. The player gets even more hate if they are from NA. It’s whatever though our region is used to it. I think oSee is where he needs to be. I don’t see what other team for him or who would possibly replace him. It just doesn’t make sense.
2022-09-24 23:43
2 replies
I'm not saying this simply due to the fact that oSee has had a bad tournament but just l believe oSee in general is lackluster hltv.org/stats/players/events/13249/osee.. Just look at all the big events, these aren't all of the big ones but 90% of them, just look at the current trio in liquid and tell me whether you think an awper that provides that should be there, he is not meant for a roster that is tied for the 3rd best with about 3 others which all have a better AWPer and I think it shows. I think mantuu would be a good replacement but if you think not, liquid should try get a good foot in for dev1ce if possible
2022-09-25 00:02
1 reply
I have nothing really to add my friend. Just remember not to post videos of you partying. It’s illegal nowadays apparently. What you said about Valorant being a mess. I’m sure you know but Carlos got canceled by the Val, league, and twitter community because SJWs threw a fit because he partied with someone. Riot is the last company to hold grudges too on stuff like that. Sad world we live in.
2022-09-25 00:17
I disagree that Osee has been great in liquid. He’s pretty consistently struggled vs top tier teams and the stats back it up. The talent is there but the consistency is not. He shouldn’t be replaced but his consistency is 100% a bottleneck for this teams potential.
2022-09-24 20:51
3 replies
oSee has been pretty good since joining Liquid. There really isn’t no other way to put it unless you want to be nit picky which is what people tend to do for NA lol. Has had a bad tournament. Happens to everyone at some point.
2022-09-24 23:14
2 replies
For the year 2022 he has a 1.02 rating vs top 20, .97 vs top 10, .95 vs top 5. He’s lower than hades in all those. I don’t really find it nit picky to call that not good. It’s not awful but good? Not by the standards of a team trying to win a championship
2022-09-24 23:19
1 reply
oSee has been good since joining Liquid. Someone pointed out that 11/13 events he has played with Liquid. 6 of them he had over 1.10 and the rest were over 1. He’s only had two bad tournaments. It’s just when someone plays bad this site likes to rip them up. Nothing new really. Not saying you are doing that but overall there has been a lot of posts about liquid and oSee lol.
2022-09-24 23:38
with EG its progress to not go out last place tbh
2022-09-24 20:58
1 reply
That's true but just consider the budget EG has and what they have, could be far bigger
2022-09-24 21:09
Likvid, wtat a fuuun... ? What did u do? I lost 80k twitch-points and -20 points in fantasy team... someone please tell Osee: "play better!!!" He need more death matches
2022-09-24 19:09
Oseeeeeeee... Oseeee... Oseee...| please go kill please go kill
2022-09-24 19:10
#77
 | 
Italy Karimk03
Liquid will never win a trophy with nitro and osee, i already said this 1 month ago but people call me dumb or that i dont understand cs go.
2022-09-24 19:25
1 reply
Osee, yes Nitr0 as IGL no, he only has valulrant brain But it was much worse with Steaming10am as IGL
2022-09-24 22:19
Yeah thx yekindar for getting rekt by the turks 0.87 rating for the top 1 riffler of the game
2022-09-24 20:35
3 replies
thx for yekindar to save an entire region
2022-09-24 21:10
2 replies
Ur the most anoying user
2022-09-24 21:49
1 reply
Thanks, it means alot I'm in your thoughts <3
2022-09-24 21:50
holy shit it's mind blowing how fucking dense fans are, do you really expect Liquid to keep the same schedule they had pre-Cologne? they were ALL putting in 60, 80 hour weeks according to nitr0 and EliGE. that's so unsustainable for a job that (yes, even if it is a videogame, believe it or not) is really mentally taxing and stressful. they're traveling constantly, away from their support systems, and people like you see them instead working 6 hours a week every day (42 hrs/week) and call them lazy. get a fucking grip
2022-09-25 00:07
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