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ZywOo price on the market
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France Guilsz_ 
Recently ZywOo's agent Jerome Coupez made an interview with a french caster and the question eventually came up. His agent insisted in saying that ZywOo is really happy within the org and that Vitality accomplished every promess they made (building around ZywOo). He also said that Vitality puts no price on him and that he will finish his contract (December 2024). Finally Jerome estimated ZywOo's price atm (knowing that he still has 1y 1/2 of contract) and said that he would be around 5M euros. What we thinking? overpriced? fairly priced?
2023-05-17 14:19
Topics are hidden when running Sport mode.
No one is paying 5M for a CS player
2023-05-17 14:19
20 replies
people forget that zywoo not winning that much tournament lol people praise him especially french baguette
2023-05-17 17:28
7 replies
#271
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Vietnam TIGIDOU
0/8 so why Faze bought Ropz
2023-05-23 10:48
6 replies
cuz ropz>zywhoo
2023-05-23 18:44
4 replies
#289
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Vietnam TIGIDOU
yes we all believe u
2023-05-23 19:16
3 replies
thx brother )))))))))))
2023-05-23 20:22
Xin chào my vietnamese friend
2023-05-24 09:56
1 reply
#321
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Vietnam TIGIDOU
<333
2023-05-28 21:39
#305
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Czech Republic Zergon
Faze hadn't won for a long time until they got ropz and after they did they won a major and a grand slam, money well spent I'd say.
2023-05-23 22:45
+1
2023-05-17 17:51
They pay 2.1m for Es3tag and thats way different because es3tag is obviously not as good as Zywoo (and prices increase exponentially, so the 2nd best player in the world could be 8 times more expensive than the 10th best player) + you have to remember es3tag wasnt the missing piece on a roster where you couldnt fit anyone else into the same role (if cloud9 had really insane core of 4 players its not so bad to overpay for a missing piece #5th)
2023-05-18 01:20
6 replies
The 2.1M included his future salary
2023-05-18 01:34
They did not. His buy out was 500k
2023-05-18 11:13
$2.1mil was his contract value. Buyout + salary for the contract duration (3 years IIRC).
2023-05-18 11:16
2 replies
he gets 1.5 mio salary for 3 years ? lmao
2023-05-23 19:16
1 reply
I guess. It could include other things, like a provate healthcare plan or some shit, but most probably yes.
2023-05-23 19:48
Zwyoo is like a Stat Trak AK 47 blue gem 661 pattern, looks amazing..largely overrpriced & its ingame money which you maynot recover
2023-05-22 04:05
#178
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Canada zizzle21
I feel like it is sort of a thing where the price would be 5m with 1.5 years left on contract but no one is actually gonna pay that much they would just wait until contract is over and offer him higher salary esp since he's still young
2023-05-18 01:34
1 reply
Exactly. It means that the overall cost of buying ZywOo now could be around 5 millions, including buyout price, remaining salaries and possible compensation for breaking Vitality's contract. Otherwise I would expect him to be worth 2-3 millions.
2023-05-22 03:53
time will come
2023-05-21 21:43
#281
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Finland Hekee
NA would pay that amount or even more
2023-05-23 15:14
too low
2023-05-17 14:19
1 reply
+1 way too low
2023-05-22 05:47
#4
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El Salvador Haney
800K max
2023-05-17 14:19
28 replies
#6
 | 
France Guilsz_
0/8
2023-05-17 14:20
#13
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Latvia Zodde
m0nesy 600k without being proven, zywoo already has #1's 0/8
2023-05-17 14:21
21 replies
#15
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El Salvador Haney
m0nesy was overpriced.
2023-05-17 14:21
16 replies
#19
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France Guilsz_
it was a gamble and it paid off imo
2023-05-17 14:22
15 replies
#22
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El Salvador Haney
0/8
2023-05-17 14:23
8 replies
#23
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France Guilsz_
Kato and BLAST world finals is good tho he just has to do it in Majors now
2023-05-17 14:24
6 replies
#33
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El Salvador Haney
Got carried in Katowice and Blast finals dont count
2023-05-17 14:29
5 replies
Lol MVP of the tournament got carried, 404 brain not found
2023-05-17 15:30
2 replies
Don’t argue with literal 0/8 baits please
2023-05-18 10:37
#204
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Sweden slyde123
Yea, they're just baiting man.
2023-05-22 04:03
"Ilya "⁠m0NESY⁠" Osipov has been named the HLTV.org x 1xBet Most Valuable Player of the BLAST Premier World Final after leading G2 to the title at the $1 million tournament." Get fucked.
2023-05-18 01:07
#270
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Finland Burana123
OG flair = most obvious bait ever
2023-05-23 10:46
#272
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Germany archoroN
geez, 0/8? at least give it like 3/8 bruh everyone always exaggurating everything smh
2023-05-23 10:56
how exactly did it pay off?
2023-05-17 14:29
5 replies
katowice, blast finals g2 > no achievements in 5 years g2
2023-05-17 14:31
#41
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France Guilsz_
2023-05-17 14:32
3 replies
#93
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El Salvador Haney
2023-05-17 14:53
2 replies
#95
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France Guilsz_
2023-05-17 14:54
1 reply
#97
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El Salvador Haney
2023-05-17 14:54
m0nesy was the most talented young kid in FPL, NaVi JR wdym not proven lol, he was owning tier-2 scene and FPL.. and well, a lot of this money is due to his big name as well. He had like 5k viewers on average at his streams if not more, 600k is literally free. He's already worth millions.
2023-05-22 04:50
3 replies
#232
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Latvia Zodde
how do you call that proven? m0nesy was putting up numbers in tier 2 maybe, but zywoo was out here literally copping #1 player of the year awards in fucking tier 1. compared to zywoo, pre-G2 m0nesy was just a flashy awper that was not 100% clear yet whether he'd be insane in tier 1 or not, therefore he was not proven
2023-05-22 11:55
1 reply
why are you comparing current ZywOo to m0nesy "pre-G2" ? I dont care about ZywOo, it's obvious he's worth a lot now. All I said was that the money that G2 paid wasnt much at all for m0nesy aka the next ZywOo (in terms of how talented and young he is) m0nesy had lan expirence, owned tier-2 scene and any tier-1 pro in FPL. it was pretty much obvious and not a risky move at all to sign him. it was a huge W deal for G2 even in terms of his media, fans.
2023-05-23 00:20
NiKo owns players with awp on FPL, tier 1 awper needs to have more things than just own tier 2 and academy players. Ofc m0nesy exceeded all that, but it was a gamble. You can compare it with Neymar going to Barcelona, he was smurfing on brasileirao but nobody knew what he could do in europe leagues
2023-05-22 15:27
so about 20 times degster only ?
2023-05-17 14:43
3 replies
#90
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El Salvador Haney
800000/20 = 40000. Pretty sure degster is worth more than 40k.
2023-05-17 14:52
2 replies
congrats you got the joke pretty sure he's not though
2023-05-17 14:54
1 reply
#98
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El Salvador Haney
Pretty sure he is.
2023-05-17 14:55
An account made just to copycat, hate and make terrible bait. Hilarious.
2023-05-17 15:25
#5
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Norway Janton
it doesn't matter, he won't leave anyway.
2023-05-17 14:20
28 replies
#8
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France Guilsz_
we never know
2023-05-17 14:20
27 replies
#11
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Norway Janton
he is a beta male, he won't make a risky decision and move out of his comfort zone.
2023-05-17 14:20
26 replies
#17
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Romania aLeeeeex
he just did? he was playing in a FR team and now he is in an international one?
2023-05-17 14:21
14 replies
#20
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Norway Janton
that wasn't his decision lol, he stayed with the same org and they built around him, which is nice.
2023-05-17 14:22
13 replies
#36
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Romania aLeeeeex
his decision or not he left his comfort zone and is now ok with it, and leaving for another org wouldnt be that big of a deal because he's on the road a lot anyway but i dont think he will leave either, vitality can just buy who they want to create the best team in the world around him in a couple of year(s) when the older players retire
2023-05-17 14:30
11 replies
#45
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Norway Janton
vitality is not a rich org, idk why you think they can just buy who they want?
2023-05-17 14:33
10 replies
#48
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France Guilsz_
yes they are TeZos is their biggest sponsor and the org is owned in a big part by an indian billionaire
2023-05-17 14:34
9 replies
#55
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Norway Janton
egw.news/counterstrike/news/20162/vitali.. that's not how it works my friend, just because the owner is rich, does not mean you have unlimited resources, most of it will go to player salary. vitality is cheap.
2023-05-17 14:37
4 replies
#59
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France Guilsz_
of course men, every roster has his budget (salaries, ect,...), BUT, if the owner is willing to invest then there's really not limits
2023-05-17 14:38
3 replies
#63
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Norway Janton
lol I just gave you proof that it isn't, just admit it and move on, this isn't an argument, it's me presenting facts.
2023-05-17 14:39
2 replies
#74
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France Guilsz_
and I do agree with your facts man, I'm just saying that some opportunities on the market that may present themselves can change that. VIT's CEO recently said that the org is going to significantly lower the money they put in
2023-05-17 14:44
whos KRL
2023-05-23 03:02
Vitality are not rich, they are one of the chaper orgs in CS.
2023-05-17 14:38
1 reply
#70
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France Guilsz_
budget wise I doubt it but investment wise yes they are very cheap they only paid 2 buyouts (shox and Spinx) since the original roster
2023-05-17 14:40
who's the indian billionaire?
2023-05-17 17:57
1 reply
#167
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France Guilsz_
Tej Kholi
2023-05-17 18:22
Wdym it wasn't his decision ? He's litteraly the one vitality does everything for, if he didn't want to go inter they would've not
2023-05-17 15:33
#117
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Russia putin2020
The real betas are the ones that calling anyone beta male. Trying to self-affirm themselves cause they're too insecure. Sad :(
2023-05-17 15:40
8 replies
while I do agree, there was a clip of Zywoo and his GF, think on Vita YT channel even, and it's more than obvious who wears pants in that relationship. Not saying it's a bad thing, people can enjoy whatever they like and live their life anyway they like it - just proving his point that Zywoo likes others to make decisions for him.
2023-05-23 13:35
7 replies
#278
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Russia putin2020
Maybe he's only like that on camera? How do you know? You can't judge people while you don't know shit about them
2023-05-23 14:00
6 replies
I'm not judging, I call it like I see it. In no aspects of his life that we saw he grabs the life by its horns.
2023-05-23 15:11
5 replies
#300
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Russia putin2020
Why do you care so much, though? "I call it like I see it" you are judging, yes
2023-05-23 22:32
4 replies
you obviously care more with that gas lighting bs...
2023-05-23 22:36
3 replies
#306
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Russia putin2020
1. I don't care. You were the one who answered week later. 2. Google the definition of "judging" then. Stop being an idiot, you are judging
2023-05-24 09:11
2 replies
I didn't realize topics have an expiry date of an average tiktoker attention span. Weird how you got so offended by someone having a different opinion
2023-05-24 09:40
1 reply
#309
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Russia putin2020
You were the one who brought this topic back, so why are you telling me that i care too much? I'm offended by low IQ degenerates, not by different opinion. It's fine if you think that ZywOo is less assertive than most men, but what is this "beta bullshit"? And add "I think; most likely in my opinion" not fucking "its obvious". Use your brain and stop being arrogant. Stop judging people if its so hard for you to admit that you can be wrong
2023-05-24 09:53
well Zywoos english is not that good. Really doubt he leaves, unless its a full french roster
2023-05-18 11:17
He probably had to get a coaching how to talk to women in Sweden
2023-05-23 11:07
underpriced
2023-05-17 14:20
1 reply
#10
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France Guilsz_
with only 1y left on his contract underpriced?
2023-05-17 14:20
#9
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England ItsDan_HLTV
Massively overpriced. Don't forget that NIP bought Device for 1m which is a record transfer. I think ZywOo would be worth around 1.75m - 2.25m
2023-05-17 14:20
20 replies
#14
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France Guilsz_
fair, but it's a good source tho so I think we're not far from the truth of his price
2023-05-17 14:21
but device is bot who didnt even make it to the major and zywoo is number 1 player they didnt buy 2018 device for 1 mil, it would have been much more
2023-05-17 14:28
8 replies
they bought device in early 2021, device was #3 in the world in 2020, just behind zywoo and s1mple, dont pretend like device was some random shitty player
2023-05-17 15:28
7 replies
so they bought device 2 years after he didnt win a single event and astralis was shit? nice
2023-05-17 17:50
6 replies
3 replies
grand final with grim and stewie2k kkkkkkkkkk nice event
2023-05-18 11:20
2 replies
device single handedly carried NIP to IEM fall 2021 win only behind xi wu in rating for the whole event actually. If he hadn't hit a wall of depression he would've made NIP a top 5 team most likely. 1 milli was expensive but not outlandish given the caliber of player at the time. Rn you can't really base his skill on the utter shit show that is astralis. And even then, he has a pretty insane rating farming t2 teams atm.
2023-05-23 10:21
would love to see u putting in years of work, playing amazing in a tournament and then little suckers like u trashtalk u because they don´t think u are elite in their opinion. The one who delivers wins
2023-05-23 11:11
Pretty weak baits
2023-05-23 19:32
Wasn't Alex at 1.2 million ? Es3tag was at 2 million too i think
2023-05-17 15:36
8 replies
Those werent buyout prices, but full contract worth.
2023-05-17 15:51
6 replies
what's the difference could you please tell me ?
2023-05-17 15:54
3 replies
#137
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Netherlands miles-
It included the salary/bonus of the contract for x amount for years. So 1.2m for 4 years = 25k a month = 1.2million contract worth
2023-05-17 15:58
2 replies
#177
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Czech Republic HunTerOG
what this guy said +1
2023-05-18 01:27
1 reply
2023-05-18 11:17
Is buyout money all for the org or split between the player?
2023-05-22 04:47
1 reply
For the org
2023-05-22 15:23
#168
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Germany Germen
Not really, Es3tag was 500k buyout and then 3 years of full salary would amass to 2.1 million Alex was cheaper buyout than Es3tag though I can't remember the number
2023-05-17 18:25
yeah sounds about right
2023-05-23 10:44
dev1ce was 1M so zywoo without reaching his prime could be 4m or so yeah
2023-05-17 14:21
7 replies
#31
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Bulgaria ramkain
fully agree on this one, taking in consideration the inflation as well.
2023-05-17 14:28
4 replies
What inflation? The Euro is a shit currency but it didn’t triple in 2 years lol
2023-05-17 16:49
3 replies
#152
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Bulgaria ramkain
There is currently a global inflation.
2023-05-17 17:11
eSport industry is growing much faster than the inflation, there is more money poured in every year and it is one of the only activities that got reinforced by the pandemic.
2023-05-22 04:02
Lira moment
2023-05-23 11:12
#147
RpK | 
France HippzZ
+1
2023-05-17 16:29
Prices are not linear like that. Sure zywoo has been posting much better numbers than device, but the return on investment for the org would also come into play. Without any org revenue numbers, nobody can say anything.
2023-05-22 04:04
not enough data. no idea how he works with other teams but seeing as m0nesy was 650k then yeah 5m is probably fair
2023-05-17 14:21
12 replies
#21
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France Guilsz_
let's not forget that everyone who played with zywoo said that he is very easy to work with and that he is willing to go first also now he has a good enough engligh he could go anywhere
2023-05-17 14:23
6 replies
I would think so too, but you can never know unless it happens. Vitality is like a home to him and going to a different country representing somebody else might have an effect on him.
2023-05-17 14:24
1 reply
#27
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France Guilsz_
yeah that will never know unless he actually goes anywhere else
2023-05-17 14:26
my dude has 200k on IG. Aint no way he's worth more than 2 millions. The only one who's worth 5 or more is s1mple, without any buyouts. You guys clearly dont understand thats its a business and ZywOo won't make any org 10 times richer, especially if they pay 5m for him lol. m0nesy just turned 18, already top-7, doing better than ZywOo at his age so far. paying 600k for him is nothing.
2023-05-22 05:05
3 replies
#230
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France Guilsz_
oh you seem to know more about player's market value than ZywOo's agent himself please enlighten me
2023-05-22 08:15
2 replies
he's worth nothing without his huge buyouts from Vita. people will only pay for his skill in-game and results. Just so you undestand, NiKo with his lower price and (lets say the same salary) gives much more profit to G2 than ZywOo to Vitality. Only by his twitch numbers alone he's doing sick promotions and generating lots of money for g2 investors.
2023-05-23 00:26
1 reply
#266
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France Guilsz_
Ofc NiKo S1mple are icons of CSGO and ZywOo is becoming one
2023-05-23 10:07
He's worked with 3 or 4 IGL's (Happy, NBK, alex, apex, not sure if NBK igl'd at all), 3 or 4 coaches, different managers, bunch of different players in different lineups every year. The only constant in his career were the vitality tag and apex in his team. If u think he cant perform without apex or some other french voodoo shit then sure
2023-05-17 15:46
4 replies
#142
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France PowwneD
Also hardcarried a T5 team through MDL and almost qualify for EPL at 16-17 yo, just saying
2023-05-17 16:14
Still all french IGLs and I agree with you, I think he will perform the same in an international team but you can't always be 100% certain.
2023-05-17 17:25
2 replies
alex is british, doesnt matter coz he was calling in french but also apex calls in english now u cant be 100% certain of anything but he's for sure deserving of the highest buyout in csgo rn
2023-05-17 19:59
Vitality is already an international team
2023-05-22 04:04
5m for 1.5 years is too much, cheeper just to wait, zywoo is only 22
2023-05-17 14:22
2 replies
need to wait black friday
2023-05-17 14:28
1 reply
We need to wait till the summer sale to judge
2023-05-28 02:36
5M is the kind of number that you throw when you don't want to or can't sell something. Putting a fair, calculated price on ZywOo right now is impossible.
2023-05-17 14:24
10 replies
#26
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France Guilsz_
well he put a good context around his situation so it's not really a throw in number
2023-05-17 14:25
4 replies
Theres a reason probably (age,achievements,potential) and his price would go up as major winner (if he wins).
2023-05-17 14:31
3 replies
#38
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France Guilsz_
yes let's pray
2023-05-17 14:31
2 replies
Guess what i wasnt wrong about that his price is gonna go kaboom. Also fucking finally Vita won #VForVictory
2023-05-21 21:40
1 reply
#200
 | 
France Guilsz_
LETS FUCKING GO MAN I’m so so happy
2023-05-21 22:10
#43
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Finland inshallah
5m is a pretty fair price for zywoo, top1-2 player his whole career and currently best player in the world while only 22yo with zywoo and s1mple you have to factor in the fact that they bring in TONS of fans
2023-05-17 14:32
4 replies
ZywOo has 200k on his ig. His transfer to another team is something as big as m0nesy transitioning to G2 (who actually has almost 300k) I believe ZywOo would get around the same amount of viewers on twitch as m0nesy, at best. So media-wise ZywOo isnt bigger than someone like m0nesy
2023-05-22 05:09
3 replies
#226
 | 
Finland inshallah
"someone like m0nesy" literally one of the most famous csgo players out there currently
2023-05-22 06:07
1 reply
well, he's still nowhere close ZywOo in terms of skill which was my main point. And he's nowhere close the major title or two times top-1 hltv. so yeah, says a lot about ZywOos influence when a russian kid has a bigger name than him.
2023-05-23 03:37
The thing is that cis players tend to get more followers. If zybro would steam actively he would definitely get more viewers and followers than he currently does. Doesn't change the fact that a lot of ppl watch Vitality's games just because of zywoo and would do the same with other teams.
2023-05-23 03:34
Would Vitality sell him for 5M? If not, his price is not 5M
2023-05-17 14:32
6 replies
#44
 | 
France Guilsz_
Just said that Vitality puts no price on him what is it then in your opinion?
2023-05-17 14:32
no because they cannot buy anybody like him, hence why they said no price on him pretty sure he will be consistent in getting top 3's hltv for the next 4-5 years at least, i think we actually might witness his prime right now if he wins the major(pls APEX dont throw any maps)
2023-05-17 14:35
4 replies
Tbh i think Apex wants more this than zywoo.
2023-05-17 15:15
3 replies
thats what im affraid of as apex is limited mechanically but very keen and passionate, u can see this very often when he 'sprays' and 'prays' he kills 2-3 enemies
2023-05-17 15:22
2 replies
He used to be very good mechanically back in the day but he seems to acknowledge that its gone, also his dpr is lowest in carrer in 2023 kinda tells you how he has changed to try and help his team
2023-05-17 15:26
1 reply
bro i watched him live in Cluj Napoca, he used to be yes but sometimes by 'trying to help the team' his pushes end up in loads of round thrown away, check game vs ence(vertigo), or vs liquid(overpass) or vs mouz(mirage) etc etc etc....
2023-05-17 15:29
thats probably his worth , but i doubt any org would want to put that much for a single player in csgo
2023-05-17 14:36
14 replies
#56
 | 
France Guilsz_
1.3+ rating every game sponsors fans top 2 world constantly every org in the world should want him
2023-05-17 14:37
5 replies
none would buy a player for 5m euros , thats just not profitable at all
2023-05-17 14:39
3 replies
#75
 | 
France Guilsz_
esports is not profitable at all
2023-05-17 14:44
2 replies
yeah so? make my point even more valid
2023-05-17 14:46
1 reply
#82
 | 
France Guilsz_
I'm just saying that esports is a window of marketing for brands it's an investment that will be profitable but not directly for the orgs (I assume)
2023-05-17 14:47
which sponsors? my dude barely has 200k on IG. m0nesy has a bigger name than him on literally any platform. thats all that matters. ZywOo doesnt even stream, its a big factor as well. Now compare it to s1mple who hits 30-40k twitch viewers while having navi-sponsors on his screen. Or m0nesy who also has very high numbers.
2023-05-22 05:16
#62
 | 
Luxembourg 2000
Carlos (G2 CEO) tried to buy him before m0NESY well now he isn't in charge so ^_^
2023-05-17 14:39
7 replies
well he tried to buy s1mple as well in late 2021 , but i guess he got his hands on a better deal price / performence
2023-05-17 14:44
6 replies
#79
 | 
France Guilsz_
at the time Carlos tried to get him ZywOo was like 300k
2023-05-17 14:45
#81
 | 
Luxembourg 2000
The funny thing is Carlos said it wasn't about the price they just didn't want to sell ZywOo
2023-05-17 14:46
4 replies
vitality is rich , they dont need to sell potential best player ever to another org , they arent just some academy that develop prodigies then sell them
2023-05-17 14:47
3 replies
#86
 | 
Luxembourg 2000
I'm expecting ZywOo to extend contract i doubt he'd leave Vitality
2023-05-17 14:49
2 replies
he wont obv , zywoo is a guy that look just for comfort & fun , he didnt left the team even in their worst periods
2023-05-17 14:52
1 reply
He definitely doesnt look for comfort. Like you said he was in the worst period of Vitality and the transition from native to international. But he made it work, his entertainment by game and sheer motivation has made him hardly disputed one of the greatest CSGO player
2023-05-23 01:29
it's actually 244k check HLTV Fantasy
2023-05-17 14:38
2 replies
#61
 | 
France Guilsz_
ty for fact check
2023-05-17 14:39
1 reply
np investigative journalism is my passion
2023-05-17 14:39
#67
 | 
Netherlands dabadpad
best i can do is 500K
2023-05-17 14:39
2 replies
#148
 | 
Netherlands dabadpad
and im taking huge risk here
2023-05-17 16:37
what u gonna do with him? send him to Bakhmut?
2023-05-22 05:18
#77
 | 
Germany who|cars
the best I can do is 11m skull_emoji
2023-05-17 14:45
#78
 | 
Australia imissdevvy
1 dragon lore
2023-05-17 14:45
#84
 | 
Dominica FallczE
900k$ min 2.5m$ max There's no way it would be profitable even for 2.5, now imagine 5 lol
2023-05-17 14:48
4 replies
#85
 | 
France Guilsz_
nothing is profitable in esports also 900k is less than dev0rce lul
2023-05-17 14:48
900k for Zywoo lmao
2023-05-17 14:50
2 replies
#116
 | 
Dominica FallczE
devve was 1mil after some time he wasn't in best form & he has hard carried 2 out of 4 won majors. Zywoo wasn't capable to win 1. He wasn't even in the finals yet. Don't care what you think achievements are need as a single player too, shows how you deal with x amount of pressure on your soldiers etc.
2023-05-17 15:38
1 reply
zywoo commands a lot of soldiers
2023-05-22 04:39
#87
rod | 
Andorra rasclet
zywoo 30 donuts
2023-05-17 14:50
1 reply
#88
 | 
France Guilsz_
that would probably make him happy enough to join a team
2023-05-17 14:50
He will be 23 in november, too old for that kind of money
2023-05-17 14:52
1 reply
23 = peak age cs player
2023-05-17 15:21
#94
 | 
Mongolia zywh032
a burger and a glass of milk
2023-05-17 14:53
#99
 | 
Japan papa_smurf
didn't coldzera go for 1M?
2023-05-17 14:55
#100
 | 
South Africa Criticle
C9 Colossus would've shelled out about $25m for him looking at what they paid for everyone else, but sadly that ship has sailed.
2023-05-17 14:57
by FAR the best player in the world currently and mechanically no player has ever been close to where he is now. absolute beast and is worth whatever vitality wants for him.
2023-05-17 15:20
4 replies
If they had Zywoo signed for 3-4 year then yeah, but with just 1,5 years left I honestly don't think so. Its better to sell now for example 1M then being highballer and letting his contract expire and let Zywoo leave for free
2023-05-17 15:33
2 replies
why sell him when there is no one better and he plays like having two device on the team for the price of one?
2023-05-18 14:22
1 reply
I am saying if Zywoo showed interest of leaving anyway, then its better to sell now for 1M than hold him against his will for 1,5 year just to get nothing, ofc if Zywoo is happy and want to stay, there is zero reason to sell him. It would be actually dumb to try to sell it.
2023-05-18 14:28
I mean, he's currently the best but refresh your mind and open s1mple 2018 and 2021 stats and highlights (basically the peak perfomances in CS:GO history) s1mple was hitting shots that no one will ever be able to hit. ZywOo just barely misses and reads the game well. btw the price is not only about your skill but how popular you are and what you can bring to the org. someone like m0nesy or NiKo are much more profitable for any investor. Their streams easily hit 5-10k viewers as well as their social medias are huge.
2023-05-22 05:31
zywoo is priceless
2023-05-17 15:27
5M if he had 3-4 years of contract left then yeah I would agree, but with just 1,5year before his contract expires and potentially leaving Vitality for free??? I think he is 1M at max atm, no one would pay more atm since if the team would be really interested in Zywoo, they could just start talks with Zywoo directly and make a deal they wait for him till December 2024 and give him extra money as signing bonus rather then paying Vitality
2023-05-17 15:30
2 replies
1,5 years is a long time in cs
2023-05-17 15:55
1 reply
Zywoo is just 22 so plenty of time plus half a year will be wasted with transition to CS2
2023-05-17 16:10
5M is overpriced, but he does have a proven track record while still being young. His best years are ahead of him. It makes sense that the price is very high, but 5M is really too much. I'd say 3M maximum, that's the price for an entire tier 2 team, ZywOo isn't worth more than an entire tier 2 team by himself.
2023-05-17 15:48
24 replies
"ZywOo isn't worth more than an entire tier 2 team by himself." are you completely crazy ?
2023-05-17 16:24
23 replies
The "tier 2 team" I was talking about was the current Cloud9. Sure, they were discounted, but still, ZywOo may be better than Sh1ro, but if Sh1ro's team is included, then getting ZywOo for the same price is dumb. If you spend 5M on one player, you'll have a more limited budget for the other players, which means you get a situation like Na'Vi with Zeus, Flamie, and Edward dragging down S1mple. If your budget for a team is 7M, it's bad, if your budget is 20M, okay, but not many orgs have access to that amount of money. Compare this to S1mple, who was worth 3M at his supposed peak, and S1mple is obviously better than ZywOo, the only advantage you have with ZywOo is that we assume his best time is still ahead of him, but that's an assumption.
2023-05-18 10:37
22 replies
"And s1mple is obviously better than ZywOo" You have clearly no idea what you re talking about. At this time ZywOo is better and more worth than s1mple has ever been, he is more complete, more skilled with every weapon (not only Awp), less toxic, talk as good english and brings a way better mood to a team.
2023-05-18 12:39
21 replies
s1mple is clearly the best player of CS:GO, much more trophies, 3 times top-1hltv, more mvps, highest peak perfomances in CS:GO, IG slam. and since you are clueless, I will explain how business works. s1mple has 1.6m on his instagram alone, he has the GOAT status, he streams for 20-30k on average. ZywOo has 200k, doesn stream, isnt active in any way. He's currently the best player but thats not what investors are looking for. They dont give a damn if 500k are watching your games because you have the best players or because your players are funny. s1mple will make any org 500 times much more relevant than ZywOo, his name is many times bigger than ZywOos and it's not even a question. But yeah, go ahead and tell us why ZywOo is worth more, you clearly know how business works ;)
2023-05-22 05:41
20 replies
Damn dude, you killed the poor guy.
2023-05-22 06:22
ZywOo at 22 : -1 major, 1 major mvp -3x top1 and 2x top2 since he was 18 -15 mvps and way more till end of the year -2023 for now highest peak ever seen > 2018 S1mple S1mple at 22 : -0 major, 0 major mvp -1x top1 and 1x top2 -10 mvps
2023-05-22 14:34
18 replies
#238
 | 
Nepal askyee
But you clearly missed his point which is right. S1mple brings much more to any org than zywoo. The bigger socials you have the more money and fame you bring to the team which is exactly what org are looking for. As he said, s1mple has 1.6m followers on IG only and huge numbers on twitch. Zywoo not only doesnt stream he doesnt even use his own twitter or yt channel. He has or had someone to post everything for him. Yes achievement wise zywoo at the same age is better than s1mple but once again, literally not a single org would spend that much money for a single player, no matter how good he is simply because cs isnt profitable. Zywoo alone won't make them profitable when 1) they might become bankrupt after spending that much 2) he wont bring as many sponsors and fans to buy merch as other guy with 3 times bigger socials.
2023-05-23 00:51
10 replies
Well, in reality, ZywOo has only won Paris major, ESL Pro and little IEM Rio lans at 22 after 5 years of playing and most of his so called "mvps" were either online or from low tier events like cs_summit (2 times lol), small online 150k IEMs etc :) while s1mple at 22 was already x2 Starladder champ, ESL NYC champ, ESL Cologne champ, 2 times major finalist and semifinalist if you bring the context, you can clearly see that s1mple has achieved more than him at 22, having some of the most prestigious trophies and playing in the major finals twice (both times his team was much weaker). While ZywOo? won his major against GamerLegion with dupreeh and Magisk in team? xd. If NaVi faced anyone besides the golden-5 from Astralis at FACEIT London Major they would have won 16-0 on all maps xd.
2023-05-23 01:33
9 replies
least delusional navi fan LMAO. the level of competition is much much higher rn than it was back then and every pro agree on that.
2023-05-23 01:50
8 replies
hltv.org/events/3564/faceit-major-2018 Yeah, I believe this major final with Edward and Zeus in team against unstoppable and the greatest team of all time was also a pretty weak competition for you. Compared to this legendary Paris Major with such strong teams XDD that ZywOo won against GamerLegion with two 4times major winners. s1mple had more majors finals, more elite tier trophies, more LAN mvps at 22 and when ZywOo was playing faceit at his 18, s1mple was carrying Liquid in NA and playing major final in front of a crowd. Every pro agrees that you cant compare fnatic-nip times (when the game was just released) because there were very few contenders back then. s1mple was playing the game at its peak XD ZywOo started playing and winning when Astralis era was literally over and you are telling me that ZywOo has faced the highest and strongest competition out of all, haha, stop it.
2023-05-23 02:07
7 replies
Electronic higher rating than s1mple 1.36, flamie top player 1.18 rating, Edward 1.05 rating. S1mple Botom fragging with 10 kills each maps on the final and has go play vs washed stewi2k and tarik to win easy semis and tier2 BigClan where s1mple got carried by Edward 😂😂. In what world is this a hard toornament LMAO, what vitality had to faced to win Paris major is way harder and every team is mich much much better than all those washed up 2018 mibr and big clan that would not even win vs actual tier3 teams.
2023-05-23 15:01
6 replies
okay man, you are right. Facing Astralis 2018 with Edward and Zeus in team is much easier than playing with 4 times major winners against GamerLegion. Btw NaVi also won fnatic, NiP and golden-5 FaZe as well., both BIG and MIBR were actually very decent, top-7 and top-9 at that time, whats your point? are you having dementia or something? Vitality played the major final against the team that was out of top-30 hltv. Tell me more fairy tales please. Vitality has only faced one good opponent and two from top-10 : G2 and ENCE (lol) Please stop emberassing yourself.
2023-05-23 18:15
5 replies
Gl and Apeks are both 7 and 9 hltv and are at the moment of the major better than the top2/3/4 heroic faze navi etc .. :)
2023-05-23 18:35
4 replies
After their fluke runs? Okay. But we were talking about their actual hltv placements at the time major started. I will repeat myself, Vitality has only faced two teams that were barely top10 hltv and won the major against top-31 hltv team with Magisk (danish electronic with 3 majors at that time) dupreeh with 4 majors, ZywOo, Spinx (FPL talent and 3d highest rated at the major) and the captain APEX NaVi won top-5 faze, top-7 MIBR. top-8 NIP, top-9 big and top-11 fnatic and played the final against top-1 and the strongest lineup of CS:GO with two 30+ year old veterans, flamie who was average (sometimes good, sometimes 0.5kd) and electronic, the only person who carried with s1mple in 2018. Yes, please tell me that this major run was much easier than the one that Vita had XDXXD ZywOo would win that London major for sure, especially with no dupreeh, magisk and Spinx in team XD
2023-05-23 18:46
3 replies
You are fking stupid xD, s1mple average team's rating is much higher than zywoo one and he didnt win this major while zywoo did :) and the hltv placment doesnt mean shit when those teams destroys every good teams in BO3, G2 destroyed, Navi destroyed, Heroic destroyed, they deserve their top10 placement and were even better than the top2/3/4 as i said. Zywoo didnt play vs washed up stewie / tarik and tier3 big clan, on the contrary of s1mple he didnt have a 1.36 rating player with him but he faced a guy that had 1.35 rating with ak IM :)
2023-05-23 20:31
2 replies
washed up stewie tarik? you mean major winners that were playing in the 7th best team at that time? and BIG that were actually top-9 and had a decent tier-1 team? but playing against nonamers from into the breach, Apeks and GamerLegion is great high competition for you? XD You are easily the most delusional ZywOo fan I've ever seen :D Yes, it does matter since all 3 lineups are random EU mixes with no trophies who were barely top 20-30 hltv. They will lose their major points and keep playing at tier-2 scene and being placed at the same top 20-30 as it always happens with fluke runs. What are you even trying to prove here? Should I repeat again that Vitality played semis and finals against random EU mixes that were barely top-30 hltv? Or that he is playing with Astralis major winners and Spinx who is top-3 at the major ? Astralis 2018 w/Edward and Zeus GamerLegion (top-31 hltv) w/Magisk, dupreeh and Spinx hm..... hard choice... Apeks, Into the breach, Monte (top 20-30 hltv) or NiP, fnatic, FaZe, BiG, MIBR (top 5-11) hmm.... yeah man, fckin s1mple, farmed his stats against washed up tarik and stewie... GOAT ZywOo won his major while competing with Apeks, ITB, Monte, well known multiple major winners, all ranked top-5 hltv. Thomas, volt, kyxsan, jL, isak all are well known not "washed up" legends
2023-05-23 21:01
1 reply
you are just delusional and dont know how CS works, first of all tier2 teams back then were way worst back in the days than rn, the level as strasticly upgraded recently and every team until top30 can beat anyone, every pro will tell you that + the fact that these teams cant play some events T1 like blast is all due to money because they cant buy a spot and not because they dont have the level, a lot of "T1" teams are still here because of money and fame even tho they are complete garbage and barely Tier 3 level like Astralis, OG etc.... then just look at how easy it was for navi to beat those washed up team like BIG that have only been a good team once in a milion time during online era and had always been tier2 before that, navi won them 16-3 try to guess why and same with a complete unorganized mix of brazilian and Washed up valorant player like stewie and tarik where even Edward carried S1mple lmao. TEAMS like Gl and Apeks have like 10 times the team play of those teams and if they were to play each other rn a team like GL would demolish 2-0 16-5 16-5 a team like this mibr mix and Online Clan. Teams like Apeks GL etc won multiple BO3 on playoffs of major vs the "supposed toptier teams" like heroic and navi for a reason, they are simply better and the fact that they have to play T2 toornament have nothing to do with their level as i said since they have 10 times the lvl of teams like OG etc... you re focusing on a past hltv ranking based on nothing but bought spot on famous toornament farming free points while these teams prooved that they are better than 80% of the actual "T1" teams and deserve their actual ranking where they are all in TOP10 which matters more than what they were rank before the major since it represent their level during the major and even lower than that since they have beaten all the top5 teams like G2 NAVI and HEROIC on BO3 :)
2023-05-24 11:24
s1mple at 18 : major finalist, semifinalist, IEM NYC winner ZywOo at 18 : faceit lvl 10 cry harder. zywoo doesnt have three top-1 you delusional fanboy. he barely has any elite-tier mvps as most of them are from cs_summit online events during covid. zywoo has only won 2 solid trophies at 22 while s1mple was two times major finalist, two times semi finalist, two Starladder trophies, ESL Cologne trophy, ESL NYC trophy :)) and real LAN mvps at most of these events :) 2023 highest peak ever seen AHHAAH, you know that not even half a year has passed yet, right? :D hltv.org/news/33151/top-20-players-of-20.. now look at the trophies, mvps (from lan, not online shit crap that ZywOo have), impact rating, overall rating and the perfomance :) youtube.com/watch?v=le8WIV04e8I You are basically lying in every sentence, making up stuff and i'm not even surprised. s1mple is the undiusputed GOAT who has been playing at the highest lvl since 2016 and won everything. ZywOo started in 2019, won 2 elite tier events and gained most of his mvps from online covid era A-tier events cope harder, mate.
2023-05-23 00:56
3 replies
> zywoo has only won 2 solid trophies at 22 while s1mple was two times major finalist, two times semi finalist, two Starladder trophies, ESL Cologne trophy, ESL NYC trophy :)) and real LAN mvps at most of these events :) Your argument makes no sense, you are bringing up s1mple's tournament placings while comparing with ZywOo's tournament wins. At 22, both their tournament wins are similar In terms of LANs s1mple - ESL NY 2016, Starseries S5 2018, Cologne 2018, Blast Copenhagen 2018, Starseries S7 2019, Katowice 2020 ZywOo - ECS S7 2019, Epicenter 2019, IEM Winter 2021, EPL S16 2022, IEM Rio 2023, Blast Major 2023 It is you who is coping harder than the most tbh
2023-05-28 01:54
> zywoo doesnt have three top-1 you delusional fanboy. he barely has any elite-tier mvps as most of them are from cs_summit online events during covid. Do you remember that 2 of NaVi's tournament wins in Intel Grand Slam have come online? DreamHack Masters Spring 2021 & ESL Pro League Season 14 The other two events Katowice 2020 & Cologne 2021 weren't played with crowd either. Now tell me who benefitted most from the online era?
2023-05-28 02:09
I do not agree with the OP comparing their achievements at 22 either but you can't say ZywOo has barely done anything at elite events. It's a shame that CS:GO is ending this year, now we never know whether ZywOo would have achieved more than s1mple or this was a one off win like EPL last year. CS2 resets this narrative
2023-05-28 02:16
ZywOo in 2023 (5 months) so far : hltv.org/stats/players/11893/zywoo?start.. s1mple in 2021 (12 months) : hltv.org/stats/players/7998/s1mple?start.. If thats what you call "the highest peak" I have bad news because s1mple had extremely much higher stats in the whole 2021 after 12 months than ZywOo currently has in 2023 :) See the difference? I can actually link and bring the context while you are making upp stuff and writting nonsense, basically simping for ZywOo :)
2023-05-23 01:05
2 replies
That 12 months stuff is pure bad faith. If you check number of maps you will see they are similar. That's what matters. 1.45 rating is absolutely insane. What impressed me the most about s1mple is that he actually played better in big events and important matches, truly an incredible year.
2023-05-23 04:10
1 reply
I mean, yeah. That was the sickest peak any player has ever showed so far. And looking at the trophies that he won, damn, cant think of anything better than winning the major, IGL. sick amount of trophies, having the best season of your career and all that during the same year.
2023-05-23 04:32
Well basically he's hands down the best player atm so they can ask a lot. Its a different thing if anyone will be buying.
2023-05-17 15:54
4kk$ 4 sure
2023-05-17 15:54
well, confidently priced. definitely overpriced in the sense that I don't think there is any cs org that has that kind of player budget, so no one's gonna buy him for 5 M. but eh, maybe he's worth it, he's pretty much the best out there. devve costed 1 M when he was having a breakdown after his best years, so comparing to that 5 M isn't very bad for a 22 year old in his prime
2023-05-17 16:16
no way any team pays that right now, i would give 2M for him, but i think 2.5-3M might still be reasonable. >3M is just delusional
2023-05-17 17:35
dead game he is worth 300k at best
2023-05-17 17:49
no one would buy him fort 5 M he never won a major :D almost all teams dont even money for that it would ruin them also totally overpriced even dev1ce was 1 mil and he won majors as they said above no one will pay 5m for cs go player not worth better buy 600k players like monesy zywhoo will loose again anyway
2023-05-17 17:54
2 replies
Didn't age well
2023-05-22 08:16
username checks out
2023-05-23 00:59
zywoo to EG confirmed
2023-05-17 17:55
best i can do is 500 dollars and it is huge business risk for us youtube.com/watch?v=OjOrkwfbc0g
2023-05-17 18:00
They can say what price they want in public to hype him. Real price is nowhere near 5 million.
2023-05-17 18:13
#169
 | 
Germany Germen
1.5 million is the absolute maximum if you want someone to actually pay that amount
2023-05-17 18:27
if coldzera and device were 1 million and m0nesy was 600 000, zywoo has to be at least 2 million
2023-05-18 01:11
#174
 | 
Denmark slacking
probably below 2M since csgo is about to end and cs2 is still a question mark plus not sure how his contract stands atm
2023-05-18 01:17
vitality will never let go of zywoo
2023-05-18 01:18
anyway player prices would be much lower right now than 2 years ago when there was free money and esports wasnt dying
2023-05-18 10:46
Hard to say. Device was for 1mil with only 6 months left in his contract with astralis. So theoretically zywoo should be definitely for 3mils at very least since he has contract for another year and half and is way better+in his prime Anyway noone would buy player for 3-4mils since csgo isn't profitable. Maybe only some Chinese billionaire who doesn't care at all and would want to give csgo team to his son as a birthday gift (happened in Dota actually :D)
2023-05-18 11:20
3 replies
+1 cs needs to extract money from viewers in a better way to justify these expenses
2023-05-18 12:48
can u tell a bit more about this dota team? who was it?
2023-05-22 05:46
1 reply
joindota.com/news/14807-billionaire-fath.. I'm on phone so I'm lazy to Google more but this is what I found and as far as u remember it.rly happened
2023-05-22 08:11
The fact that guy said $5Mill is why orgs are going broke in CS. They do not make enough to pay a player $5Mill even for someone like Zywoo
2023-05-18 11:22
3 replies
Not rly. This begun waaaaaaaaaaaay earlier... For example nip and astralis fighting about who is the most paid team, giving them almost whole prize money and stickers money. Then 500k buy outs for washed up players Then c9 colossus Then device for 1m(6 months left on his contract) Completely unproven player for 600k It began way earlier and obviously he will say that now right? What do you expect him to say? Sure we will sell him for 1m?
2023-05-18 12:00
2 replies
At least m0nesy is worth 1.2 million now i would say.
2023-05-23 03:50
1 reply
I'm not saying he isn't but at that time he was overpriced
2023-05-23 07:34
Not to take anything from zywoos skill but i think it would be dumb to pay 5mil only to lose money, cs isnt a good business model until you get viewers to pay. Its all about having a team for exposure and getting it as cheap as possible since youll probably lose money anyway, paying 5mil and probably 50k+ every month to a player seems stupid
2023-05-18 12:46
Now what?
2023-05-22 03:31
#209
 | 
Asia jd4ddy
With 5 million you could probably put that into trying to find the next zywoo and make more off of that instead of buying him
2023-05-22 04:16
1 reply
Ok, the problem is: to find a new ZywOo. I don't think there will be someone as talented as him in the next 5 or 10 years.
2023-05-23 02:56
5M is good, just think like most teams you'd put him on would instantly be contenders
2023-05-22 04:17
6 replies
#243
 | 
Ukraine rexyyCSGO
I think if you put zywoo even in team like sprout they will insat get top10 (even with bot xellow)
2023-05-23 01:09
5 replies
Not these days im afraid, semi-semi-semi decent igl's would just neutralize the superstar in the one-man team and its a wrap. zywOo in sprout would be super easy to neutralize, i doubt he'd carry them to top10, but perhaps top30 is possible
2023-05-23 02:33
4 replies
#253
 | 
Ukraine rexyyCSGO
shame we won't know for sure :D
2023-05-23 02:35
2 replies
i'd love to find out if zywOo could carry Falcons to top10, i wish he could, i wish i could see it :'(
2023-05-23 02:36
1 reply
#256
 | 
Ukraine rexyyCSGO
wtf I would love to see it too :D
2023-05-23 02:51
Dont you remember 2021 vitality with Kyojin lmao ? Literally was a top50 team without zywoo
2023-05-23 18:39
with 5 mil you can stack the roster with 5 top 20 players lol
2023-05-22 04:42
1 reply
And beat vita using them :)
2023-05-22 06:24
overprice as market but fairprice as cs player
2023-05-22 05:30
#242
 | 
Ukraine rexyyCSGO
bro he is one of the best, 50 mil atleast
2023-05-23 01:08
Why would anyone pay that much of a buyout for cs Just wait for his contract to expire and convince him to join
2023-05-23 01:10
5M is bullshit haha, if dev1ce was 1M and NiKo to G2 only 500k, Zywoo should be 1.5-2M max
2023-05-23 01:16
3 replies
Considering his form and the fact he won major i would 4mil is max
2023-05-23 01:37
Niko was only 500k ?
2023-05-23 03:48
1 reply
yes reportedly he was 500k, but probably price was lower cuz he wanted out of faze and maybe his contract was ending too
2023-05-27 21:29
In the current market with awfully inflated prices, yes, 5 millions is a fair price for him. But this level of market irrationality will bring about the greatest downfall to professional gaming in general, at the very least CS and Valorant are seriously going down together, they will die a violent death worse than Overwatch. It's not ZywOo's fault at all though, and the buyout wont be activated because if ZywOo stayed in Vitality during all these years of failure, i doubt he's gonna leave now right after winning a major, but i do wish they were a fully french roster again.
2023-05-23 02:28
1 reply
thank you dybala, keep it up on the pitch!
2023-05-23 10:37
Mbapee of cs
2023-05-23 02:39
#277
 | 
Turkey xarrageN
I can't watch csgo matches anymore because of time problems, but i just watched a zywoo's best moments in major video to see if he's still as good; he probably is but i realised sth. Old zywoo best moments videos has only ace's and unreasonable peeks and stuff, but the last video i watched didnt have any crazy moves, his team was always there to trade or have his back. But in the old roster he was just running into banana and all entry ace'ing with awp. That was not making any sens. Coming to my point, you cant win the major without good team with good tactics, even five goat players couldnt stand in tier1 without teamplay. So zywoo is unarguably a good player, but real champion is zonic in vitality. He made dev1ce the best, and now its zywoo's time. Those clips really woke the Astralis era memories up in me
2023-05-23 13:47
2 replies
Thats just because the lvl of csgo teams are much much higher rn than it was before and its not possible anymore to do crazy crazy plays, even with that ZywOo still won an amazing 1v4 vs G2 on legend stage of the major with the silent jump on nuke
2023-05-23 18:38
nah zonic got carried ... at least a bit hltv.org/forums/threads/2779463/vitality..
2023-05-23 19:10
in 2021, maybe someone could have pulled out out 4M for zywoo when there was free money in esports but now there's no money, no one can afford that other than maybe some new saudi-backed org
2023-05-23 19:43
Zywoo is my favorite player ever he is very good!
2023-05-23 19:53
1 reply
yes. he is the goat
2023-05-23 22:33
no one gonna pay that kind of money, even oil kings
2023-05-23 20:53
zywoo is the most valuable player in all CS, he's just as good as S1mple but younger. If Device who's not even a top 20 player in 2023 is worth 600k-1m Zywoo at 5M is not unreasonable. Of course, no org would pay that and that's exactly the point. He'll go where HE wants to go, no org can determine his future.
2023-05-23 22:37
2 replies
At the really top-level marketing value decides also about salary and price. And when you consider S1mple face is all over the internet(GG.bet ads) and known even in China, it has more value than a Zywoo even if Zywoo is in better shape right now
2023-05-27 23:20
1 reply
that's true, but if Vitality wants to affirm Zywoo as the #1 in the world right now, they're obviously going to boast his price
2023-05-28 01:00
So Zywoo costs as much as 10 major 1st places ? Not even close, thats an estimate managers give but noone would pay this for a single guy. If he was Jordan of CS maybe since he would attract insane sponsor deals just because of his name, which is not the case. Maybe down the road but for now nah.
2023-05-23 22:43
He will stay on vitality
2023-05-24 09:48
how much did c9 paid for their prev team? 5mil too? zywoo 1v5 wouldve done better so price is fair
2023-05-24 09:57
Far Overpriced when you consider his marketing value is very low compared to S1mple and Niko.
2023-05-27 23:18
2 replies
Considering his age compared to these washed up irrelevants he has lots of potential
2023-05-28 21:41
1 reply
3 or 4 years difference wow. That would matter when the others are 28. Niko and S1mple had with 21/22 already maximize their marketing value
2023-05-29 02:18
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