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After the major win of zywOo, his fans have been trying very hard to justify him as GOAT of CSGO using illogical and irrelevant metrics.
Some delusional takes and metrics from zywoo fangirls who started watching CS during pandemic......
1. Zywoo is GOAT because he won more MVPs and Top 1s at age 22 and in his initial 5 years of CS than others and has more average MVPs per year
Is it relevant to GOAT status somehow?? not as much. Players peak at different ages and time of their careers, like we saw Niko who peaked for a short time period in 2021 and its known as best rifle peak in history of CSGO. He has been in the scene for years but peaked in 2021, does this make his peak irrelevant, no. Instead it helped him to cement himself as the GOAT rifler.
Coldzera who peaked in first 2 years of his careers but fell off after it, does it make him GOAT because he won it all in those 2 years. 2 top 1s, 2 majors along with the MVPs?? No, because there are much better players with much more longevity
Same goes for all players in the scene including ZywOo, he apparently doesn't get some special criteria because he is "the chosen one". So, the fact that he has won more in his initial years doesn't make him better than those who have more MVPs and top 1s and majors than him.
Rendering the "At what age and average per year" metric irrelevant for GOAT status
2. ZywOo is GOAT because he has top 1s without any other teammate in top 20 and has so bad team everytime......
This is honestly so funny, so you're less of a GOAT because you have a good teammate??? ahahahaha. Those who bring this argument, I just have one question. Is anyone forcing zywOo to play in vitality from 5 years??
Is there someone in Vitality management who points a gun at flowerlike ZywOo and forces him to sign the contracts? I think no, so if zywoo thought he had a weak team, he could've changed the teams and gone to other team. Making some point about weak teammates is not relevant in GOAT status.
3. Zywoo is GOAT because he is good with all weapons (especially pistols)
A good CS player is good with every weapons and especially awpers. s1mple, ZywOo, device, dupreeh, NiKo and rain (except awp), coldzera (in his prime), Fallen and many more are the examples of players who are good with all highly used CSGO weapons. This doesn't make ZywOo any special or one of a kind.
The one thing that gives him a little bit of an edge is that he is exceptional on pistol rounds but so was dennis, so is rain, so was flamie. That doesn't make them GOAT but it gives ZywOo a little bit of an edge being the best pistol player OAT.
And many more irrelevant metrics could be seen on countless HLTV threads after vitality won the major. So that somehow zywOo could get an edge over s1mple on GOAT debate. But the truth is, if ZywOo fans have to knitpick such stats and arguments to somehow get him above s1mple, is ZywOo even the GOAT for you?? I aren't think that mens
Conclusion - s1mple is still the real GOAT of CSGO, ZywOo is a prodigy who unforunately was born later and can easily become CS2 GOAT if he still maintains current performance.
TLDR - Irrelevant metrics like smaller age, average MVPs per year, best pistol player, bad teammates don't matter in the consideration of GOAT player. Hence, s1mple is still the GOAT even after zywOo's major win. But zywoo could surely become CS2 goat if he continues such monster performance
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+1
Contradicted yourself my man
"He's an all time great"
"Not even top 5 all time"
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Hell nah he is easily top5 in CSGO,only s1mple along with him could be on a top1-2 level for 4+ years,no other players have ever done that.Yes,he didnt win much and sometimes drops off in big matches but his individual achievments are unreal,especially when you consider the teams he had
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Not reading allat + zywoo goat
Finally Smart Man
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my man really looked at Zywoo 2023 and S1mple 2018, saw 2.0 rating be 0.01 higher and instantly called Zywoo´s peak higher, lmao
everything checks out
man.... You are really delusional. Cant even check the facts.
Big events stats.
s1mple 2018 - hltv.org/stats/players/7998/s1mple?start..
1.34
s1mple 2021 - hltv.org/stats/players/7998/s1mple?start..
1.45
zywoo 2023 - hltv.org/stats/players/11893/zywoo?start..
1.36
All stats are from big events.
Zywoo 2023>s1mple 2018 but s1mple 2021>zywoo 2023 and every other player in cs:go
Does not matter that at 22 years of age zywoo had more achievments. GOAT - Greatest of ALL TIME. s1mple is in the cs:go scene from 2014. thats almost 10 years. And from 2016 he is in tier 1 cs. 7 years in a row he was a beast in the server and everyone were scared of him.
Delusional zywoo fan, delete your hltv account.
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S1mple only played 49 maps at big events in all of 2021 though, most of the events were still online so u cant really count that 1.45. in 2018 he had 155 maps lol.
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And how mamy maps Zywoo Has so far on Big events in 2023 ?
And now realise that some delusional guy above called Zywoo 2023 highest peak ever
s1mple at 18 : major finalist and semifinalist, ESL NYC winner and MVP
m0nesy at 18 : IEM KATO winner, BLAST World Final winner and MVP, top-7 hltv
ZywOo at 18 : faceit lvl 10, playing FPL
and btw, ZywOo failed at all majors and didnt win anything significant until Astralis+Spinx joined the team and won evrything in 7 months.
ZywOo at 22 10 days ago : 0 major finals, 0 semi finals
s1mple at 22 : 2 times major finalist, 3 times semi finalist
Thank x3, x4 major winners and Spinx who is currently the highest ranked rifler for winning every trophy for ZywOo. s1mple could only dream about playing with such players and winning this shitty major against top-31 hltv XDXD
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Yh cuz he is way too busy getting eliminated by those top 31 HLTV teams LMFAO.
0/8
"Thank x3, x4 major winners and Spinx who is currently the highest ranked rifler for winning every trophy for ZywOo. s1mple could only dream about playing with such players "
+1 i agree, electroNic is sh*t like b1t and Perfecto, s1mple was afk in his mind, only npl was good enough.
"winning this shitty major against top-31 hltv XDXD"
Agree on that too, it's ZywOo's cursed that heroic lost to tier9999999999 like FaZe, NaVi, NiP, Furia, ENCE and Liquid XDXD
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s1mple never had a trillion dollars lineup to win every trophy for him
He was basically carrying Edward, Zeus and 1kd flamie with god electronic and won Starladder, ESL Cologne, BLAST, IEM KATOWICE before b1t even joined NaVi
ZywOo basically didnt win anything significant until FPL star and two Astralis legends joined the team and won evything for him within 7 months, indluding this major.
s1mple could have easily won his first major in 2018 with Zeus, Edward and flamie in team but he faced prime Astralis. Who exactly did ZywOo face? GamerLegions with Astralis duo and Spinx in his team? cmon.
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thats just facts.
s1mple was playing with Edward, flamie and Zeus at his 22 during Astralis peak prime era
ZywOo is playing during no era with FPL talent and two Astralis members at his 22, big difference.
s1mple was already a two times finalist and semifinalist at his 22, ZywOo reached his first ever semis and finals, only because he had this crazy llineup.
So basically ZywOo fluke and luck, s1mple struggle and hard work to win that first major
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"So basically ZywOo fluke and luck, s1mple struggle and hard work to win that first major"
Good joke PGL Stockholm 2021 was the same, there were only NaVi playing, it was borring btw.
At paris there were so many upset it was exciting (but not for you, cause you don't have "T1" teams who got rekt by "top 31 HLTV" so it's a fluke major) i understood you.
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My response to the guy who thinks that ZywOo could have won any of his trophies without Astralis duo and currently the highest ranked rifler from FPL.
meanwhile s1mple was playing against the all-5 Astralis prime lineup in 2018 w/ Edward, flamie and Zeus in team. He could have carried against any team, beat anyone and win the major w/ electronic alone in 2018. ZywOo basically played with 3 insanely great and multiple times major winners against 0 expierence tier-2 FPL players.
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im trying to say that ZywOo had a star lineup that was playing in a completely different time while s1mple was playing against prime Astralis at his 22. big difference, playing with Spinx and Astralis duo at your 22 and having Edward, flamie and Zeus during Astralis era when you were also 22
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No, my fav player is Niko but I don't call him GOAT over s1mple because I am not delusional
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SHould have said some people, and Zywoo being the player he is, people love to use the "what if Zywoo play for as long as S1mple while being as good as he has being for his past pro years" argument.
GOAT debat exist because people love to talk about competitive csgo, even when no tournaments are being held they want to keep talking about it
There is no point at denying the legacy and level of S1mple, same could be said at Zywoo's achievements at 22 yo. Both aren't mesured with the same meter, let's keep arguying for the sake of arguying and just stop insulting each other
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Messi as he won the world cup
MJ vs Lebron
why do you guys write fucking pages just for the same old zywoo goat or not debate??
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Its fun and I can post my thoughts on a public forum, can't I ?
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It was fun i won't lie
Nowadays everybody just says the same shit
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#10
im huge zywoo fan but anyone who is at least a little bit sane knows that he cant be considered as the goat for now...
we can talk about him as the best/second best player alongside with s1mple individually, he can say that he stormed into cs as nobody else and all those stuff which are true but that rly doesnt make him the goat tho
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That's what I am saying, ZywOo great player but not 🐐
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not yet :D
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Yes, maybe in CS2 even tho it's the same game tbh XD
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yea its more or less the same so he can do it tbh...
Not sure what you are waffling about but ZywOo is the undisputed GOAT of CS.
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You must have problem understanding what I have written but #10
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Only read the TLDR, not sure how you think that s1mple is the GOAT when he's not even in the top 3.
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This isn't even worth 0/8 tbh
In accordance to your opinion*
It's exactly the same with those that want to put s1mple or Device there.
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Sorry mens, but you should read it once, it takes lesser time than I took to write it.
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I agree to an extent.
I have no problem with other users wanting to portray ZywOo as the "GOAT", that's their choice and I respect that opinion. The only issue is when they try to enforce that as fact, in which then I have a problem with it, because it isn't and never will be factual, the title is user-defined based upon objective merits.
For me personally, I just put them both as GOAT contenders, it saves the hassle and they both ultimately deserve that very praise - no need for wars or a versus but that's just my take.
Try not to take those threads seriously, friend. ^^
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You are right jonty but if you had to pick one who is closer to the title, who would it be?
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Zywoo ofc.
Zywoo has achieved more significant individual accomplishments in his short career than S1mple
ZywOo at 22 :
-1 major, 1 major mvp
-3x top1 and 2x top2 since he was 18
-15 mvps and way more till end of the year
-2023 for now highest peak ever seen > 2018 simple
simple at 22 :
-0 major, 0 major mvp
-1x top1 and 1x top2
-10 mvps
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Same thing has been countered easily in the thread but you need to be able to read it.
So, no. S1mple still clears zywoo any day of the week
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dude, that "at 22" comparison doesn't even make sense, you are comparing one player considering his whole career against part of the career of the other, it's only fair and "mathematically" correct that you consider both full spans of their careers, and then, it is quite clear that s1mple comes on top, shit, even dev1ce is arguably a "better fit" candidate to goat. The only way to correctly quantify is to measure them with the same approach which considering their whole career, the fact that s1mple and dev1ce have longer career is only incidental.
Is this a discussion of Greatest of All Time or Greatest of All Time in 22 years of age?
In all honesty, I really couldn't choose just one... I like to value everybody's contributions to the game.
It's obvious that ZywOo cannot catch s1mple in terms of his raw accolades and achievements but the fact that he did what s1mple did in less the time is incredibly impressive, ZywOo's own personal achievements are nothing to turn your nose up at either...
I would say in terms of raw individual prowess? It goes to ZywOo.
In terms of outright overall accolades, accomplishments and achievements? It goes to Device.
When factoring in both at the same time? It goes to s1mple.
Otherwise, I would put Olofmeister, GTR. Coldzera, f0rest, Dupreeh and NiKo in the GOAT contenders category, too - They deserve it for what they have accomplished in this game.
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no matter how you look at it zywoo has not done what s1mple has in less time
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Well, that's fact, but also not ZywOo's fault either.
That's just the way it is, the argument is whether or not it is relevant for user's own opinions of the GOAT debate, which is perfectly fine. We can discuss about the facts all day, they won't change - the subjectiveness of what defines "GOAT" is usually more interesting anyway.
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true, but imo very unfair to assume zywoo given more time would match s1mple, when no other player has ever done so. also some people suggesting s1mple and zywoo's accomplishments at majors are equivalent just because they won 1 each is riduculous
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I agree. :)
We can only make that assumption based upon ZywOo's accomplishments as of right now? So it's not a completely invalidated assumption given what ZywOo has accomplished up to now, but still wholly unnecessary, I would say.
I think the "best" player of all time is very much up to each person to define, though there are objectively better options than others. You wouldn't call Plopski better than S1mple without being insane.
GOAT though has to do with the amount of achievements, mvps, performances and trophies one has earned. You then take that and add longevity and you get the GOATs of csgo. That leaves only a couple of objectively real options since greatness can be measured. Dupreeh, Device and S1mple. There could be GTR or maybe just maybe be cold and Zywoo. That is, if you dont count longevity at all, but then again you cant be great if you only won things in 2 or 3 years.
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Goat is subjective, longevity is overrated for me and everyone with a brain, you have to be out of Ur mind to seriously consider dupreeh above zywoo
So there goes Ur goat argument
Fact is, Jonty is right, everybody can think and say whatever the fuck they want and u shouldn't take this shit seriously
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you can't unbderstand the concept of ratio mvp/yers, can you ?
and LOOOOOOL, dev1ve debatable by your definition of GOAT, but coldzera really ???? my man have 8mvp at 28 years old, zywOo 15 lool
and don't brag major here or mvp major, dosn't make sens, and zywOo was not even there to take it
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ad hominem, and btw where my statistics are wrong? you know that information is widely available on hltv, right?
and if you want to talk about my english, sorry that in my country english is not an imperative language, because french is enough, not living in a third world country like laos, moron
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If you yourself with your Fish IQ believe that I'm from Laos when my English is 10x better than yours, suit yourself dumbass xdd
''You cant understand the concept of ratio mvp/years, can you?''
Coldzera >>>>>> Zywoo in his first 2 years, + major wins, cologne etc. So if we're gonna use your logic cold is better when debating about who's goat or not, no?
If you disagree, then s1mple >>>>> Zywoo due to simple playing longer, more mvps, more events etc etc etc.
You cant in any world believe that zywoo is higher up in the goat debate than simple, baguette.
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But he hasn't won 20 Mvps yet
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yeah ? just wondering, where then ?
top career rating : zywOo 1.27, s1mple: 1.24
ratio mvp (since at least t2 team) :
s1mple: in ten years : 21/10= 2,1
ZywOo ratio mvp in 5 years: 15/5= 3
( and even if you take his non pro team in french subtop aAa where zywOo was before vit, so totally not fair, still = 2,14)
ratio trophy/year in pro years:
s1mple = 17/10= 1,7 (btw they are shitty trophys et cis only tournaments trophies in there)
zywOo = 8/5 = 1.6 ( but the year is not even finished yet)
fun facts: all the mvps in vitality are own by zywOo, and he have more mvps than trophys by far, so meanning even when his team let him down, he take the mvps, ratio mvp/trophy, s1mple 21/17= 1,23, ZywOo 15/8 = 1,87
so sorry just pure stats and facts
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#210
This is straight up a lie. You guys can't even make an accurate argument and want irrelevant stats like MVP/year which is also calculated wrong in the comment XD.
Although this is a stat that doesn't matter in consideration of GOAT as said in the thread if you had read it.
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S1mple has not played 10 years and zywoo has not played 5 years which you're using for calculations in #201.
If you know basic maths, you'll know where you're wrong XD
It's loser and apparently I have explained that same point in the thread, you would know if you read it. If i am loser that means countless analysts and pros who consider s1mple as 🐐 are losers too and I am not complaining being in the same boat as them
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The one who call s1mple goat = pseudo
The one who call ZywOo goat = respectable
If this is not bias then idk what is hahahahha.
Flag checks out tho.
/closed
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no way an analyst in Vitality considers Zywoo as the GOAT
how the fuck can you even consider this as an argument
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That literally not what I said loool
I said casters are not really analysts, like you can find in pro teams, most of them don't even play the game on a regular basis, and don't understand the macro/micro of the game.
So tbh their opinions are not really often relevant
The only thing matters is stats, and maybe the gameplay, like just watch the game, does he bait?? entry ? make good decisions not shown in stats ( like 200iq plays) ..
don't be an NPC that it
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OP literally said Zywoo fans often base the status of GOAT on hand picked stats, you confirm that, thanks
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please tell me more about how he is the GOAT because he plays well on pistols
retard, you are the real npc here
/closed
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the more you argue with zywh0 fans, the more brain cells you'll lose sadly
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But it's not half years, it's just 2.5 more years than zywoo. Stop exaggerating to prove your point.
Besides, you can argue with me when he overtakes s1mple. Which is not gonna happen in CSgo
But the difference is that your guy hasn't yet achieved much of what the other guy has
15 Mvps vs 21 Mvps
No grand slam, no cologne, no Kato
Not as many top 20 appearances
Not as many top 5 appearances
He basically lacks in everything
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It's 6 years and 8.5 years. Also, i never said that zywoo won't be GOAT in future, I actually support that in my thread. He just won't be called goat of CSGO but CS2 even tho they are basically the same game
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What 8.5 years. S1mple started playing big events since 2014. Even if we count 2014 and 2015 into 1 year, s1mple is already at 9 years into csgo while zywoo is reaching 5 years by the end if the year.
Also zywoo won't be the GOAT if cs2 also. He may end up like the GOAT of entire cs while s1mple will be CSGO GOAT and one other guy will be the GOAT of CS2
S1mple only has max 6 top 3s from 9 years while zywoo will have 5 top 3s from just 5 years. If s1mple doesn't get top 3 in this or the next year, zywoo already tied s1mple in top1s and top 2s. Then its a matter of time zywoo overtake s1mple in mvps
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Lmao, so much bias even in factual matters. Just stop arguing if you're going to be inaccurate
If s1mple started in 2014 then zywoo started in 2017 as well. S1mple started in september 2014 and zywoo started in March 2017. The difference is exactly 2.5 years. Which comes to 8.5 years for s1mple and 6 years for zywoo
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Why does it matter?? It is s1mple's fault zywoo was playing tier 2 in 2017? His pro career had already started, not everyone starts with tier 1. Zywoo started with tier 2, why giving such vague arguments to somehow put zywoo above s1mple?
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Sure, it's a "non-pro team", the heights you fanbois go to prove your irrelevant point. m0nesy didn't complete school but was in g2 already, what's your point?? If ZywOo was extremely talented, why would he go to 'non-pro team' with HLTV profile in the first place.
An idiot who can't do 5th class mathematics is talking about NPC XDDDDD
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zywOo have refuse t1 team until he have finished school,
aAa is not a pro team that the point, zywOo have start his career in late 2018 with Vitality with a salary artound 1K5-2K month
you can't compare aAa which is a team to play open qualifier, not at all t2, T6 maybe at best lol( where he was smurfing anyway) to a team like hellfire or flipside for s1mple who was in established t2 teams (and even liquid in t1), that make just no sens, can you undersand the difference here , or you're delusional ?
(btw even if you take aAa, which is unfair, he still have a better ratio mvp/years played than s1mple loool)
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agree with u, 2 goats atm
Blud thinks someone gonna read that
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Most of them wouldn't even have the ability to read this, so we're safe from delusional fans in this thread
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Whatever makes you sleep at night
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1. Dupreeh goat now
2. Device is only alternative I accept
3. If talking only individual performance on server imo zywoo and s1mple are tied overall.
4. And most important: who tf cares, just watch them play as long as they are able to put up siperb performances
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Apparently, most of the zywoo fans care too much with 100 threads on day of major win. Some of them can be seen in this thread as well
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I bet its the same ppl on their 5th alt account that spammed s1mple goat threads for years. Its usually just to bait ppl into posting hateful comments
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yeah sadly a lot of trolls started embracing their zywoo fandom... Before everything was full of the same s1mple goat trolls for years, now they are surprisingly quiet, propably started creating accounts with zywoo flairs now
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Thanks my brother!! Appreciate the read
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#10 my uneducated friends
Didn't read, zygoat by a mile
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Always been biggest Niko fan.
But why're you projecting?? Where's your ZywOo flair?? You are honestly the biggest delusional fanboi after hoxje and superex. Who knows, maybe they're your alt, Same flag as well.
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I specifically remember zywoo flair with your name. Maybe a year ago
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Czech Zywoo fangirls are one of the biggest baiters on this website
Not gonna read this but I don't think zywoo is legitimate goat contender yet, However he has already won a major and won an IEM event for this season of grand slam. If he can close out his CSGO career with a grandslam win as well then he has legitimate arguments to be goat, matching s1mple's team achievements and almost matching his solo achievements in a much shorter span of time.
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Thanks for being a smart fan of such a smart player
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#10
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You're the one commenting hahahahha on a long post adding zero value to it
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the entire take would be good if you wouldnt belittle and shame Zywoo or his fans with weird insults every 5 sentences. Your arguments were based, your manners are not... 0/8
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I haven't belittled zywoo fans except the first sentence in the original thread post. My comments are just replies to their ignorant individuality.
And i haven't insulted zywoo even once in this thread, i respect him a lot as a player
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"at flowerlike ZywOo"....."metrics from zywoo fangirls " I dont know, to me the take is based, but the choice of words is too personal. Just imo
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"Flowerlike zywoo" is actually used by his fans a lot because he is so cute, didn't mean it as a disrespect. Sorry, if you're offended
You may have heard the phrase zywoo is so cute, delicate and flowerlike. I wanna do..... explicit content
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ah alright :D didnt know that
Huge ZywOo fan here. I haven't found any sign of disrespect, just a sensible opinion.
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Totally agree, he was never out of form except for 2021 first half
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I honest to god think that Zywoo in the last 12 months is better. Sure, s1mple has higher Rating 2.0, but that is not everything - Zywoo has better KAST, much better 1-on-1 clutches and more 1vX clutches. And all that while having AWP significantly less often. Plus Zywoo is an absolute beast in pistol rounds which is very relevant.
I can see arguments for s1mple, but I think it is very close at least...plus Zywoo in 2023 will probably be better than Zywoo in the last 12 months.
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Zywoo last 12 months is surely better htan simple last 12 months, noone will argue that.
But s1mple 2021 is still above zywoo 2023.
While yes, Zywoo has higher KAST 2023 than simple had 2021, you need to remind yourself that zywoo 2023 has 1/3 of simples games 2021. Also simple had more clutches 2021 than zywoo does now.
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I am comparing Zywoo in the last 12 months vs. S1mple in 2021. S1mple has Rating 2.0 (and metrics related to it) speaking for him, Zywoo has higher KAST (and yes, about ~80% of rounds played, but that is still a lot of rounds to make a solid estimate), much better 1-on-1 clutch record, significantly more clutches and all that while having AWP in much lower percentage of games.
So while s1mple leads in the stats that give you the best rough idea, if you look closer, I think Zywoo is better (albeit not by much, 2021 s1mple was insane)
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hltv.org/stats/players/7998/s1mple?start..
hltv.org/stats/players/11893/zywoo?start..
I think you're misscalculating something, simple is ahead in every statistic except clutches, and even then you're bringing half of 2022 into the argument, which i think is wrong when we're speaking of year-by-year.
S1mple also had greater opposition, which should be taken into account.
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I do not understand what you mean by me misscalculating? The links you yourself provided have Zywoo having better KAST (and DPR, but I am omitting that as both have such a low DPR it is more about different playstyle and team strategy) and all the other stuff I mention being true as well.
And I do not get what you mean by greater opposition. Sure, 2021 NaVi had more trophies, but current Vitality is one of the top teams, getting deep into tournaments all the time.
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If you believe that s1mple who has 0.6 higher rating with 40+ more maps played than zywoo isnt important compared to KAST and DPR(0.2, yet again, with 40 maps less played.)
1.34 isnt KD, it calculates most stats into 1.(hltv.org/news/20695/introducing-rating-2..) 0.6 is a fat difference. not somethign to shoo away and claim that one is better than the other due to having 0.7 better in KAST, no?
And they dont go deep all the time, that's also false.
Out of the 13 S tier events we've had the past 12 months, vitality has shown an apperance in a total of 6(getting into top 4 in 1 or 2), whereas they have won 3. which is actually pretty bad. so no, you're very wrong.
liquipedia.net/counterstrike/S-Tier_Tour..
During Na'Vis ''era'' they lost 6 series in 6 months, whereas 5 were to Then known as GAMBIT and 1 to big, that makes 40wins and 6losses.
Out of the 10 S-tier events na'vi showed an apperance in 2021, they won 9, only lost 1 which were to gambit. There's is an extremely clear difference.
I'm not trying to sound cocky or anything but it is very well known that s1mple 2021 is the best version of a player we've ever seen, it isnt something ''simple fans'' picks out of their asses.
Although you're obviously very free to believe that 1 player is better than the other, whoever someone believes is better is completely subjective, but you should never speak of your thoughts like they were facts(im not talking about you specifically, just overall)
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Niko 2021 peak was higher skill wise and not awp-inflating stats
/closed.
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You dont know more than 90% of csgo analysts.
hltv.org/stats/players/3741/niko?startDa..
1.21 highest peak skill wise god damn..
Get out of here, why is every single person on this website deluded, tf
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These stats as rifle >>>> Inflated stats as awper with the best team in the world.
cope.
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the "goat" is a very controversial concept
s1mple called the goat just because he had good time to be on his prime — the most competitive time in csgo
zywoo is younger and for example coldzera or f0rest are older, so we can't really call any of them goat
but most likely cs2 will live for 10 years at least, so zywoo will peak in the beginning of the game, so he has less chances to become the goat
but in comparsion he has more impressive results than anyone and he is still at his best and progressing, while s1mple is getting older and worse
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Cold is not old, he just washed up pretty quickly
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bro made this long ass thread that nobody read just for people to still call zywoo the goat ahahaahaha
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People who don't just bait on this site easily read the post in 2 minutes, but I can't expect that from you as you're on the opposite side of spectrum of the zywoo fanbois mentioned in the thread
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not really, im a zywoo fan and its very okay to call him the goat. 4 and a half years with one of the highest consistency we have seen since this game was made, it was the same thing with messi ever since he started playing on barça main team, why not this on csgo too
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Same consistency has been shown by s1mple in these mentioned years plus the one year before ZywOo even came to the scene so who's the goat by that logic?
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what? first 5 years of s1mple are nothing compared to zywoo first 5 years my man, we are talking about 2 times best player, 2 times second best, 15 mvps including cologne and a major
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actually 3 times the best player, he has this year on a lock in
Why are you talking only about first 5 years, who says player only peaks in his initial years?? Did you even read the thread???? Or another fanboi trying to prove his point?
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im talking about the first 5 because zywoo is only about to finish his 5 year as a pro, if you wanna compare him with s1mple, and no i dont think peaks only happen in the first years, im talking consistency this high from the very first year as a pro
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Cold had same consistency from the very first year too but his competition at that time, NiKo is still putting up numbers but cold is out of the scene since 4 years.
Point being that if he is good at the start doesn't mean he'll be good till the end of even in the intermediate.
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coldzera had 2 insane years, zywoo is about to have 5 in a team that isnt even as good as old sk, 2021 navi, prime astralis, 2022 faze etc but fair enough lets see for more 2 or 3 years
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Read the thread before commenting please
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+1 they somehow want to see zywoo at top and make themselves happy :D
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he's already at the top
like what? ahahahaha
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Like MVPs, top 1s, top 5s, top 10s, top 20s, trophies, a grand slam.
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well that's a over 10 years career vs a 4 and a half years career, we just compare cause what zywoo is doing with this little amount of time is what no other player has ever done
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Is goat considered by in what amount of years a player achieved ot overall achievements. Besides it's 8.5 years vs 6 years as mentioned in #210
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then again, you are comparing a decade career with 4 and half years, zywoo has 15 mvps including a major and cologne, 2 top 1 and two top 2, that is unreal, if he keeps up like this for the next years he might be the greatest counter strike player ever
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what? it should be harder to be a cs pro nowadays with how delevoped the game is than back then wth, and zywoo was not on the big scene until 2019
all of this, number of mvps per year, 5 year achievements, etc. has all been invented by zywoo fans in the goat debate, when zywoo is not even close to the goat status (atm)
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invented? its all on his hltv page bro ahahahahaha
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yeah, but I've seen them use these terms before in other threads
S1mple's fans get upset because they can't counter-argue this:
ZywOo at 22 :
-1 major, 1 major mvp
-3x top1 and 2x top2 since he was 18
-15 mvps and way more till end of the year
-2023 for now highest peak ever seen > 2018 simple
simple at 22 :
-0 major, 0 major mvp
-1x top1 and 1x top2
-10 mvps
zywoo clears
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As expected from a person who can't read
#10
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If you read the thread, you know the argument is there. But you clearly didn't so who's insulting and spamming the same irrelevant comment now.
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You are not wrong at any point, just that age doesn't matter in GOAT consideration which is already mentioned in thread why.
So, it's actually your fault trying to argue without reading the thread first and you're the pathetic one that you have to spam the same comment everyday just to prove an irrelevant point
2021 s1mple was the highest peak bro XD
u just proved that u dont even know what you are talking about
"zywoo clears"
at being nowhere close to the goat status? 100% agreed
s1mple in 2021 literally had the highest recorded year in the history of CS:GO.
Second would be GTR in 2012/2013 and then it would be ZywOo, depending on how this year goes, of course.
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So his peek makes him GOAT? What about his time in hellraisers and flipside? 0 top20 placements in 3 years. Why nobody mentions that ? How can s1mple be better than Zywoo when s1mple struggled to get into top20 until he started to play in NaVi. Clearly shows that it was team who helped him to achieve that. While Zywoo played with very weak teammates and still got top1-2.
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ZywOo is "my goat", but objectively I wouldn't call him the goat (yet), because accomplishments / trophies are a big part of this title.
didnt read but Zywoo is the goat of 2019-2023 era
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CSgo released in 2012
Also, s1mple has 2 top1s and 2 top2s in 2019-2023 era and a grand slam, major, cologne, katowice, pro league in the same era.
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bro forgot about 2021 s1mple xD
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yea this year he was unstoppable my bad
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who is talking about this year? are you delusonal nvm you are a zywoo fan of course you are
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stfu nerd
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horrible bait
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GOAT definition is for people to argue. The term is subjective and everyone will have either a bias on the player he likes most between the 2 debated or will create criterias based on which one of them is better. Imo a lot of players can battle for this 'spot' depending on which criteria you use and it is a pointless 'battle' as you can just enjoy the plays whatever the player is
bro posted a mega solid arguments and u still see zywoo fans just type "lmao delusonal" "s1mple fanboy" etc. xddd
no matter how hard you try, some zywoo fans will always come up with new and delusional af excuses, but sometimes it's really funny to see how low some can go. For example, yesterday some idiot was saying that zywoo farming FPL in 2018 was better than 2018 s1mple with all his reasons being hilarious af
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You can't deny Niko is 🐐 rifler, don't care if you agree with me or not
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Niko 2021 >> Niko 2017. Facts about 🐐 rifler
kennyS is the real goat.
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Actually zywoo fans are the one coping for him to be considered as goat by analysts, pros, community in general and people other than zywoo fans and s1mple haters.
ZywOo is the greatest player of all time.
In only 5 years at the top of csgo he would have 3 top 1 and 2 hltv#2 ranking.
3rd highest amount of mvp in csgo. 1 major win and mvp
Achieving so much being the best player in the world for the period of 5 years. No player has done so straight for 5 years, leave the talk of them doing since their debut.
It's just funny that ZywOo hasn't even hit his peak and just now he has started to get support from his teammates. He's gonna further cement his position as greatest player of all time.
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He can do it further in future game like CS2 but he is not greatest in CSgo and as i said in the thread, smaller age or time period doesn't make him better contender.
Currently he lacks many things against s1mple. #172
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And s1mple lacks so many against device
It's all about given the time comparing overall achievements and avg ratings just shows ZywOo is way way superior.
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S1mple has been ahead of device for more than half of device's career i.e 6 years, idk how he is behind him.
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Number of achievements device is still far ahead of s1mple.
No, it's not, it's about longevity. Look at how hard cold fell off after being top 1 two years in a row. We don't know the future, so arguments like: "Zywoo would have achieved more given more time" is irrelevant.
do you know what goat means?
"No player has done so straight for 5 years"
Bro what are you on seriously?s1mple has done that a year before Zywoo,he's been on a top1/2 level since 2018.s1mple was on a comparable level individually every year Zywoo has been playing plus he was one of the best players in the world for 3 years before that,he has much more longevity
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What?
s1mple did do well in 2018 when ZywOo wasn't there but he didn't do anything in 2023.
So that way it we compare 2018-2022 and 2019-2023. ZywOo is clearly ahead with his impact on a shitty team. All the years ZywOo was #2, he was closer than s1mple was in 2020 and in 2019.
So he clearly had better 5 years, carrying deadweight without any kind of support. s1mple got electronic but ZywOo got nothing.
Way better player in the 5 years he played at top level of cs. First time ZywOo got a decent team(still dupreeh and apEX finished players), he's about shatter all records in terms of team achievements.
You fell for theit baits
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Don't care if you read or not brother! Thanks for concern tho, i just touched grass today morning.
He can't be called GOAT right now but he is on track to getting there
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I totally agree with you and I believe he is the sole contender right now if s1mple doesn't get his form back in cs2. Maybe m0nesy and sh1ro can contend, we'll see
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Simple still the best, I have to say. I'd think in order to be considered goat, there has to be a minimum number of years played along with consistently high performance. Zywoo is too young to be in the conversation right now.
So many factors that would determine this status, I can't think right now.
Ok
TLDR
how much value this post has?
Answer
Fan of players
s1mple
Fan of teams
Natus Vincere
2 replies
how much value this comment has?
Answer
Fan of players
ZywOo
Fan of teams
Vitality
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Difference is I didn’t create 10 page post about Zywoo being the goat, use your brain pls and don’t waste your time with nonsense essays.
Insecure s1mple fans LUL
I truly think you can see either one is the goat, but how are you saying that zywoo fans are talking about achievements at a certain age when every s1mple fans argument was s1mple 2 major finals versus zywoo at 0 before 22
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They are only replying to counter the 22 year old point made by zywoo fans, but instead they should have said what i did in the post.
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I am a fan of myself. But if you like to lick some1 else D it’s okay for me
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dupreeh/device > s0mple/zywho
longest bait thread so far
As a Zywoo fan , i get the fact Zywoo , playing less than half of CSGO's life , can't be the GOAT.
I also get the fact than for those which is unclear who is the goat of CSGO . his name might come upthere.
I think Goat should be the best player at a certain time and that dominate an era. That left us with 2 options. First one is Get_Right , second one is S1mple.
I Guess it depend of time perspective of each people.
Note :
Coldzera could have been candidate but way too short prime .
Dev1ce , can't be considered the GOAT of ALL TIME if he never been the GOAT of a SINGLE TIME . Unfortunate for him .. S1mple and Coldzera were just above of him when he was at his best .( never top 1)
Niko : Same but doesnt even have achievement.
Zywoo likely won't be the goat of cs2 either, because he is 22, and since csgo has 11 years, we expect that cs2 will also have the same amount of years before another iteration. If zywoo peaks at 24 years of age like s1mple, he will only have 2 years of his peak cs2 performance until 24. And in the next 8 years someone else can come up and have, say a 4 year of insane top 1 performance and achievements on cs2. This guy would be the cs2 goat.
So likely zywoo will only content for goat of all cs if he has enough longevity.
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+1 2016-2017 coldzera is much better than zywoo 2020 and 2023 zywoo for example
zywoo needs a bit of alpha male energy to become an absolute unit
just like this guy:
twitch.tv/payo/clip/OptimisticRoundGarba..
right now he is good, but he can improve a lot, just by getting a bit of "toxic masculinity" and also applying it to his gameplay and ingame comms.
who read that
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