[POD]Cast episode two VOD out

March 5th, 2013 14:49

Second episode of [POD]Cast featuring fnatic's CGO Patrik "cArn" Sättermon, our writer Tomi "lurppis" Kovanen and Duncan "Thorin" Shields has now been released as VOD.

A night since originally airing live on Monday evening, the VOD has now been uploaded on fnatic TV's YouTube channel. Following last week's format, they once again spent over an hour talking about all things Counter-Strike.

[POD]Cast #2 started with a talk about fnatic's roster changes, VeryGames' departure from SLTV StarSeries V and the possible real reasons behind it, before moving to talk about the qualifier formats for tournaments.

After suggesting new ways to organize the online qualification system, Shields suggested implementing certain optimizations from QuakeWorld being brought over to CS to make online games as even as possible.

To end this week's [POD]Cast, motivated by a thread on our site regarding Nicolaj "Nico" Jensen's MVP award from Cadred at Mad Catz, the trio talked about the flaws of the MVP-award system in eSports and how to make it better.

It's painfully annoying to watch when Carn just interrupts Lurppis every time.
2013-03-05 15:08
i don't think anyone means to interrupt other people, but skype delays obviously affect it, especially with how laggy me and thorin are in general (if you just look at our video). we'll work to improve in the future!
2013-03-05 15:14
Hey what is that program you are talking about which "fixes" routing?
2013-03-05 16:59
i don't remember what it was called anymore to be honest, the name was very similar to the word proxy but i'm not sure... it could have been privoxy, but i'm not sure.
2013-03-05 17:05
Sweden carn 
Be aware that this is being recorded over the internet(doh) using Skype where the delay is quite severe as Tomi is still in North America. It's never mine or anyone's intention to interrupt another, it's just something that happens in Podcasts due to the reason mentioned above.
2013-03-05 15:17
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
Yeah right you ignorant cunt!!
2013-03-05 15:47
stfu and respect who's older and xperienced than you kid !
2013-03-05 15:57
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
How are you that stupid that you can't tell that I'm joking? myfacewhen.net/uploads/4286-kill-yoursel..
2013-03-05 16:01
bad joke and still kid ... bye white dressed girl
2013-03-05 16:08
as usual everyone see you're retarded
2013-03-05 16:35
Estonia 2026 
Wow u are so retarded. You think everyone will read it like hahaha so funny? Stupid CUNT! (c)
2013-03-05 19:32
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
And how did you end up this retarded?
2013-03-05 19:34
Estonia 2026 
Sup bro? Does it look like I'm retarded and saying, Yeah right you ignorant cunt!! to carn just to "look" cool? No.
2013-03-05 19:38
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
Haha a such a fucking spacker kid...
2013-03-05 20:02
Estonia 2026 
Yet u get hated on faggot :)
2013-03-05 22:08
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
ooooo0o0o0o getting hated on a forum by lots of third world kids, how will I ever cope.
2013-03-05 22:40
Estonia 2026 
Why u get so mad? Can't handle the pressure bro? Yeah.. "third world kids" but still. You're the one who posts shit like it would've been posted by some kid... Read ur first comment BRO!
2013-03-05 22:44
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
Too much retard, I can barely contain my laughter!
2013-03-06 00:37
3rd world? Without oil you would be a sandman
2013-03-07 14:19
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
2013-03-07 14:51
so how much are you making per month?
2013-03-07 14:55
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
Lol? That's not really any of your business pal. And my point wasn't about them being poor, it was about how the fact that some random people halfway across the world don't like me on a forum wasn't going to get me upset.
2013-03-07 14:58
You called Estonia a 3rd world that is the reason why i got part of this discussion.
2013-03-07 15:03
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
Well no, he said I'm getting hated on, and I said I don't care about 3rd world kids. Either way, who the fuck cares, get over it.
2013-03-07 15:38
2013-03-08 14:56
f0rest | 
United Kingdom simko 
get out of carns arse trying to score brownie points hoping that he might ask you to come out for a beer on your 18th birhday. hahahahaha
2013-03-05 17:53
I'm not tryin to get cArn's interst 4sure (he's from sweden and i'm from morocco), i don't drink beer, and the more important is i'm not 18 little puppy ;) and btw who knocked ur door kid ? ousst ousst you stink ... BYE
2013-03-05 18:32
you seem mad crAn > you
2013-03-05 16:03
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
haha all you kids are funny
2013-03-05 16:04
you are the one talking like... Afterwards you are saying it is a joke, don't really see where this is funny whatsoever.
2013-03-05 16:07
+1 ignore him, he didn't took his pillz
2013-03-05 16:08
they should ban him permanent or change his nickname to "idiotic fool do not listen to me"
2013-03-05 17:15
hahahahaha "idiotic fool do not listen to me" x'D hahahah
2013-03-05 17:20
dv | 
United Kingdom dv-_- 
LOL you are clearly 13.
2013-03-05 19:35
idiotic fool do not listen to me.
2013-03-05 20:16
2013-03-06 10:17
Fat black fool dressed in white
2013-03-06 10:20
2013-03-05 16:05
why doesnt anyone get that youre just joking lol
2013-03-05 16:31
carn, for fuck sake, why u spell "just" not like it's proper on english, it's weird to hear your "just"
2013-03-05 16:23
You said that its unfair to take ESC to event. but do u think so called esport which cs is part of, actually can afford to drop esc which (provide certain amount of viewers and skill lvl for the tournament)to make it more Sport-ish??
2013-03-05 19:20
lurp is nice guy,respect!
2013-03-05 15:09
are u gay?
2013-03-05 17:33
Tellin someone that he's nice is gay only in RUSSIA :p
2013-03-05 18:34
2013-03-06 08:16
Russia AverN 
GO CS 1.6 ALL!
2013-03-05 15:10
i hope that you will make it something like Live On 3 the Djwheat's show! (still it is my favorite esports show ever! ) anyways good job and it is enjoyable enough
2013-03-05 15:29
World Fr3de 
This is a great podcast, and I think you three are the most qualified people to be casting it. You all have great minds in different ways, that just works in a show like this.
2013-03-05 15:37
You can discuss infinitely about cs.
2013-03-05 15:39
very interesting so far regarding the problem of ESC: they are now in a German organisation and afaik ESC got a bootcamp-base in Germany (or had one and is building a new one now?). they should play the important internet matches from Germany.
2013-03-05 15:48
Denmark Pimp 
Since the ping diffrence in CSGO is not that important as it was in 1.6 i think it is all right :) At least in source it dident really matter if your self had 50 ping, and your opponent had 20. Guess it has something to do with the net codeing in the game, witch i dont know anything about. Since the CSGO is bulied on the same enige, with the same net-code (as far as i know)as source, it isent really a big problem more i guess. Look at vitrus.Pro they do well online , ESEA, fnatic frag out league you name it. You can play with 60-70 i ping, against 20-40 with out it really is such a big factor that it become a huge problem :D
2013-03-05 15:55
ye that's actually true... so the problem of ESC is probably more a psychological problem... worse communication and less passion when playing online... or they just think linke "we always failed online, so we probably gonna lose this online match as well" and then their confidence is gone. the fact that they failed 7 times to qualify online for a offline tournament but then (after they found an other way to qualify) they actualy won 4 of those 7 offline tournaments is just stunning. :D I mean normally there are these "online only" teams who only win online tournaments (thanks to cheats and unfair tools) but fail at every offline tournament....ESC is the exact opposite :D
2013-03-05 16:01
Because both games (CS:S and CS:GO) have insane prediction. Which makes things like the "Peakers Advantage" exist.
2013-03-06 02:51
and why would they pay for tickets from pl to ger. i mean at this stage all orgas are having enough high bills for travelings of teams on lans.... i mean there arent that much spectators to spend cash foolishly.
2013-03-05 20:51
Because they're obviously not able to win an online qualifier. It's embarrassing to see them losing against teams like Alternate. If they don't improve themself in online matches, there will come a time where they simply won't attend big tournaments anymore. Carmac can't save their asses any longer.
2013-03-05 21:32
sir u missunderstood what i meant.
2013-03-06 08:32
Thorin wearing his jacket with polar bear hears, is it that cold at your place ? xD
2013-03-05 15:54
utubes blocked in china dammit :(
2013-03-05 16:23
go around with a proxy ? xD
2013-03-05 16:30
chinese uses proxy meme goes to prison :-D
2013-03-05 16:39
aie that ain't good xD
2013-03-05 16:41
2013-03-05 17:00
I disagree with the "only ranking-based invitation". How could unknown but strong newcomer-teams qualify? In offline qualifier tournaments?! Way too expensive for the tournament-host since they would have to organize such offline qualifiers in several different regions... Or were you thinking about offline events which are independent from the actual big tournament?! Let me explain it to you Scandinavians why this isn't possible: Outside Scandinavia there are almost no small offline tournaments left! For example in Germany we only have like 5-10% of the LANS we had in 2004. There are simply not enough open offline tournaments anymore - and almost none that would bring you any credibility. How should a unknown but very good team of young talented players find their way into the big tournaments? They NEED online qualifiers. I'm for the hybrid-system: A certain number of invited teams (which get invited according to some always-up-to-date global ranking) and a certain number of team that qualified in online qualifier + maybe an BYOC tournament(of course not every tournament organisation is able to hold a BYOC; only an BYOC wouldn't be a fair solution either because it only supports amateur teams from the local area - amateur teams from far away simply can't afford it).
2013-03-05 16:37
Just as Thorin said quakeworld has ways of simulating ping dosnt cs have the same, I've never tried it but there is a "fakelag" command in cs you can use to simulate a higher ping. Not sure if this actually effects you or just your delay or if it just adds to your ping on the net_graph.
2013-03-05 17:08
oh wow lurppis, very clever to talk about how you tried to cheat on the HLTV community, very clever :D but ye, MVP awards were always a joke. that will never change. having only a jury wouldn't be a good solution either since the members of that jury would most likely be friends of some of the nominated players and therefore not fair-minded.
2013-03-05 17:12
not really cheating to be honest, i would have just not mentioned how much the fans' votes are worth and no one would have ever noticed ^^
2013-03-05 17:37
I would never allow that kind of cheating :D And I don't think the MVP awards have ever been a joke around here, even with the fan votes (of course I was the one doing all that, so maybe I'm not the most objective). I stand behind every one of them, even the karrigan one which is obviously the most disputable and for good reasons. But I can still make a solid case for it, and it was also one of our closest votes ever.
2013-03-05 17:51
While the invitations may seem like a good idea with the purpose of always getting the world's top5-8 teams to your event (especially the Poles), I don't think they make any sense from the point of view of people who invest in e-Sports and who actually provide the money the teams end up playing for. If the tournament someone decides to sponsor directly invites all the best teams, it leaves the online qualifiers to semi-known and unknown teams. That means they will get far less exposure throughout the season and during the qualification process, which is in comparison much longer than the 3-day LAN event that follows it. In addition to that, the qualifications often hype up the upcoming LAN, create stories with upsets and rivalries, and give chances to less known teams to become known. With the expansion of streams in the past 2-3 years this has become particularly important. So it makes much more sense to have NiP compete in various online leagues all the time than to have them automatically qualified for every LAN event, as a lot more people will watch NiP play online than the other teams, which automatically means the brand gets more exposure. With ESL's past IEM events when the Poles got in through the back door, they got the best of both worlds, everyone played online in the most prestigious league/qualification process, and later all the best teams were on LAN. I can't really blame them for anything, they always did it by the rules, even in that UMX case mentioned in the podcast :) I guess that might be a too global way of looking at it, but the ones who give the money have the right to expect the exposure. Ofc there are tournaments who don't really depend on that so much, as their sponsors focus more on the main event itself and not so much on CS in particular, like DreamHack, ESWC, GameGune, Cph Games. But the ones we've got going in the next few months like EMS, SLTV StarSeries, ESEA all have online leagues for those purposes. And besides, isn't it better for the fans to watch all the best teams play few times a week than just once a month at a major LAN?
2013-03-05 17:39
here's the problem: i would rather watch nip, vg, esc and na`vi at lan than all of them online and three of them at lan. is there any who would rather watch n!faculty at esea finals than esc?
2013-03-05 18:08
2013-03-05 18:22
It's not mutually exclusive, it's just how it happened in ESEA because ESC started underperforming after doing great online for 2 months before that (and because ESEA system made them play VG and NiP twice). It's not the fault of online matches, they should have qualified in standard circumstances. I would rather watch them all regularly online and then on LAN, and I would also add 2-4 more teams like n!faculty who could challenge them. But that's not what the format allows and we're not the ones paying for brand exposure. What if ESEA just invited those four to LAN without the online season? We wouldn't see ESC vs Virtus.pro triple overtime match, we wouldn't see n!faculty beating VG twice, we wouldn't see many other interesting matches in the past few months and CS:GO itself would have 50% less exposure on a daily basis. Besides, we will see them all at Cph Games, DH and the rest of the sign-up-and-you're-invited events which don't have online leagues and qualifiers.
2013-03-05 18:38
Ehm, like, EVERY German perhaps?
2013-03-06 02:53
i doubt even 50% of the germans would rather watch an average team from their country than one of the best teams in the world
2013-03-06 03:20
Sweden wmb 
once again stupid outspeak by tomi kovanen. you are an idiot. germans are patriotic people, they cheer for their landsmen, even if its in curling there are people still going to it. as soon as n!faculty plays, all german players watches. you flame and talk so much bullshit ESC, NiP, verygames lost to n!faculty, infact its a solid team. they do deserve this slot and is a better team than mousesports u are still locked in the 1.6 mentality because u havent fully switched to this new game but claiming that esc should get the slot is very stupid nfaculty is the only team besides epsilon who have beaten the world top in csgo. ur favoritism disgustes me and its a new game where ESC is just another top10 team in the world. n!faculty beated esc and has better vs stats. its 2-1 to n!faculty in matches so its deserved.
2013-03-06 11:31
"nfaculty is the only team besides epsilon who have beaten the world top in csgo." Winning online and preforming well at LAN are two very different things. Everybody regardless of LAN experience will play different online(more aggressive etc), if they cant do it on LAN it dosnt mean anything.
2013-03-06 14:41
esc is a top3 team in the world right now. n!faculty is fresh of a last place in vienna, following a thrashing from na`vi and a loss to teamcrg. they are good online (as seen from wins vs nip+vg) but that's about it; they haven't been good on lan, and esea is a lan tournament.
2013-03-06 14:57
so 4th at eswc? that not count? im from england i hate germans by default but even i know they deserve it sadly.
2013-03-07 15:11
that was not a good placing, let's recap their results: 8-16 vs fm.toxic (inferno) 4-16 vs verygames (dust2) 16-11 vs esc (inferno) 16-10 vs anexis (inferno) 0-2 vs nip 1-2 vs area51 (won on inferno) they were pretty good on inferno at the time and made playoffs over esc due to head-to-head tiebreaker with same number of points but make no mistake, getting two wins in the group stage is not a good performance, just lucky that they somehow advanced with it their other very unmemorable placings include: 2nd eps germany 17-24th at dreamhack winter 13-16th at mad catz cs:so invitational very good online, hardly average on lan.
2013-03-07 15:25
Good podcast again guys!
2013-03-05 18:08
Now then, I will start by saying I was a css player, and never played 1.6 competitively, even though I don't think it should matter. Anyways, after listening to the podcast i was hoping there would be some good discussions, about various things, and while I completely understand its a podcast and therefore meant to be subjective I feel like this episode has been so disrespectful to some people in certain moments that I just wanted to turn it off. Rather than listening to a dicussion about problems fans are always having to put up with we saw a discussion about how s**t certain individuals are in the opinion of some of the show presenters. A first example here would be the whole fnatic conundrum, with them picking up Rytter and Jokern, and how they were later replaced by MODDIII and StingeR. First of all while both of them might have no done anything of the sort in 1.6, they were still part of top danish teams in css, and therefore lan experienced and known in the community, probably not at the level of their 1.6 counterparts in the team, but that is all down to the number of events 1.6 had in comparison to css and the world wide range of them. Secondly i feel that both player actually played quite decent for Fnatic and at time were the standout players for that team, and played way better than trace and Friis. That said, I was quite appalled to hear, how much Thorin disrespected them, pretty much saying how bad they were and unknown they were, and how they should have never been in fnatic, and even though both the players have nothing to disrespect the org, and as stated by Thorin himself, Rytter had at a certain point asked sorry for not playing as well as fnatic was expecting and hoping to not let down his and the teams fans down, he still adds onto the insult of saying how nobody cares as nobody every followed him anyways. To be honest if I was rytter and that podcast came out right before the EMS cup, i would've probably refused to play it, considering he helped the new fnatic getting to the semi-finals of said cup. Well to me that sounds like the reasoning of a 16 year old, as every grown man would have a way more objective reasoning about that, especially when you are in a podcast made for cs.go fans, where im hoping it is another way to make the game grow. That gotten out of the way i'll speak about my opinion about invite based tournaments, which i think are great but should not be the sole tournaments in the scene. It is great to be able to see lans where teams like Esports Serbia in Vienna that nobody knows off goes, and beats some teams that are considered way better than them, the same way in which the champions league has unknown quantities coming in and doing really well, as Rubin Kazan for example a couple of years ago, or the Porto - Monaco Final. (since we like doing football comparisons). Also the online / world cup qualifier comparison doesn't work. AS the world cup is played on a couple different fields in one country, with a certain weather, football field, and temperature while the qualifiers are played in various different fields around the world making it two different ways of qualifying and then playing the tournaments just like in CS. Finally about the MVP situation, i think this is very situational and subjective, yet in this case the vote had nothing more than face value, so it didn't really matter, but in my opinion if for example, in football terms again, Faroe Islands (no disrespect for anyone from Faroe Islands) qualify for the world cup and get 3rd place, with a great goalkeeper, then yes he will probably win MVP, as nobody would expect them to get 3rd place. Im sorry if my english isn't great. Anyways those are my two cents
2013-03-05 18:13
solid wall of text
2013-03-05 18:39
Look how fnatic play now and then and i don`t think so they play worse. Trace and friss have more experience and we all know their potential.
2013-03-05 18:42
not saying they aren't, dont but it is one thing saying, this team is better, because more potential from 1.6, they work well together etc etc. Another thing is saying you are shit, you will never be good shut up unknown
2013-03-05 18:54
I don`t hear that. Can you say in which minutes he said that ??
2013-03-05 18:50
starts around 11.30
2013-03-05 19:00
Sweden wmb 
good point, i noticed this type of behavior too. was too much bash less e-sport. felt like they were mocking the rejuvenated fnatic, but the problem is that they are all 3 still in the 1.6 mentality. jokern did good job, was fnatics best player as u said, should be credited for event. i think reason why fnatic failed was too much pressure and a little too less experience. overall it was a team with growing potentials, but an organization like fnatic should have based the pickup with an indepth analysis of the players individually and then come with the conclusion. felt that friis n the rest just picked up players without knowing what they were doing because of the fact that they wanted success so they took players out there as if they were candy
2013-03-06 11:48
2013-03-12 03:19
2013-03-05 18:57
I actually agree with your post Gugli. Little bit disrespectful towards rytter. Anyhow people have opinions and they should be able to speak them out loud.
2013-03-05 18:57
i completely agree that people should be able to vouch their opinions but there are different ways to do it, especially when you are a journalist.
2013-03-05 19:01
Well said! Completely agree - it's annoying how blatantly biased all three come off - an effort could atleast be made.
2013-03-05 19:37
Cry me a river. I can't even remember the names of these previous fnatic players. fnatic did so bad, I couldn't follow it any longer. They had their chance but they were obviously too bad for fnatic.
2013-03-05 21:34
Another great podcast. O agree with the comment that you guys could discuss infinitely about cs. Keep em coming.
2013-03-05 18:49
I understand the bashing of the skill of German teams by lurpis, because it's partially true. You're talking about the best teams and how it would get you more viewers. What? Biggest nonesense. Without a German team representing their country the views would drop dramatically, same goes for other countries too. In fact it would actually help the community the most if there is a top 5 German, American & Russian team.
2013-03-05 19:18
If I can give some advice to cArn it would be to try and be a little bit more decisive. I understand you have a reputation to uphold but it isn't that interesting when you're so middle-of-the-road on every remotely controversial point made in the podcast. Also agree with Gugli, it was pretty disrespectful of Thorin toward Rytter considering he's one of the most well-liked and respected players in the Danish scene and has been for a number of years, I'd imagine he does have a fair amount of fans. That's also without mentioning the fact that both him and JOKERN performed well with the team (JOKERN was excellent at HKLAN). I understand the whole 1.6-bubble but, as cArn said, you have to respect that CS:GO is a new game that features both 1.6 and CS:S players and contrary to what a lot of people (generally morons) think, they're pretty equal in terms of ability.
2013-03-05 19:37
Sweden wmb 
cArn really needs to get some knowledge in what he says in regards of the CS:GO scene. With all due respect, a person like carn shouldnt consider doing podcasts with outstanding internetjerk like trollpis what u said about him not being a part of scene is absolutely right. rytter was infact trying to create a team with visions in fnatic but failed since the guys were too unexperienced. css players in this game does have an advantage, if u look at statistics in the top10, most teams are source-based teams. a few has 1.6 players but its because they managed to adapt to the game with good resources and fps-abilities. carn should have done a more indepth analysis in regards of what he believes will come instead of just spewing out what he thinks
2013-03-06 11:39
They should just stop handing out those awards at every tournament. Also they shouldn't be decided by a community vote thats just garbage. Rather hand it out once a year like heaven media for all their tournaments they hosted/will host in 2013. What I really dislike is that the tournaments in general just offer too few spots for everyone who wants to attend. I'm sure that this often happens. Also the ESEA system sucks I totally agree and n!faculty won't do any damage at the finals. Even the american teams have a decent chance to win versus them. I wouldn't underestimate them anyways. I'm sure that ESC would've done a great show on the finals. Even that they haven't beaten the best yet they always play close on lan. 15:15 versus Navi, 11:4 lead versus NiP and lost 1:2 to VeryGames. I'm not that long in the competitive CS scene as others but if I know it right some years back there were even lan qualifiers for every country to attend this one lan tournament. Like Kode5, WCG and others. I'd love to see this again. The admins of the ESL are garbage. It doesn't matter what kind of admin it is. If it's just a community admin and whatnot. I remember the last online qualifiers for IEM in 1.6 and in the first round there got like 16 of 32 disqualified because they were using net_graph. Hilarious since it's allowed like everywhere except there and I'm not sure if anyone is using that for cheating. haha Since it's CS:GO now I don't really see a big problem anymore with having a ping of 50 or something.
2013-03-05 19:52
I have to say I think these podcasts are amazing. The way you guys discuss CS is interesting to listen to and will keep me tuned in for the next episode. On the topic of the difference between the Quake community and the CS community: The mods made for Quake to grant equal ping would be very good for CS online competition wise. The problem with the CS community is finding someone willing to code it, or tournaments picking it up. A big example of this is maps. There have been no real new maps for ages. The big tournaments simply do not pick them up. I think a lot more effort should be put on designing and picking up new maps for tournament play. The old maps have been played over a million times. Obviously also because they are very good maps, but refreshment is much needed. For example de_train in CS 1.6 was in my opinion the best/diffucult map. Both from a player as a spectator point of view. Where in CS:GO it seems more forced upon because we used to play this map in 1.6, even though the GO version is not that good. In 1.6 train matches were by far my favourite to spectate. We are hanging on to the old maps because of their legacy, even though they might not have translated their 'features' which made them so loved from 1.6 -> CS:GO. The community and big tournaments should be more accepting on throwing in a different version of a map (like fixing Inferno Banana) or adding completely new ones. Obviously having a new map being played requires the big teams to make new tactics on them, I think it is more so the players stopping the new maps from showing up in the map pool rather then the modding community itself. Maybe an interesting topic to discuss on your next Podcast? Is CS growing boring with the same maps over and over. I'm still watching after 13 years so probably not BUT, why is there no much needed refreshment.
2013-03-05 20:35
Great podcasts, it is something that the community lacked. I wish there was someone playing devil's advocate more. I agreed on most things except the MVP thingy, I posted on the other topic why I voted for Nico. But I agree that if it was named "player, fan appreciated the most" would be more correct. Which in reality isn't a big deal.
2013-03-05 20:42
Sweden Vilseledd 
good show, keep doing it :]
2013-03-05 20:51
I love this show! It's perfect with cArn, Thooorin and lurppis. Hoping you will invite players to the show in the future that gets to answer questions from the three of you and from the public aswell. Good job!
2013-03-05 22:45
Great work on the cast.
2013-03-06 02:54
from what you guys laugh at the very beginning? :>
2013-03-06 11:51
Kpr > Mvp. K/d > Mvp. Most amount of frags (not including overtimes) > Mvp. My conclusion of this is either have the mvp vote but only ask the players because fanboys dont care who really was mvp. Most amount of frags (not including overtimes) in my opnion is the best way of saying who did best at the tournament.
2013-03-07 15:32
Login or register to add your comment to the discussion.